View Poll Results: Should the Confederate Flag be abolished?

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  • Yes

    55 29.57%
  • No

    131 70.43%
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Thread: Confederate Flag[W:1518,2230, 2241]

  1. #261
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    Re: Confederate Flag

    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    The American Flag represents all of that too, as does the Union Jack of England, the Aussie flag and Southern State Flags... so?
    But only the CF was carried on a battlefield in a fight against the USA for the express purpose of preserving slavery.

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    Re: Confederate Flag

    Quote Originally Posted by Glen Contrarian View Post
    That's a great example of a false equivalency. The Confederacy held as immutable divine law that blacks were not equal to whites, somehow less than human...and the Nazis held as immutable law that Jews (and other minorities and disabled people) were not equal to Aryans, somehow less than human. The only real difference is that while the Confederates saw blacks as property and enslaved them from cradle to grave (and could rape or kill them with legal impunity), the Nazis not only enslaved the 'lesser races' but also killed them en masse.

    So...no, this is not a case of a violation of Godwin's Law - it's simply pointing out that what the Confederacy was doing was in fact a heck of a lot closer to life under the Nazis than in the abolitionist Union states.
    ...and what does any of that have to do with getting rid of the Confederate Flag?

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    Re: Confederate Flag

    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    But only the CF was carried on a battlefield in a fight against the USA for the express purpose of preserving slavery.
    The point was that they all represented slavery, racism, etc.

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    Re: Confederate Flag

    Quote Originally Posted by Removable Mind View Post
    Ello, Mate...from Byron Bay, Australia.

    Bod, you're right. The American Flag flew for a long time when slavery was not only legal, but was the reason so many people like Washington and Jefferson were able to grow their wealth as they did. Washington was worth $500 Million (in today's money) and Jefferson somewhere about $200 Million. Jefferson not only used slaves for labor, but bred and sold slaves.

    Until the Civil Right Act 1964 - blacks were still almost slaves. They were free - but with very limited means.
    Quote Originally Posted by bicycleman View Post
    Don't fret, the American flag will be next, replaced by the Red Army hammer and sickle.
    And why would that happen? Do you find my post to be historically wrong...or offensive? If so, how?

    "We risk being the first people in history to have been able to make their illusions so vivid, so persuasive, so realistic that they can live in them." ~~~ Daniel J. Boorstin

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    Re: Confederate Flag

    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    The point was that they all represented slavery, racism, etc.
    But only one was carried in the fight to preserve it.

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    Re: Confederate Flag

    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    ...and what does any of that have to do with getting rid of the Confederate Flag?
    What would you think of, say, Idaho deciding to fly the Nazi flag at their state capitol? This is how we should be seeing any Confederate flag flown on state property.

    If someone just wants to fly the stars and bars just because he's a wannabe Johnnie Reb, that's a first-amendment right, as is a skinhead's right to fly the Nazi flag. But on taxpayer-funded state property, the flag of what was by definition a treasonous rebellion against America does not belong.
    To do evil, a human being must first of all believe that what hes doing is good" - Solzhenitsyn

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  7. #267
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    Re: Confederate Flag

    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    But only one was carried in the fight to preserve it.
    Indeed.

    The Confederate battle flag was pretty much put in the closet for many decades after the Civil War. A small resurgence came about in the late 1800's and early 1900's -- when the Jim Crow laws, literacy tests, state mandated segregation - and basically full stomping on the Civil Rights of blacks in the South came about.

    That short bit of time after the 15th Amendment blacks were allowed to vote, and it was Federally enforced - was gone.

    For example, have a glaring look at raw disenfranchisement of the black population circa early 1890's, Mississippi -

    In 1867, Miss., African Americans made up 56% of all Registered voters. (~66,000)

    In 1890, they made up 25%

    In 1892, they made up only 3%.


    By 1900 ---> 0.4%



    Source: Struggle for Mastery: Disfranchisement in the South, 1888-1908 (Fred W. Morrison Series in Southern Studies)

    http://books.google.com/books?id=b8z...ssippi&f=false

    Look at the other states as well. Pretty amazing.

    At this same time, a resurfacing of Confederate "nobility" came about, and United Confederate Veterans, the United Daughters of the Confederacy set about to rewriting the history of the War.

    They started portraying the CSA as being about things like the tariffs, and States' Rights, and tried to whitewash the slavery aspect out of it altogether - and to the extent slavery existed, it was a benevolent kind, with gentle Mammies, generous, loving slaveowners, and happy happy slaves.

    They did this to justify Jim Crow and the White Supremacy that brought out KKK and other paramilitary organizations that were terrorizing and intimidating the hell out of the the blacks at that time.

    The Confederate Flag saw it's full resurgence during the Dixiecrat era, and later, when men came home from WWII, and tried to reintegrate into the South -- and roundabout the same time Civil Rights activists started pushing for equality.

    That flag was trotted out in abundance then - and it's purpose was to intimidate and reinforce boldly : White Supremacy Reigns.

    It's not about "bringing back slavery" as I've heard some people strawman -- It's long been a symbol of White Supremacy, and has been used as such for a long time.

    Do some yokels just fly it because they are ignorant of this? Sure. Doesn't make them any less ignorant.

  8. #268
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    Re: Confederate Flag

    Quote Originally Posted by celticwar17 View Post
    It was the battle flag of the soldiers... had nothing to do with slavery
    Semantics. The soldiers fought to preserve slavery, and the flag represented the soldiers. It represents what the soldiers fought for.
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  9. #269
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    Re: Confederate Flag

    Quote Originally Posted by Paperview View Post
    Indeed.

    The Confederate battle flag was pretty much put in the closet for many decades after the Civil War. A small resurgence came about in the late 1800's and early 1900's -- when the Jim Crow laws, literacy tests, state mandated segregation - and basically full stomping on the Civil Rights of blacks in the South came about.

    That short bit of time after the 15th Amendment blacks were allowed to vote, and it was Federally enforced - was gone.

    For example, have a glaring look at raw disenfranchisement of the black population circa early 1890's, Mississippi -

    In 1867, Miss., African Americans made up 56% of all Registered voters. (~66,000)

    In 1890, they made up 25%

    In 1892, they made up only 3%.


    By 1900 ---> 0.4%



    Source: Struggle for Mastery: Disfranchisement in the South, 1888-1908 (Fred W. Morrison Series in Southern Studies)

    http://books.google.com/books?id=b8z...ssippi&f=false

    Look at the other states as well. Pretty amazing.

    At this same time, a resurfacing of Confederate "nobility" came about, and United Confederate Veterans, the United Daughters of the Confederacy set about to rewriting the history of the War.

    They started portraying the CSA as being about things like the tariffs, and States' Rights, and tried to whitewash the slavery aspect out of it altogether - and to the extent slavery existed, it was a benevolent kind, with gentle Mammies, generous, loving slaveowners, and happy happy slaves.

    They did this to justify Jim Crow and the White Supremacy that brought out KKK and other paramilitary organizations that were terrorizing and intimidating the hell out of the the blacks at that time.

    The Confederate Flag saw it's full resurgence during the Dixiecrat era, and later, when men came home from WWII, and tried to reintegrate into the South -- and roundabout the same time Civil Rights activists started pushing for equality.

    That flag was trotted out in abundance then - and it's purpose was to intimidate and reinforce boldly : White Supremacy Reigns.

    It's not about "bringing back slavery" as I've heard some people strawman -- It's long been a symbol of White Supremacy, and has been used as such for a long time.

    Do some yokels just fly it because they are ignorant of this? Sure. Doesn't make them any less ignorant.
    Excellent explanation.

  10. #270
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    Re: Confederate Flag

    Quote Originally Posted by shrubnose View Post
    How did a 2000 year old half Jewish zombie get a Mexican name?

    Fill us in.

    ...and why is the J pronounced like an H ?

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