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Do you support the COINS Act?

Do you support the COINS Act?

  • Total voters
    30
Carjosse

Carjosse

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I just remembered reading this story on Reddit a few days ago, Senator John McCain (R-AZ) and Mike Enzi (R-WY), Senate Budget Committee Chairman proposed the COINS Act or Currency Optimization, Innovation, and National Savings Act of 2017.

McCain's website sums up the bill as:
Legislation that would modernize our currency by moving to a $1 dollar coin, reduce the cost of nickel production and suspend the minting of the penny, which currently costs more than one cent to produce. These money-saving reforms, which have been studied and supported by the non-partisan Government Accountability Office, could generate up to $16 billion in taxpayer savings.
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Which I think is a great idea, if only they included colour coding your bills as well. I will also give them points for the great acronym. This will make creating currency both cheaper and will be more efficient for the consumer. Modernization will be good for US currency. We shall see if the zinc lobby will try and put a stop to this (yes it actually exists). So what do you guys think?
 
Carjosse said:
I just remembered reading this story on Reddit a few days ago, Senator John McCain (R-AZ) and Mike Enzi (R-WY), Senate Budget Committee Chairman proposed the COINS Act or Currency Optimization, Innovation, and National Savings Act of 2017.

McCain's website sums up the bill as:


Which I think is a great idea, if only they included colour coding your bills as well. I will also give them points for the great acronym. This will make creating currency both cheaper and will be more efficient for the consumer. Modernization will be good for US currency. We shall see if the zinc lobby will try and put a stop to this (yes it actually exists). So what do you guys think?
Click to expand...

Don't really care either way to be honest.
I rarely use cash, like maybe once or twice a year.
 
A good idea, but I'd like them to produce a $2 coin also.
 
Carjosse said:
I just remembered reading this story on Reddit a few days ago, Senator John McCain (R-AZ) and Mike Enzi (R-WY), Senate Budget Committee Chairman proposed the COINS Act or Currency Optimization, Innovation, and National Savings Act of 2017.

McCain's website sums up the bill as:


Which I think is a great idea, if only they included colour coding your bills as well. I will also give them points for the great acronym. This will make creating currency both cheaper and will be more efficient for the consumer. Modernization will be good for US currency. We shall see if the zinc lobby will try and put a stop to this (yes it actually exists). So what do you guys think?
Click to expand...

I suppose if people want to pay more for goods, and pay more in sales taxes, they will support this plan.

Until the economy improves for more working age citizens, it's probably not a good idea to make living more expensive for lower income workers, and struggling families.

Of course, IMO, anything that moves towards a cashless society is not a good thing.
 
LowDown said:
A good idea, but I'd like them to produce a $2 coin also.
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Don't get too ahead of yourself. I think that will have to come in a later bill, most likely one that will also have to introduce polymer notes.
 
ocean515 said:
I suppose if people want to pay more for goods, and pay more in sales taxes, they will support this plan.

Until the economy improves for more working age citizens, it's probably not a good idea to make living more expensive for lower income workers, and struggling families.
Click to expand...

How would this cause people to pay more for goods, or pay more in sales taxes? Also what is wrong with a cashless society?
 
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Carjosse said:
Don't get too ahead of yourself. I think that will have to come in a later bill, most likely one that will also have to introduce polymer notes.
Click to expand...

I was thinking plastic or ceramic coins.
 
LowDown said:
I was thinking plastic or ceramic coins.
Click to expand...

I think plastic coins would be too light and ceramic coins would probably be too heavy and both would probably be too fragile.
 
Carjosse said:
How would this cause people to pay more for goods, or pay more in sales taxes?
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If there are no pennies, how does a business collect sales tax? Round down, or round up? Here in California, depending on the city or county one lives in, they are constantly adding a 1/4% here, and a 1/2% there to sales taxes. In one part of LA County the sales tax rate might be 8.75%. Across town, it's 9.75%.

So if there are no pennies, everything will have to round to the nearest nickel. That either means the cost of a product is going to go up, or the collected tax is going to go up. I can't see them rounding down. I would guess a retailer couldn't collect more in taxes that authorized, so the cost of a good will go up in order for the final price to be divisible by 5 cents.
 
ocean515 said:
If there are no pennies, how does a business collect sales tax? Round down, or round up? Here in California, depending on the city or county one lives in, they are constantly adding a 1/4% here, and a 1/2% there to sales taxes. In one part of LA County the sales tax rate might be 8.75%. Across town, it's 9.75%.

So if there are no pennies, everything will have to round to the nearest nickel. That either means the cost of a product is going to go up, or the collected tax is going to go up. I can't see them rounding down. I would guess a retailer couldn't collect more in taxes that authorized, so the cost of a good will go up in order for the final price to be divisible by 5 cents.
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You do realize that already happens with fractions of a cent and yes it does round down
 
ocean515 said:
I suppose if people want to pay more for goods, and pay more in sales taxes, they will support this plan.

Until the economy improves for more working age citizens, it's probably not a good idea to make living more expensive for lower income workers, and struggling families.

Of course, IMO, anything that moves towards a cashless society is not a good thing.
Click to expand...

How does this act do either of the things you state?

This act does not change the value of money nor its distribution. It streamlines the money system already in place. When inflation so reduces the value of a coin that it takes a bucket load to buy a loaf of bread, time for it to go away. Especially if it costs more to produce than its value. The creators of the system recognized this and never bothered to manufacture our lowest legal designation.
 
ocean515 said:
If there are no pennies, how does a business collect sales tax? Round down, or round up? Here in California, depending on the city or county one lives in, they are constantly adding a 1/4% here, and a 1/2% there to sales taxes. In one part of LA County the sales tax rate might be 8.75%. Across town, it's 9.75%.

So if there are no pennies, everything will have to round to the nearest nickel. That either means the cost of a product is going to go up, or the collected tax is going to go up. I can't see them rounding down. I would guess a retailer couldn't collect more in taxes that authorized, so the cost of a good will go up in order for the final price to be divisible by 5 cents.
Click to expand...

Well here the rounding only applies to the total, not each individual item, it also does not happen if you pay by digital means, like most people tend to do. If you buy two items that round up, the total will round down. All in all it leads to only a few cents here and there. Nothing that will have a real effect. Say for example someone goes to the grocery once a week, and they always have to round their total up, 0.02*52 = 1.04 so in other words at most someone buying groceries every week will lose $1.04, over a year. But more likely sometimes they will round up or round down depending on the total. And that is only if they pay cash. The sales tax is just negligible because 0.0875* 0.02 = 0.00175 or 0.1 cents. So sales tax is not effected in any way.
 
Crovax said:
You do realize that already happens with fractions of a cent and yes it does round down
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Ban the penny and it's no longer fractions of a cent. Multiply that couple of cents by every transaction that take place day in and day out, and the dollars would be massive.
 
jimbo said:
How does this act do either of the things you state?

This act does not change the value of money nor its distribution. It streamlines the money system already in place. When inflation so reduces the value of a coin that it takes a bucket load to buy a loaf of bread, time for it to go away. Especially if it costs more to produce than its value. The creators of the system recognized this and never bothered to manufacture our lowest legal designation.
Click to expand...

See post #11.
 
Carjosse said:
Well here the rounding only applies to the total, not each individual item, it also does not happen if you pay by digital means, like most people tend to do. If you buy two items that round up, the total will round down. All in all it leads to only a few cents here and there. Nothing that will have a real effect. Say for example someone goes to the grocery once a week, and they always have to round their total up, 0.02*52 = 1.04 so in other words at most someone buying groceries every week will lose $1.04, over a year. But more likely sometimes they will round up or round down depending on the total. And that is only if they pay cash. The sales tax is just negligible because 0.0875* 0.02 = 0.00175 or 0.1 cents. So sales tax is not effected in any way.
Click to expand...

The laws of incrementalism are just as valid by the penny as they are by anything else. This, "no big deal" approach is how the liberal/socialist progressives have raised sales taxes over the years.

It might be 1/4% for some special interest project for X number of years, and then that gets made permanent before the X number of years is up. Then they add 1/2% on some other issue. And on and on it goes.
 
Carjosse said:
I just remembered reading this story on Reddit a few days ago, Senator John McCain (R-AZ) and Mike Enzi (R-WY), Senate Budget Committee Chairman proposed the COINS Act or Currency Optimization, Innovation, and National Savings Act of 2017.

McCain's website sums up the bill as:


Which I think is a great idea, if only they included colour coding your bills as well. I will also give them points for the great acronym. This will make creating currency both cheaper and will be more efficient for the consumer. Modernization will be good for US currency. We shall see if the zinc lobby will try and put a stop to this (yes it actually exists). So what do you guys think?
Click to expand...

I always like the idea of a dollar coin. A two-nie might be taking it too far.
 
ocean515 said:
Ban the penny and it's no longer fractions of a cent. Multiply that couple of cents by every transaction that take place day in and day out, and the dollars would be massive.
Click to expand...

It evens out. If the cash register says $1.02, you pay a buck- if it's $1.03, you pay a buck and a nickel. Except plastic. Debit and credit uses the actual price. Nice not having those pennies in your pocket, or Mason jars full of them waiting to be toted to the bank.
 
ocean515 said:
The laws of incrementalism are just as valid by the penny as they are by anything else. This, "no big deal" approach is how the liberal/socialist progressives have raised sales taxes over the years.

It might be 1/4% for some special interest project for X number of years, and then that gets made permanent before the X number of years is up. Then they add 1/2% on some other issue. And on and on it goes.
Click to expand...

Except this really is negligible, because a cent or fractions of a cent are meaningless. I am not exaggerating either, one cent or two cents here and there is meaningless to consumers and businesses. Other countries have had this for years now and business have not noticed their revenues changing in any noticeable or meaningful way and neither has the government in sales tax revenue. This is necessary because the penny has become useless and an expensive burden for production. Should the US have not phased out the half-penny when it stopped being useful?
 
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Carjosse said:
How would this cause people to pay more for goods, or pay more in sales taxes? Also what is wrong with a cashless society?
Click to expand...

The fact you even ask this question is terrifying.

two things that immediately come to mind are that the government can track all transactions made in a society with only electronic payment, and that people are proven to subconciously spend more money when not using physical exchange medium, and when using electronic payment are less likely to haggle or look for deals.

also if the government can track all your purchases it is easier to see if you're paying use tax on items bought out of state or second hand.
 
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