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Are far-right/white nationalist groups increasing or just getting more attention?

Are far-right/white nationalist groups increasing or just getting more attention?

  • Total voters
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  • Poll closed .
Captain Adverse said:
That response is known as a red herring couched in an appeal to emotion followed by a straw man.

This thread is about an issue of possible growth in far-right/white nationalist groups.

There are other threads in the Forum discussing the issue of that car attack, and no one has asked what you would do in similar circumstances.
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It's not a red herring at all. You're saying that white males are turning to white nationalism/white supremacy because liberals are mean to them. I say that they are responsible for their actions. Not someone else.
 
Captain Adverse said:
That response is known as a red herring couched in an appeal to emotion followed by a straw man.

This thread is about an issue of possible growth in far-right/white nationalist groups.

There are other threads in the Forum discussing the issue of that car attack, and no one has asked what you would do in similar circumstances.
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Can you blame her for citing a prominent, recent and shocking event?

Surely it caught your attention for a moment. It's hard to tell if we will face more cases of vehicular manslaughter in the future, or if activists will be too chilled to set foot in harm's way.

Donald Trump said that US citizens need to repair their bonds with one another. It starts with building trust, and I don't know how far trust is going to go when people are driving cars into other people.
 
bearpoker said:
It's not a red herring at all. You're saying that white males are turning to white nationalism/white supremacy because liberals are mean to them. I say that they are responsible for their actions. Not someone else.
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NO. :no:

That's another tactic people who have no argument use. Rephrasing something to change the discussion to their own narrative. Please read back to the original post and show where I said "white males are turning to white nationalism/white supremacy because liberals are mean to them."

I said nothing of the kind.

I said IMO it was just more coverage in the news making it seem they are growing. I also said I could not be sure though because there has been a lot of anti-white propaganda over the last ten years and that might motivate a reaction in some.

Celebrity said:
Can you blame her for citing a prominent, recent and shocking event?

Surely it caught your attention for a moment. It's hard to tell if we will face more cases of vehicular manslaughter in the future, or if activists will be too chilled to set foot in harm's way.

Donald Trump said that US citizens need to repair their bonds with one another. It starts with building trust, and I don't know how far trust is going to go when people are driving cars into other people.
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Yes, since that is not what this thread is about and clearly an attempt to divert from the issue I was addressing here.
 
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Captain Adverse said:
NO. :no:

That's another tactic people who have no argument use. Rephrasing something to change the discussion to their own narrative. Please read back to the original post and show where I said "white males are turning to white nationalism/white supremacy because liberals are mean to them."

I said nothing of the kind.

I said IMO it was just more coverage in the news making it seem they are growing. I also said I could not be sure though because there has been a lot of anti-white propaganda over the last ten years and that might motivate a reaction in some.
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IMO it's probably just more media attention.

However, I can't be sure because over the last decade there has been a lot of anti-white propaganda from the SJW side of the house.

Currently, according to the "inter-sectional alliance of American victims" the greatest enemy in the USA is the Heterosexual White Male.

That might go some ways towards aggravating that segment of our population.
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I took the last sentence to mean that white males might be joining these groups in response to the anti white propaganda. I think that's a reasonable interpretation of your post in the context of this thread. If you meant that they were just sitting around feeling irritated or posting websites, I suppose that's possible too.
 
bearpoker said:
I took the last sentence to mean that white males might be joining these groups in response to the anti white propaganda. I think that's a reasonable interpretation of your post in the context of this thread. If you meant that they were just sitting around feeling irritated or posting websites, I suppose that's possible too.
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(sigh) This is an assertion:

bearpoker said:
It's not a red herring at all. You're saying that white males are turning to white nationalism/white supremacy because liberals are mean to them. I say that they are responsible for their actions. Not someone else.
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All I said was all that anti-white male propaganda might have some effect. It might not. Meanwhile, I believe it is just the MSM blowing their activities out of proportion which gives the impression they are growing.
 
Celebrity said:
I had access to computers, the internet and other multimedia when I was younger. At the time, I noticed some of my peers did not partake in various forms of social media. The first thing a teen with limited access might see on Facebook, Youtube, or /b/ could be racist and inflammatory. The curious problem is how to organize constructive learning in this situation, and I think it is of great interest to white nationalists who would probably say that their children are being indoctrinated with racist and inflammatory rhetoric. I do not believe that our history has been tampered with, and I think the far right affiliates, Nazi sympathizers, etc. are trying to portray the history of the Republic through a divisive lens.

I do agree that some of the radicalization is backlash. It seems like we are caught between a pendulum which swings toward socialism, and toward fascism on the other extreme. At this point I don't know if democracy really is a point of 'equilibrium.'
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It does when society hasn't forgotten how to compromise, but apparently, ours has. We are so ideologically deadlocked that both sides refuse to come anywhere near the middle. The more the left pushes to the left, the more the right pushes farther to the right. And it isn't just the far right that's doing that, the far left is probably even worse. Everything is racist, everything is sexist, everything is homophobic, even if it isn't, but they're sure going to pretend it is because it fits their narrative. This has nothing at all to do with reality and everything to do with ideology.
 
Tigerace117 said:
Because celebrating a slaveocracy is wrong. Similarly, celebrating a Nazi or communist authoritarian regine is wrong.
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You apparently don't know the difference between celebrating and recognizing.
 
Cephus said:
You apparently don't know the difference between celebrating and recognizing.
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Apparently neither do the vast majority of the human race, because they treat the erection and maintenance of such statues as a a celebration of said regimes.
 
Captain Adverse said:
(sigh) This is an assertion:



All I said was all that anti-white male propaganda might have some effect. It might not. Meanwhile, I believe it is just the MSM blowing their activities out of proportion which gives the impression they are growing.
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https://www.splcenter.org/news/2017...secutive-year-trump-electrifies-radical-right

Unlike you, I do post supporting links. Is the Southern Poverty Law Center in on the evil liberal plot against white males? Your position on the OP seems to be that these groups are not growing, but if they are it might be the liberals fault.
 
Cephus said:
It does when society hasn't forgotten how to compromise, but apparently, ours has. We are so ideologically deadlocked that both sides refuse to come anywhere near the middle. The more the left pushes to the left, the more the right pushes farther to the right. And it isn't just the far right that's doing that, the far left is probably even worse. Everything is racist, everything is sexist, everything is homophobic, even if it isn't, but they're sure going to pretend it is because it fits their narrative. This has nothing at all to do with reality and everything to do with ideology.
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I refuse to believe that the majority of individuals in the far leftist arena are so stupid that they didn't anticipate a backlash, or are so ideologically entrenched that they refuse to let other people speak.

Everything is racist, so police shoot more black people. Everything is sexist, and whichever sex is the victim gets to moan the loudest. Everything isn't homophobic, as long as your workplace is diversified. The world is a pretty terrible place for immigrants, queer people, men and women, but I still don't see any silver lining for neo-Nazis.

I don't like the idea that the left has become infected by iconoclast trolls who serve the right. It's absolutely horrible. But it appears to be the case.

"Feminists" (and sometimes the leftists) claim that a woman should be able to do whatever she wants once she becomes pregnant. Not just with her own personal, medical decisions, but by subverting another person's life of her choice (usually a man). They claim that the father should have thought about his choices before having sex, kept his legs closed, and used contraception because of the inevitable consequence of childbirth. This is exactly what feminists were fighting to end 50 years ago. I can only conclude that people who make these arguments are trolls, like the neo-Nazi fascists who want to subvert democracy by imposing a radical ideology on innocent people.

I know that the status quo isn't perfect. I have my own ideas about the difference between compromise and parasitism. Some ideologies don't permit compromise, and the only good ideologies that can endure are the consistent ones. There is an amicable resolution to the problem in our country, and I see that the governor of Virginia is handling his business.
 
Celebrity said:
I refuse to believe that the majority of individuals in the far leftist arena are so stupid that they didn't anticipate a backlash, or are so ideologically entrenched that they refuse to let other people speak.
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Seriously, you're not paying attention then. The left does their level best to disinvite speakers, shut people up and call people names to discredit them. They're the ones on college campuses pulling fire alarms to shut down speakers they don't like. They're the ones throwing fits. They're the ones insisting white people can't come to school. This is the liberals. This is what they're like.

Everything is racist, so police shoot more black people. Everything is sexist, and whichever sex is the victim gets to moan the loudest. Everything isn't homophobic, as long as your workplace is diversified. The world is a pretty terrible place for immigrants, queer people, men and women, but I still don't see any silver lining for neo-Nazis.
Click to expand...

Blacks, like it or not, commit a vastly disproportionate number of violent crimes. They get shot because they've EARNED IT! They try to grab cops' guns. And of course, when you try to hold them accountable, you get called a racist. The fact is, the world isn't a terrible place, unless you live in the Middle East. The left are just spending all of their time whining and having absurdly unrealistic expectations.

I don't like the idea that the left has become infected by iconoclast trolls who serve the right. It's absolutely horrible. But it appears to be the case.
Click to expand...

The reason the left loses so badly is because of what the left has become. Everyone is sick of it. Because we have a two-party system, when the left loses, the right wins. That's just how it is. Maybe the left should stop being assholes.

"Feminists" (and sometimes the leftists) claim that a woman should be able to do whatever she wants once she becomes pregnant. Not just with her own personal, medical decisions, but by subverting another person's life of her choice (usually a man). They claim that the father should have thought about his choices before having sex, kept his legs closed, and used contraception because of the inevitable consequence of childbirth. This is exactly what feminists were fighting to end 50 years ago. I can only conclude that people who make these arguments are trolls, like the neo-Nazi fascists who want to subvert democracy by imposing a radical ideology on innocent people.
Click to expand...

Feminists, at least 3rd and 4th wave feminists, are overwhelmingly far left. And the left, in general, hates straight white men. Therefore, they do their level best to abuse same because it fits their narrative. 1st and 2nd wave feminism had something worth fighting for. They lost their way many years ago and they're going farther and farther down the ideological rabbit hole. It's why they're so laughable these days.

I know that the status quo isn't perfect. I have my own ideas about the difference between compromise and parasitism. Some ideologies don't permit compromise, and the only good ideologies that can endure are the consistent ones. There is an amicable resolution to the problem in our country, and I see that the governor of Virginia is handling his business.
Click to expand...

It's why, if you pay attention, you see the left consistently eating their own in the futile pursuit of virtue signalling. Anyone who isn't perfect gets thrown to the sharks and eventually, they all wind up losing. There is no amicable resolution if either side is inherently incapable of compromising at all. But when you've got an oppression stack to chase, when you're pretending everyone is a victim and nobody has any personal responsibility, you get what we have right now. There are no innocent parties here, but I think the left is the most dramatically guilty.
 
Cephus said:
I find the whole idea to be absurd. Those monuments represent history. You can't retroactively change history because it makes you uncomfortable. I don't care if the south wants to have Confederacy monuments up, I don't care if they want to fly the Confederate flag, it doesn't really matter. People need to grow the hell up and deal with reality instead of pretending they can just eliminate anything they don't like.
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In your personal opinion, what IS too far? What is a legit issue for people to get upset about? Where's the line?
 
radcen said:
In your personal opinion, what IS too far? What is a legit issue for people to get upset about? Where's the line?
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Something that happened 150 years ago is not a legit issue to get upset about. Let's try to have some historical perspective. Nobody cared until relatively recently.
 
Fishking said:
Can't decide. With the advent of the internet it is easier for small groups to organize and seem larger than they actually are. However, I think there is some growth in maybe something tangentially related to white nationalism or perhaps greater sympathy due to the actions of the left which have been on constant attack of white people.

You tell an entire group that they are racist, simply for their skin color or that they didn't earn what they have and you're going to raise tensions and frustrations.

Finally, what the left includes as white nationalists is ever expanding to basically include everyone who disagrees with their ideology. Everything you say is code for racism. States' rights is racism. Small government is racism. If you don't get out there and march with Black Lives Matters then you're a racist. Don't support progressive taxation, racist.

And then you've had an increase in violence and property damage from the leftist going for over a year now. Yeah...there's gonna be some kind of backlash to that. White nationalism/supremacy? Maybe it's just frustration hitting the tipping point of normal people who've done nothing but are being targeted none-the-less.
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Ahh, and the "libertarian" chimes in with his usual partisan rant blaming the left for everything (victim mentality), while at the same time criticizing the left for their "victim mentality".
 
Cephus said:
I don't think there are more white nationalists out there than there ever were, I think they are getting more organized, specifically in response to far-left groups like Black Lives Matter and Antifa. When things go absurdly to the left, there is going to be push back.
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I'm curious, but what is "far left" about black lives matter?
 
Cephus said:
Seriously, you're not paying attention then. The left does their level best to disinvite speakers, shut people up and call people names to discredit them. They're the ones on college campuses pulling fire alarms to shut down speakers they don't like. They're the ones throwing fits. They're the ones insisting white people can't come to school. This is the liberals. This is what they're like.



Blacks, like it or not, commit a vastly disproportionate number of violent crimes. They get shot because they've EARNED IT! They try to grab cops' guns. And of course, when you try to hold them accountable, you get called a racist. The fact is, the world isn't a terrible place, unless you live in the Middle East. The left are just spending all of their time whining and having absurdly unrealistic expectations.



The reason the left loses so badly is because of what the left has become. Everyone is sick of it. Because we have a two-party system, when the left loses, the right wins. That's just how it is. Maybe the left should stop being assholes.



Feminists, at least 3rd and 4th wave feminists, are overwhelmingly far left. And the left, in general, hates straight white men. Therefore, they do their level best to abuse same because it fits their narrative. 1st and 2nd wave feminism had something worth fighting for. They lost their way many years ago and they're going farther and farther down the ideological rabbit hole. It's why they're so laughable these days.



It's why, if you pay attention, you see the left consistently eating their own in the futile pursuit of virtue signalling. Anyone who isn't perfect gets thrown to the sharks and eventually, they all wind up losing. There is no amicable resolution if either side is inherently incapable of compromising at all. But when you've got an oppression stack to chase, when you're pretending everyone is a victim and nobody has any personal responsibility, you get what we have right now. There are no innocent parties here, but I think the left is the most dramatically guilty.
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Prove it. And who is "the left" in general? The left has a large variety of people.

I understand your desperate attempt to blame the actions of Trump voting far right wingers on the left, but be more specific when your spewing Breitbart talking points.
 
In about 50 years after massive demographic change hits full force and reduces the non-Hispanic White population of the USA to a minority White nationalist groups will fade out of existence.

Wait and see.

:lol:

How many groups with no living members have any power on this planet?
 
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Cephus said:
I don't think there are more white nationalists out there than there ever were, I think they are getting more organized, specifically in response to far-left groups like Black Lives Matter and Antifa. When things go absurdly to the left, there is going to be push back.
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Excellent answer.
 
They are becoming more active, emboldened by the presence of a racist nazi cell in the West Wing.
 
radcen said:
Are far-right/white nationalist groups increasing or just getting more attention?
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More B than A, but ultimately both.

I think the increased amount of coverage and attention they're getting is larger than the increasing "membership" of sorts, but both are definitely happening.

I think membership and/or sympathizers across most fringe or next groups or interests are, in general, increasing as a natural result of social media making it far easier to find like minded people, and for view points that were previously so ostracized that one inherently tended to keep it to themselves it's allowed faux-normalization to happen as anyone can find an echo chamber for any mentality now.

I also think that when one group begins to rise, the anti-thesis to that group tends to see a small temporary bump as well. It's the nature of antagonism as well as counter culture. As the increase in "social justice" becomes more prevalent and the norm within society, especially within the younger generations, it creates an atmosphere where the push back against that...either by folks that feel targeted by it or by those that simply seek to be outside the mainstream for a variety of reasons...is going to attract more people than it may've done on it's own before.
 
radcen said:
Are far-right/white nationalist groups increasing or just getting more attention?

Every so often I've seen stories about far right/white nationalist groups for decades. But, for the most part it was an oddity here and there, and they were pretty much ignored otherwise. Now we're seeing them in the news more, but is the increased coverage an accurate representation of increased activity?

Hence the question.
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Clearly not hiding your bias.

I see the first option is filled with people who don't know history. Show how the KKK is as big or bigger than ever, for one. :coffeepap
 
Glowpun said:
The alt-right is part of Trump's group. Steve Bannon is from the alt-right. Why do you suppose you will never hear out of Trump's mouth any condemnation of their terrorism?

Foreigners are telling you people that Trump's election will be a dark blot on your history. But it seems you all prefer to put your heads in the sand.
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that's silly. We get it you are upset Trump won.
 
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