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Are "Suburban American Women" Conservative or Liberal Voters?[W:29]

Are "Suburban American Women" Conservative or Liberal Voters?


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Re: Are "Suburban American Women" Conservative or Liberal Voters?

Who stole your money? You choose to live here. You choose to work here. And you agree to pay taxes. To quote an endless stream of right wingers, if you don't like you don't have to stay.

You chose to go through Sherwood Forest ...

I follow. Keep on preaching brother man
 
Re: Are "Suburban American Women" Conservative or Liberal Voters?

So, in summary, emotion and social issues.

Also, even if they're equal earners (which they aren't), women are still more vulnerable. They can be stuck with a kid they don't want, for one, whereas a man can only be stuck with a kid if the government makes him.

Also, a lot of the success women are finding in the workplace is due to quotas and such, another government handout.

I can understand why they would tend to vote democrat.

We're really not in disagreement, you're just upset at me calling a spade a spade and saying women are generally more vulnerable and tend to vimote for the party of handouts that takes care of them

Where have you been darlin'...quotas are a fond memory. :) My first grown up job was business to business sales...and I was told that I was the "experiment" because the company had NEVER hired or promoted a woman into sales. They want to drive their revenue numbers and thought a 24 year old girl was just the ticket. I worked harder than any man in the department and they loved me. I even had an account taken away from me because I did not want to spend my afternoons in a strip club doing business...and still made it to High Achievers club. (Ford Motor was the client). The point is, no one gave me anything...I worked every weekend, drove 300-500 miles per week and 12 hour days...much more than the guys. By the time I was 30, I was training all of the sales people in the company, traveling across the US 4 days per week. Women work hard...and to make that statement insults every hard working professional woman in this country...
 
Re: Are "Suburban American Women" Conservative or Liberal Voters?

oh I disagree. what the federal government does is to create dependency and need. that is the main reason why some pimps in office pretend that the federal government-which was never given any proper power to do so-has to "feed the poor". the last thing those pimps want is a world where no one is hungry, needy or has to beg big brother to take care of them. such an environment would doom the careers of those whose main campaign schtick is "caring for the poor" in order to get power

Not every American has the opportunity to provide for themselves. There are not enough jobs, and many of those are taken by others who have no right to be working here. Not all Americans can work. Not all Americans have the mental or physical capacity to work, or to work enough to provide. Whether you like it or not, America is a society. One of the responsibilities of a society is to help this in need. Not to be so overwhelmed and consumed by your own greed that your fellow Americans are starving because you don't feel like they are worthy of food. I won't argue that people in poverty don't need new TVs, cigarettes, drugs, free cable ect. But there is no reason what so ever that any American should ever go hungry.
 
Re: Are "Suburban American Women" Conservative or Liberal Voters?

Yeah, its not as lucrative as selling your vote the way cons do, with a big kick after public service as a consultant..and then back again..get in that revolving door!
I have no clue how that is responsive to what I said. The fact is Democrats buy votes by promising handouts paid for by others, Republicans buy votes by telling those who actually are net tax payers, that the GOP will take less of your money.
Well, there is the problem, the GOP dramatically increased spending when they had both houses and the WH on pointless wars while cutting taxes and regs....leading to the worst depression since '29. Now you jokers have the temerity to whine about handouts....to the poor....created by your depression!
 
Re: Are "Suburban American Women" Conservative or Liberal Voters?

You're ruining my analogy

I always thought Sir Robin got a bad rap. The Sheriff of Nottingham and his master stole from the people to enrich the government. Robin took back which was taken by a corrupt decadent usurper regime and returned it to those who had owned it in the first place
 
Re: Are "Suburban American Women" Conservative or Liberal Voters?

Well, there is the problem, the GOP dramatically increased spending when they had both houses and the WH on pointless wars while cutting taxes and regs....leading to the worst depression since '29. Now you jokers have the temerity to whine about handouts....to the poor....created by your depression!

I agree, the GOP can suck too

that's why I am a libertarian
 
Re: Are "Suburban American Women" Conservative or Liberal Voters?

Not every American has the opportunity to provide for themselves. There are not enough jobs, and many of those are taken by others who have no right to be working here. Not all Americans can work. Not all Americans have the mental or physical capacity to work, or to work enough to provide. Whether you like it or not, America is a society. One of the responsibilities of a society is to help this in need. Not to be so overwhelmed and consumed by your own greed that your fellow Americans are starving because you don't feel like they are worthy of food. I won't argue that people in poverty don't need new TVs, cigarettes, drugs, free cable ect. But there is no reason what so ever that any American should ever go hungry.

sadly, helping those in need has become a scheme to make more and more needy and more and more dependent. Hunger isn't the biggest problem facing the poor-its obesity and poor life choices such as drugs, smoking, boozing and breeding like rabbits
 
Re: Are "Suburban American Women" Conservative or Liberal Voters?

Where have you been darlin'...quotas are a fond memory. :) My first grown up job was business to business sales...and I was told that I was the "experiment" because the company had NEVER hired or promoted a woman into sales. They want to drive their revenue numbers and thought a 24 year old girl was just the ticket. I worked harder than any man in the department and they loved me. I even had an account taken away from me because I did not want to spend my afternoons in a strip club doing business...and still made it to High Achievers club. (Ford Motor was the client). The point is, no one gave me anything...I worked every weekend, drove 300-500 miles per week and 12 hour days...much more than the guys. By the time I was 30, I was training all of the sales people in the company, traveling across the US 4 days per week. Women work hard...and to make that statement insults every hard working professional woman in this country...

Sounds like you've accomplished quite a bit, congratulations. Didn't mean to disrespect anyone but my point is that government helped get women to where they are today...maybe not in your case but certainly looking at the bigger picture.

Part of my larger point as to why women tend to vote democrat.

Call it quotas, whatever, they still exist.
 
Re: Are "Suburban American Women" Conservative or Liberal Voters?

I always thought Sir Robin got a bad rap. The Sheriff of Nottingham and his master stole from the people to enrich the government. Robin took back which was taken by a corrupt decadent usurper regime and returned it to those who had owned it in the first place

I'm pretty sure it's all just a story, people don't usually go around handing out cash after they've rightfully stolen it
 
Re: Are "Suburban American Women" Conservative or Liberal Voters?

sadly, helping those in need has become a scheme to make more and more needy and more and more dependent. Hunger isn't the biggest problem facing the poor-its obesity and poor life choices such as drugs, smoking, boozing and breeding like rabbits

I am talking feeding the hungry. And I push and fully support housing as well. Housing with heat. Drugs smoking and boozing are not what I am talking about.
 
Re: Are "Suburban American Women" Conservative or Liberal Voters?

I agree, the GOP can suck too

that's why I am a libertarian
you are a conservative, which is why you changed your script from "liberal/con" to "dem/gop".
 
Re: Are "Suburban American Women" Conservative or Liberal Voters?

I am talking feeding the hungry. And I push and fully support housing as well. Housing with heat. Drugs smoking and boozing are not what I am talking about.

What's wrong with drugs smoking and boozing?
 
Re: Are "Suburban American Women" Conservative or Liberal Voters?

sadly, helping those in need has become a scheme to make more and more needy and more and more dependent. Hunger isn't the biggest problem facing the poor-its obesity and poor life choices such as drugs, smoking, boozing and breeding like rabbits
you never tire tossing out these conservative jingoisms.
 
Re: Are "Suburban American Women" Conservative or Liberal Voters?

I'm pretty sure it's all just a story, people don't usually go around handing out cash after they've rightfully stolen it

its actually a short hand attempt to explain the tension between the Norman/French overlords and the saxon-native British under lords. sort of like the Arthurian legends which were attempts to describe the conflict between the Christianity introduced by Rome and the old religions and the Roman established order crumbling in the dark ages. Myths based on very real social upheaval
 
Re: Are "Suburban American Women" Conservative or Liberal Voters?

you never tire tossing out these conservative jingoisms.

its a useful shortcut when dealing with so many wealth vandals and income redistributionists
 
Re: Are "Suburban American Women" Conservative or Liberal Voters?

you are a conservative, which is why you changed your script from "liberal/con" to "dem/gop".

no I am a libertarian. I find social conservatism based on Bible thumping to be as odious as the parasitic reactionary statism of the left. I support freedom -be it the freedom to own a machine gun or to enter into a same sex marriage or have a safe and legal abortion or to keep most of what you earn.
 
Re: Are "Suburban American Women" Conservative or Liberal Voters?

Sounds like you've accomplished quite a bit, congratulations. Didn't mean to disrespect anyone but my point is that government helped get women to where they are today...maybe not in your case but certainly looking at the bigger picture.

Part of my larger point as to why women tend to vote democrat.

Call it quotas, whatever, they still exist.

The government helped many get to where they are....even Paul Ryan. :2razz: Is it so bad? These folks who were given a hand up, many are good tax paying Americans now. For example, the Pell Grant for higher education....I see it all the time with my nursing students. Many of them step off of public assistance into a job where she can raise her kids, buy a home, new car...etc. And they pay middle class taxes. I see their commitment as a contribution to the tax base or an investment into our citizens. What they were given in assistance pays off through tax dollars. The people you are referring to, the welfare queens, and lifers on public assistance are such a small percentage of what assistance looks like today. We have always had those folks and always will...they are the "incapable's". We are the greatest country on earth and American's could never stand to see these folks starving in the streets, we are not a 3rd world Nation. The majority of the 45% on assistance people are working class...they work hard but it is just not enough. They receive healthcare and food assistance, and maybe housing. They also pay taxes too... College is not for everyone...and some just don't want to go, but they should be able to sustain a family working 40 + hours a week. We lost a lot of those folks when we lost manufacturing and now they are the working class struggling to eat.
 
Re: Are "Suburban American Women" Conservative or Liberal Voters?

Where have you been darlin'...quotas are a fond memory. :) My first grown up job was business to business sales...and I was told that I was the "experiment" because the company had NEVER hired or promoted a woman into sales. They want to drive their revenue numbers and thought a 24 year old girl was just the ticket. I worked harder than any man in the department and they loved me. I even had an account taken away from me because I did not want to spend my afternoons in a strip club doing business...and still made it to High Achievers club. (Ford Motor was the client). The point is, no one gave me anything...I worked every weekend, drove 300-500 miles per week and 12 hour days...much more than the guys. By the time I was 30, I was training all of the sales people in the company, traveling across the US 4 days per week. Women work hard...and to make that statement insults every hard working professional woman in this country...

Honestly, I think women in sales are kind of hard to beat. All they've got to do is flirt a bit, and most guys will stop thinking with their one brain, and start thinking with the other. A lot of men have a tendency to start spontaneously hemorrhaging money shortly thereafter. :lol:

More and more businesses seem to be figuring this out too. Bar tending, for example, is quickly becoming a largely female dominated profession, from what I've seen. Women already have some pretty major sections of the service sector cornered as well.

I think that state of affairs most likely accounts for the discrepancy S&M mentioned earlier (though she was overstating it a little bit). Not only are young men a bit less motivated today than they were in the past, but the limited opportunities that are available in today's struggling - and increasingly service and sales oriented - economy tend to pretty highly favor female skillsets over the male variety. This has given young women something of a leg up over their male peers when it comes to establishing themselves.
 
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Re: Are "Suburban American Women" Conservative or Liberal Voters?

Honestly, I think women in sales are kind of hard to beat. All they've got to do is flirt a bit, and most guys will stop thinking their one brain, and start thinking with the other. A lot of men have a tendency to start spontaneously hemorrhaging money shortly thereafter. :lol:

More and more businesses seem to be figuring this out too. Bar tending, for example, is quickly becoming a largely female dominated profession, from what I've seen. Women already have some pretty major sections of the service sector cornered as well.

I think that state of affairs most likely accounts for the discrepancy S&M mentioned earlier (though she was overstating it a little bit). Not only are young men a bit less motivated today than they were in the past, but the limited opportunities that are available in today's struggling - and increasingly service and sales oriented - economy tend to pretty highly favor female skillsets over the male variety. This has given young women something of a leg up over their male peers when it comes to establishing themselves.

I was not the "sexy type"....more the athletic sister or girl next door type. If anything appealed to my clients, it was the "daughter" thing. LOL. Funny that you mentioned bartending....that was the path to my grown up job. Many of the marketing students sold door to door, cook books, encyclopedias, etc. My proven track was my bar sales. We were goaled by bar management to produce X amount of alcohol sales every shift...I bought a fake ID in Daytona Beach on Spring Break when I was 20 and started bar tending immediately...earning a grand in three days. LOL I agree...it does seem to be harder for younger guys to get going...What is up with that? I think it is growing pains...they just take longer to figure it out. I think guys in your age group are terrific fathers tho...very involved and active with their children. It is a weird job market for our current young college graduates. Healthcare seems to be the only industry that snaps them up when they graduate. It used to be, you had mentors, or folks who took you under their arm to groom you, now it seems to be sink or swim.
 
Re: Are "Suburban American Women" Conservative or Liberal Voters?

I was not the "sexy type"....more the athletic sister or girl next door type. If anything appealed to my clients, it was the "daughter" thing. LOL. Funny that you mentioned bartending....that was the path to my grown up job. Many of the marketing students sold door to door, cook books, encyclopedias, etc. My proven track was my bar sales. We were goaled by bar management to produce X amount of alcohol sales every shift...I bought a fake ID in Daytona Beach on Spring Break when I was 20 and started bar tending immediately...earning a grand in three days. LOL I agree...it does seem to be harder for younger guys to get going...What is up with that? I think it is growing pains...they just take longer to figure it out. I think guys in your age group are terrific fathers tho...very involved and active with their children. It is a weird job market for our current young college graduates. Healthcare seems to be the only industry that snaps them up when they graduate. It used to be, you had mentors, or folks who took you under their arm to groom you, now it seems to be sink or swim.

I agree. The lack of the support networks and social expectations of yesteryear certainly plays a role. A lot of guys simply lack direction, which often leads to fumbled starts in life. The other problem, as I mentioned before, is that the job market sucks, and the jobs that are available tend to cater more towards female skills than male skills.

I mean... Sure. There are some really charming guys out there. However, by and large men tend to be a lot less socially inclined than women. In an economy where the vast majority of jobs available to young adults are either in service (waiting, retail, etca) or sales, and pretty much all dependent upon being a veritable "social butterfly" to get ahead, that kind of bites us in the butt a little bit. The simple fact of the matter is that a perky little energetic twenty something female with a big smile on her face 24/7 is a heck of a lot more likely to please customers (and managers/interviewers, for that matter), get the sale, and therefore get or keep a job, than me, with my "resting Vulcan" face. :lol:

Skilled labor and manufacturing are where men have traditionally tended to excel, and jobs in all of those fields are in decline at the moment. The other male staples - business and security/military/law enforcement - simply don't have enough jobs to go around.
 
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Re: Are "Suburban American Women" Conservative or Liberal Voters?

Yes, a daddy figure. You believe women think like children in their politics and need someone to support them.

No - you are projecting. I think that women are more risk averse than men and that unmarried women therefore place a premium on economic security over economic opportunity.

I'm not exactly making this up:

Why do married and unmarried women tend to see the political world so differently?

For one thing, conservative women are more likely to be married, though of course many liberal women are married, too. Democratic pollster Celinda Lake says unmarried women as a group start out as more liberal-leaning than married women. And they are often hard-pressed economically.

Most unmarried women — 54% — have annual household incomes below $30,000, according to the Census; that's twice the percentage of married women with incomes that low. Most married women — 51% — have household incomes of $50,000 and above; that's double the number of single women with income that high. That makes single women more anxious than their married friends about bread-and-butter issues, less confident of having health coverage and more likely to take an expansive view of what the government can and should do to maintain safety-net programs..."Money-wise, it's very hard, especially as a single parent," says Evelyn Ocasio, 34, a widow who supports four children with her job as a receptionist. She is waiting at the edge of Wilmington's downtown square for the bus she takes to work....

Married women, who often have the security of two paychecks in a household, are more likely to cite Bush's leadership against terrorism as a compelling reason to support him.

The suburban women dubbed "soccer moms" in 2000 have been renamed "security moms" in the wake of the Sept. 11 attacks. One of the TV ads the Bush campaign is airing is aimed straight at them: "I can't imagine the great agony of a mom or a dad having to make the decision about which child to pick up first on September the 11th," the president says."Safety, that's No. 1," says Donna Stranahan, 39, who is married and has two children. She and a friend, Kathy Garrett, are on their way back to work after lunch. "I feel like living in the world today, you have to constantly be looking over your shoulder," agrees Garrett, 46, who is married. She's enrolled her 10-year-old daughter in a karate class to help ensure she can handle herself. She is registered as a Democrat but plans to vote for Bush.

"He had the gumption and the nerve to not just sit there and keep getting hit in the face" after 9/11, she says....
-------------------------------

You might not think that a group that runs from not-yet-married college students to inner-city single mothers and divorced professionals had much in common. Yet strategists and pollsters report that—even after controlling for such variables as race, age, religiosity and income—marital status is a powerful predictor of Democratic voting (whereas married women and older widows lean slightly Republican). The key to the puzzle appears to involve attitudes to government safety nets, and a shared sense among unmarried women that they are trying to survive without any back-up in a harsh, increasingly insecure economy (unmarried women are disproportionately likely to work in jobs which do not offer health cover, for instance). Put another way, the conservative battle-cry of “Leave me the Hell alone” sounds different when you are literally on your own....
 
Re: Are "Suburban American Women" Conservative or Liberal Voters?

SmokeAndMirrors said:
If you're going to make these sorts of sexist insinuations, you should at least have the cajones to just be honest about it rather than playing dumb.

:yawn: play of the Sexist Card indicates your argument is fail.

You are simply choosing not to listen. The fact is, women in all demographics are dominantly liberal.

This claim is inaccurate, as I have already cited to you. Married women are pretty consistent on this, and have been for decades.

I have provided proof of such. However, older people vote more consistently. Therefore, in some demographics, conservative women appear more predominant.

On the contrary, when it comes to quite a few questions, marriage is a stronger determinant than age.

...Take the question of whether the increase in working moms has made it harder for marriages to succeed. Among respondents under 30, the percentage who espoused this view was 36. Among respondents aged 30–49, the percentage rose to 54. But in the older age brackets—50 to 64, and 65 and over—there was no further increase. People born in the 1970s didn’t answer the question any differently from people born in the 1940s. The only division was between those who had turned 30 and those who hadn’t.

That raises an alternative possibility. Maybe the difference between under-30s and their elders isn’t the era in which they grew up. Maybe it’s a lack of life experience. As young people pass from their 20s to their 30s, they get married and have kids. They lose their naïvete about self-realization, having it all, the equality of family structures, and the interchangeability of moms and dads. According to this theory, the reason why older people are more likely to believe that unwed motherhood is a big problem, or that kids do better with stay-at-home moms, is that beyond the age of 30, you discover that these things are true....

The tables exposed similar gaps based on marital experience. Compared with people who had never been married, those who were married at the time of the survey were more likely to say that working mothers made it harder to raise kids (82 vs. 62 percent), more likely to say that working mothers made it harder for marriages to succeed (56 vs. 37 percent), more likely to say that kids were better off with their mothers at home (56 vs. 30 percent), and more likely to say that unwed motherhood was a big problem (74 vs. 44 percent). In nearly every case, the gap between marrieds and never-marrieds was bigger than the gap between the youngest age group (18–29) and the oldest (65+). If you want to predict what somebody thinks about women and families, marital experience is a better clue than age....

Marriage and child-rearing make us more conservative, as it provides greater economic security for those who are risk-averse, and an investment in the future for those who are risk-seeking or naturally short-term focused.

As an anecdotal example, when asked about the long-term effects of all the debt-financed spending that he was advocating, Keynes famously responded that "in the long run, we're all dead". That was an acceptable answer to him - he had no children. It is not an acceptable answer to someone whose kids and grandkids will have to live in the world that they are helping to create.

But population-wide, women are still more liberal than conservative across all demographics. So, no -- you are mathematically wrong.

So you are claiming that there is this large group of married, liberal women, who are all just too young to care about voting? :shrug: Even if that is accurate (and I am not saying that it is), then that, too, would be expected (changes rarely occur instantaneously), and also would not be enough to override the rest of married womanhood.
 
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