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Which of the following hypothetical public employees should be fired?

Select all that apply

  • A clerk that refuses to issue a marriage license to a same sex couple because they are a Christian.

    Votes: 50 92.6%

  • A clerk that refuses to issue a permit to a slaughterhouse because they are a Buddhist.

    Votes: 50 92.6%

  • A clerk that refuses to issue a liquor license because they are a Muslim.

    Votes: 52 96.3%

  • A clerk that refuses to issue a drilling permit because they are a wiccan.

    Votes: 49 90.7%
  • Total voters
    54
tres borrachos said:
Where did this happen? Have a link to show me where a Muslim got at job with the Alcohol Beverage Board and where he is refusing to give out liquor licenses?
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I have no idea whether its happened or not. I find it amazing that we have public employees that are saying they are going to refuse to issue marriage licenses to same sex couples despite the fact those couples can be legally married. I merely gave the Muslim refusing to issue Liquor License example to point out the shear absurdity of it.
 
roguenuke said:
Actually, no. Federal and state laws actually do have some say in whether or not certain employees can refuse to give you certain licenses or government paperwork based on your race, religion, sex, etc.

What is to prevent a state employee from refusing to issue a birth certificate to a same sex couple for their child?
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In fact, what's to stop an entire state office from refusing to do so, we are seeing it in some places in the south where it isn't just an employee who is refusing, it's everyone. Then what?
 
tres borrachos said:
Will you stop with these idiotic posts that are quoting me? You're babbling about Sundays and weekends and people getting religious after they are hired and going to church. You are so off topic it's painful. Stop quoting me.
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Please stop posting then. Anything you say is fair game. Don't like it, don't give them anything to quote.
 
Cephus said:
Please stop posting then. Anything you say is fair game. Don't like it, don't give them anything to quote.
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True, I can't help it if people post stupid things because they don't understand simple posts.
 
tres borrachos said:
True, I can't help it if people post stupid things because they don't understand simple posts.
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Nor can others help it if you post stupid things they have to respond to. Ordering others to stop quoting you is, however, absurd.
 
tres borrachos said:
None of the above if there is someone else who can cover for him/her. If he/she is the ultimate decision maker than I think he/she should be removed or transferred.

I have 10 people who work for me and there have been times and different reasons that they can't/won't work with a customer. I get someone else to cover. It isn't a big deal.
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Are you the manager of a government organization, department, etc?

The difference is all the above are government functions.

If you work for the government, you provide the services of which you are required, regardless of your personal religious beliefs.

Your religion is between you and your deity......You have no right to force others to behave in a manner you see fit due to them.
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
I have no idea whether its happened or not. I find it amazing that we have public employees that are saying they are going to refuse to issue marriage licenses to same sex couples despite the fact those couples can be legally married. I merely gave the Muslim refusing to issue Liquor License example to point out the shear absurdity of it.
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So then the entire thread could have simply said this:

Do you think someone should get concessions at work for religious views or not?
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
I have no idea whether its happened or not. I find it amazing that we have public employees that are saying they are going to refuse to issue marriage licenses to same sex couples despite the fact those couples can be legally married. I merely gave the Muslim refusing to issue Liquor License example to point out the shear absurdity of it.
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I want to be clear that I haven't been following this whole SSM issue much. I know the Supremes made a ruling on the issue recently, but I wasn't aware that any public employees have said they are going to do what you say they will.

Do you have a link to some news article or something that can give me more info?
 
Caine said:
Are you the manager of a government organization, department, etc?

The difference is all the above are government functions.

If you work for the government, you provide the services of which you are required, regardless of your personal religious beliefs.

Your religion is between you and your deity......You have no right to force others to behave in a manner you see fit due to them.
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No, just a senior manager in a company with over 30,000 worldwide employees, and someone who doesn't detest people with religious beliefs. If I worked for a government agency and I had a great employee I'd probably do the same thing. I'm one of those non-compassionate conservative types.
 
tres borrachos said:
No, just a senior manager in a company with over 30,000 worldwide employees, and someone who doesn't detest people with religious beliefs. If I worked for a government agency and I had a great employee I'd probably do the same thing. I'm one of those non-compassionate conservative types.
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And I have no problem with that either..

However, I do have a problem with people working for the government and bringing their religion into government service, where it does not belong.

Which is why, I am probably NOT going to vote at all in the Presidential election that is upcoming. I disagree with all the Democrats and all the republicans are right ready to Preside over our government using their own personal religious beliefs and holding the rest of us to them.
 
Caine said:
And I have no problem with that either..

However, I do have a problem with people working for the government and bringing their religion into government service, where it does not belong.

Which is why, I am probably NOT going to vote at all in the Presidential election that is upcoming. I disagree with all the Democrats and all the republicans are right ready to Preside over our government using their own personal religious beliefs and holding the rest of us to them.
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You need to look at George Pataki, who I believe I am voting for in the NH primary. He is as non-religious as I am. I don't know where you live so he may not even make it to your state's primary.
 
tres borrachos said:
No, just a senior manager in a company with over 30,000 worldwide employees, and someone who doesn't detest people with religious beliefs. If I worked for a government agency and I had a great employee I'd probably do the same thing. I'm one of those non-compassionate conservative types.
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No one here has shown that they detest people with religious beliefs. Most of us have religious beliefs. The difference is that we don't expect others to cater to our religious beliefs above all else. This is even more true when it is a government job the person holds.
 
The "public employee" who devised this inane poll !
Try again, be more honest and try to achieve something positive .
 
Mycroft said:
I want to be clear that I haven't been following this whole SSM issue much. I know the Supremes made a ruling on the issue recently, but I wasn't aware that any public employees have said they are going to do what you say they will.

Do you have a link to some news article or something that can give me more info?
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Kentucky clerks object to ruling, halt marriage licenses - AP News 6/29/2015 2:51 PM

http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/ted-cruz...denying-marriage-licenses-gays-and-lesbians-0
 
tres borrachos said:
No, just a senior manager in a company with over 30,000 worldwide employees, and someone who doesn't detest people with religious beliefs. If I worked for a government agency and I had a great employee I'd probably do the same thing. I'm one of those non-compassionate conservative types.
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I don't detest people for their religious beliefs. Most of my friends are religious to some degree or another. I do however believe that a public employee must not discriminate in their job regardless of their own personal beliefs and if they cannot do that, they need to find another profession.
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
Kentucky clerks object to ruling, halt marriage licenses - AP News 6/29/2015 2:51 PM

Ted Cruz backs county clerks denying marriage licenses to gay couples | MSNBC
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Thanks. I honestly wasn't aware that this was going on.

Those clerks in Kentucky are making three mistakes, in my opinion. They are denying same-sex couples the ability to be married and they are punishing opposite-sex couples by not issuing them licenses, as well. Since they are citing religious grounds for their action, that makes them hypocrites. They are also not doing their job.

Cruz is just plain wrong.

Religious viewpoints have no place in a public office and public employees who cannot separate their religious views from the job they hold, need to resign...or be fired.
 
Mycroft said:
Thanks. I honestly wasn't aware that this was going on.

Those clerks in Kentucky are making three mistakes, in my opinion. They are denying same-sex couples the ability to be married and they are punishing opposite-sex couples by not issuing them licenses, as well. Since they are citing religious grounds for their action, that makes them hypocrites. They are also not doing their job.

Cruz is just plain wrong.

Religious viewpoints have no place in a public office and public employees who cannot separate their religious views from the job they hold, need to resign...or be fired.
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So a POTUS who claims to be "on a mission from God" needs to resign or be impeached?
 
DifferentDrummr said:
So a POTUS who claims to be "on a mission from God" needs to resign or be impeached?
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You'd get no argument from me that he didn't deserve to be in office. You probably couldn't impeach him, he has to actually break the law to be impeached, but anyone who says their imaginary friend tells them what to do has no business being elected in the first place.
 
roguenuke said:
No, an adulterer can be someone who is legally divorced but viewed as still married in the eyes of certain religious people or even whole religions.

BIBLE VERSES ABOUT ADULTERY AND DIVORCE

Matthew 19:9 - And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except [it be] for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.

You don't think there are Christians out there that take this verse seriously to mean that it doesn't matter if they get legally divorced, unless the Church approves an annulment, they are still married, and therefore committing adultery if they get married to someone else?

It's pretty easy to see how some people would consider it adultery even if there was a legal divorce.
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Catholics are that way - they aren't supposed to remarry. The Pope has to approve an annulment for someone to remarry. My parents religion also is that way, but is much more strict. If two people are married, and one walks away, the other has to stay single for the rest of their life, until the spouse who left dies. That's the only way people in that religion can remarry. Personally I think it's a little much. My brother used to be in that religion, was married to a great girl for 20 years, who was also in that religion. They had 2 kids, a successful business, etc. Then he decided to leave her for his secretary. He walks away from the religion, the family, everything. He now can do whatever he wants, but his ex-wife is stuck being single for the rest of her life, if she follows her religion. She's young, too. 40 and very pretty. I feel sorry for her.
 
Superfly said:
Catholics are that way - they aren't supposed to remarry. The Pope has to approve an annulment for someone to remarry. My parents religion also is that way, but is much more strict. If two people are married, and one walks away, the other has to stay single for the rest of their life, until the spouse who left dies. That's the only way people in that religion can remarry. Personally I think it's a little much. My brother used to be in that religion, was married to a great girl for 20 years, who was also in that religion. They had 2 kids, a successful business, etc. Then he decided to leave her for his secretary. He walks away from the religion, the family, everything. He now can do whatever he wants, but his ex-wife is stuck being single for the rest of her life, if she follows her religion. She's young, too. 40 and very pretty. I feel sorry for her.
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There's a solution for that though. She can just realize what an idiotic religion it is and walk away too.
 
Cephus said:
There's a solution for that though. She can just realize what an idiotic religion it is and walk away too.
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That's her choice. Not yours. Nobody is telling you how to live your life, so you don't get to tell her how to live hers. :shrug:

I admire her discipline. I couldn't (or wouldn't) do it because I don't believe the way she does. But I give her props for living the way she has for as long as she has. She has faced a lot of adversity over the last 5 years or so, and she still hasn't given up.
 
Superfly said:
That's her choice. Not yours. Nobody is telling you how to live your life, so you don't get to tell her how to live hers. :shrug:

I admire her discipline. I couldn't (or wouldn't) do it because I don't believe the way she does. But I give her props for living the way she has for as long as she has. She has faced a lot of adversity over the last 5 years or so, and she still hasn't given up.
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I didn't say anything of the sort, I presented it as an option. You sit there and say you feel so sorry for her when the power to avoid this awful fate is in her own hands, then you get mad at me for pointing it out. Stop being so super-sensitive.
 
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Cephus said:
I didn't say anything of the sort, I presented it as an option. You sit there and say you feel so sorry for her when the power to avoid this awful fate is in her own hands, then you get mad at me for pointing it out. Stop being so super-sensitive.
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Or maybe you could stop being so insensitive. It's her faith and it's been with her for 40 years. You aren't a person of faith, so I know that you don't understand, but someone who has had this way of life their entire life can't (or won't) walk away from it anymore than one could expect you to wake up one morning and decide to become a God-fearing Christian.

And I didn't get mad at you. :lol:
 
Superfly said:
Catholics are that way - they aren't supposed to remarry. The Pope has to approve an annulment for someone to remarry. My parents religion also is that way, but is much more strict. If two people are married, and one walks away, the other has to stay single for the rest of their life, until the spouse who left dies. That's the only way people in that religion can remarry. Personally I think it's a little much. My brother used to be in that religion, was married to a great girl for 20 years, who was also in that religion. They had 2 kids, a successful business, etc. Then he decided to leave her for his secretary. He walks away from the religion, the family, everything. He now can do whatever he wants, but his ex-wife is stuck being single for the rest of her life, if she follows her religion. She's young, too. 40 and very pretty. I feel sorry for her.
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That is the paradox of the Roman Church argument. They insist the marriage is intact despite decades of separation while ignoring the other "sin" of living together in civic union.

It has been taught that the Romans base that no remarry clause on "what I have brought together, let no man put asunder". They assume that because THEY performed a ceremony He was in it. From personal experience I have to ask how that can be, as Jesus was also clear no one will stand between and his sheep....in other words he ended "divine clergy", that and the fact the guy who performed my first marriage was as drunk as a skunk
 
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