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If we'd known the truth about Islam would we & should we have invaded Iraq?

If we'd known the truth about Islam would we & should we have invaded Iraq?

  • Would we have invaded? Other

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • SHOULD we have invaded? Other

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    24
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If we'd known the truth about Islam would we & should we have invaded Iraq?

Would we have invaded? Yes

Would we have invaded? No

Would we have invaded? Maybe

Would we have invaded? Other


SHOULD we have invaded? Yes

SHOULD we have invaded? No

SHOULD we have invaded? Maybe

SHOULD we have invaded? Other

If we knew the actual nature of Islam I wonder if we woulda or shoulda invaded.

One unknown aspect of the true nature of Islam is that Muslims are more Muslim than Americans are American, IMHO.

Another is that Muslims are commanded to make every other religion and form of government ion Earth disappear.

If we knew that we would not be overwhelmingly greeted as liberators would we have had that humanitarian motive to add to the reasons why we believed we SHOULD have invaded?
 
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I believe Saddam Hussein needed to be dealt with, he was being very uncooperative with UN weapon inspectors. However we decided to bring far more force and destruction into play than I believe was necessary. I personally believe we should have given him an ultimatum to either cooperate fully and immediately or be taken out. If he continued to be uncooperative we should have gathered intelligence (even if it took months) and made a strategic strike by bomb or a small team of commandos directly on him leaving the rest of the country alone. We should never have moved forces into the country.

Once he was killed and his successor was in place we give the same ultimatum and consequences to them, eventually whomever was in power would comply to UN weapon inspections the way they should.
 
The invasion of Iraq was one of the worst blunders ever, nearly equal to having gotten bogged down in a ground war in SE Asia years ago. It has cost upwards of a trillion dollars and thousands of lives, and left the situation there worse than it was when Hussain was in power.

How anyone with 20/20 hindsight can't see that for what it is is a mystery to me. I was against the invasion from the start, having lived through and with the results of that other blunder in Vietnam. Anyone who was for the war has to have their foresight and leadership questioned.
 
If we'd known the truth about Islam would we & should we have invaded Iraq?

Would we have invaded? Yes

Would we have invaded? No

Would we have invaded? Maybe

Would we have invaded? Other


SHOULD we have invaded? Yes

SHOULD we have invaded? No

SHOULD we have invaded? Maybe

SHOULD we have invaded? Other

If we knew the actual nature of Islam I wonder if we woulda or shoulda invaded.

One unknown aspect of the true nature of Islam is that Muslims are more Muslim than Americans are American, IMHO.

Another is that Muslims are commanded to make every other religion and form of government ion Earth disappear.

If we knew that we would not be overwhelmingly greeted as liberators would we have had that humanitarian motive to add to the reasons why we believed we SHOULD have invaded?

Which truth? I bet your truth and my truth are probably not the same...
 
Would we have invaded? Of course we would, for the same reason we did, because Bush was mad that Saddam tried to kill his daddy. Should we have done it? Nope, no more than we actually should have. Nothing would have changed.
 
If we knew the actual nature of Islam I wonder if we woulda or shoulda invaded.

One unknown aspect of the true nature of Islam is that Muslims are more Muslim than Americans are American, IMHO.

Another is that Muslims are commanded to make every other religion and form of government ion Earth disappear.

If we knew that we would not be overwhelmingly greeted as liberators would we have had that humanitarian motive to add to the reasons why we believed we SHOULD have invaded?

The actual nature of Islam? What exactly would that be? Isis? That is not the actual nature of Islam. That we in the West have had the enormous luck to be growing up in a reasonably enlightened society made us why we are so democratic, sometimes evolved and respectful for a lot of other religions (our religious wars have been fought and the battle is largely over).

Most Muslims live in countries where people are as uneducated as it humanly possible. The only education they get is either from the Imam or from the equally undemocratic, totally not enlightened rulers. It took "us" in the West centuries to have the enlightened and democratic society we have now. Our educational system has grown throughout the centuries. Our people are (usually) free to think for themselves.

We cannot expect that Muslims will make this jump from uneducated dumb religious isolated tribal morons to Western society standard citizens. To even think that is absolutely outside of reality. If you have been told for centuries that gays are bad, Jews are evil, Christians are violent oppressors and that Islam is the only path to enlightenment, you will not be swayed by a government put in place by Western powers/forced to adopt more Western morality.

In two or three generations the situation will have been massively changed, in part because of the internet and people getting to know more people outside of their own very restrictive/conservative societies and getting to realize that there is not so much difference between them and the rest of the world.

Because of the internet, television, travel and mobile communication the world is getting a lot smaller than it was before. And it is known that closeness often creates new insight into other people.

Like this story:

A story about an elderly Jewish lady and her Muslim neighbours who cared - Features - Health & Families - The Independent

Where an elderly Jewish lady was massively assisted by their devote Muslim neighbors. This is a birthday card they made for her on her 105th birthday

IMG_8261.jpg

Lily was a Jewish refugee from Germany. She married and lived in London. She had one daughter and that daughter moved to the US. When her husband died, Lily kept living in her house, refusing to move to an old folks home. When she was a young 94 years old, she was pottering in her garden and she met her new neighbors, a Muslim family who adopted her so to speak. Mohammed the father popped in when Lily needed odd jobs in the house or garden or just for a cuppa tea. The mother and the daughters cooked for Lily and visited her daily to make sure she was OK.

When Lily was near 105 her health changed for the worse, but her devout Muslim neighbors came every morning to wash and clothe her and every evening they came to help her to bed. When Lily was no longer able to manage the stairs, her bed was brought downstairs so that Lily could remain home.

And the next is from the story above:

Auntie Lilly died on 26 March 2015. She passed away peacefully in her own home with her daughter beside her. In accordance with Jewish tradition she was buried the next day, in the Jewish burial ground at Bushey in Hertfordshire. Her son-in-law and two grandsons arrived just in time for the funeral, having flown in from America. Lilly’s regular Pakistani minicab driver, Iqbal, picked them up from the airport, took them to Lilly’s house and then to the burial ground. He attended the funeral and refused to take any money for his fare that day.

At the service were Mohammed and Shamin, he dressed in white tunic and trousers and she in her traditional shalwaar kameez and scarf. Lilly’s Iraqi neighbours also attended, wanting to mark their special relationship too. Traditionally, when the coffin has been lowered into the ground it is customary for the men to take turns in shovelling earth onto it. Mohammed, Iqbal and the Iraqi friend all did so, continuing to give to Lilly in death the same love, honour and respect they had given her in life.

We must remember that Muslims are people too, and to expect them to treat us as human beings worthy of respect, we must in turn do the same with them.
 
Honest opinion ?
Religious fanaticisms : with the Islamic extremists .. and Christian extremisms .. immeasurable .. I a man is willing to put his life on the line , just for some , IMO, silly religion. I must admit, I cannot understand the nature of man ..
I feel that we should NOT have invaded , NOW, but then, I was in favor of the invasion .
I believe that only some, maybe all Islamic radicals buy into the forced conversion of all others on this planet .. Our knowledge of people does not seem to be that great , particularly of those in "far away lands .

One has to observe (man's nature), with a clean mind, but this may be impossible ..

If we knew that we would not be overwhelmingly greeted as liberators would we have had that humanitarian motive to add to the reasons why we believed we SHOULD have invaded
Again , impossible to determine this .. Had we conducted a poll before the invasion ....HA! Maybe 0.1% of Iraqis would have sais ..YES! save us .. save us !
Seriously, what we did, years ago, now, was wrong .. a criminal act ..possibily
Leave the extremists be .. Over time, they will "get over it" .
 
The actual nature of Islam? What exactly would that be? Isis? That is not the actual nature of Islam. That we in the West have had the enormous luck to be growing up in a reasonably enlightened society made us why we are so democratic, sometimes evolved and respectful for a lot of other religions (our religious wars have been fought and the battle is largely over).

Most Muslims live in countries where people are as uneducated as it humanly possible. The only education they get is either from the Imam or from the equally undemocratic, totally not enlightened rulers. It took "us" in the West centuries to have the enlightened and democratic society we have now. Our educational system has grown throughout the centuries. Our people are (usually) free to think for themselves.

We cannot expect that Muslims will make this jump from uneducated dumb religious isolated tribal morons to Western society standard citizens. To even think that is absolutely outside of reality. If you have been told for centuries that gays are bad, Jews are evil, Christians are violent oppressors and that Islam is the only path to enlightenment, you will not be swayed by a government put in place by Western powers/forced to adopt more Western morality.

In two or three generations the situation will have been massively changed, in part because of the internet and people getting to know more people outside of their own very restrictive/conservative societies and getting to realize that there is not so much difference between them and the rest of the world.

Because of the internet, television, travel and mobile communication the world is getting a lot smaller than it was before. And it is known that closeness often creates new insight into other people.

Like this story:

A story about an elderly Jewish lady and her Muslim neighbours who cared - Features - Health & Families - The Independent

Where an elderly Jewish lady was massively assisted by their devote Muslim neighbors. This is a birthday card they made for her on her 105th birthday

View attachment 67185337

Lily was a Jewish refugee from Germany. She married and lived in London. She had one daughter and that daughter moved to the US. When her husband died, Lily kept living in her house, refusing to move to an old folks home. When she was a young 94 years old, she was pottering in her garden and she met her new neighbors, a Muslim family who adopted her so to speak. Mohammed the father popped in when Lily needed odd jobs in the house or garden or just for a cuppa tea. The mother and the daughters cooked for Lily and visited her daily to make sure she was OK.

When Lily was near 105 her health changed for the worse, but her devout Muslim neighbors came every morning to wash and clothe her and every evening they came to help her to bed. When Lily was no longer able to manage the stairs, her bed was brought downstairs so that Lily could remain home.

And the next is from the story above:



We must remember that Muslims are people too, and to expect them to treat us as human beings worthy of respect, we must in turn do the same with them.
Worthy of being read again .. Cannot agree more ..
 
If we'd known the truth about Islam would we & should we have invaded Iraq?

Would we have invaded? Yes

Would we have invaded? No

Would we have invaded? Maybe

Would we have invaded? Other


SHOULD we have invaded? Yes

SHOULD we have invaded? No

SHOULD we have invaded? Maybe

SHOULD we have invaded? Other

If we knew the actual nature of Islam I wonder if we woulda or shoulda invaded.

One unknown aspect of the true nature of Islam is that Muslims are more Muslim than Americans are American, IMHO.

Another is that Muslims are commanded to make every other religion and form of government ion Earth disappear.

If we knew that we would not be overwhelmingly greeted as liberators would we have had that humanitarian motive to add to the reasons why we believed we SHOULD have invaded?

The rational for invading Iraq was they wouldn't allow weapons inspectors inspect weapons sites, they shot at our planes who enforced the no fly zone established and there was the threat of WMD's that some claim was based on faulty intelligence.

Let me say that on another message board, which by the way was quite liberal, I publicly opposed the invasion. I still think it was a bad idea but once the invasion started victory was the only acceptable option.

Having said that, knowledge of Islam had no impact on the decision to invade the country.
 
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If we'd known the truth about Islam would we & should we have invaded Iraq?

Would we have invaded? Yes

Would we have invaded? No

Would we have invaded? Maybe

Would we have invaded? Other


SHOULD we have invaded? Yes

SHOULD we have invaded? No

SHOULD we have invaded? Maybe

SHOULD we have invaded? Other

If we knew the actual nature of Islam I wonder if we woulda or shoulda invaded.

One unknown aspect of the true nature of Islam is that Muslims are more Muslim than Americans are American, IMHO.

Another is that Muslims are commanded to make every other religion and form of government ion Earth disappear.

If we knew that we would not be overwhelmingly greeted as liberators would we have had that humanitarian motive to add to the reasons why we believed we SHOULD have invaded?

We didn't know too much about Islam, but we knew a lot about Islam's OIL. The Neo-Cons all know about OIL. There are too many banking and profit agendas involved to suggest that Islam is the face or cause of the War. We, the USA, are about profits, banking, business, sales and marketing, agendas, and corrupt politics, ergo a comprehensive approach with maximum analytical review is required to produce a realistic question.
 
We didn't know too much about Islam, but we knew a lot about Islam's OIL. The Neo-Cons all know about OIL. There are too many banking and profit agendas involved to suggest that Islam is the face or cause of the War. We, the USA, are about profits, banking, business, sales and marketing, agendas, and corrupt politics, ergo a comprehensive approach with maximum analytical review is required to produce a realistic question.
I don't believe it had anything to do with oil. The region was stable and the availability of oil wasn't an issue, nor did it appear that it would become an issue.
 
I don't believe it had anything to do with oil. The region was stable and the availability of oil wasn't an issue, nor did it appear that it would become an issue.

That statement is the same as saying the war had nothing to do with money. We are a Nation attempting to control the rest of the World with Banking hegemony. We are CORPORATISM/CAPITALISM and that is profit and loss. We have historically profitted from Wars as the Nations most consistent Industry. I call history as the witness to these words.
 
I think if you created a poll that asked, "Knowing what we know now, should we have invaded Iraq?" then that would have been sufficient. To that question, I would answer that there isn't anyone besides lunatic Islamic fundamentalists and Iran that the invasion of Iraq ended up working out very well for. It kind of seems like everyone else lost something in the aftermath of that.
 
The actual nature of Islam? What exactly would that be? Isis? That is not the actual nature of Islam. That we in the West have had the enormous luck to be growing up in a reasonably enlightened society made us why we are so democratic, sometimes evolved and respectful for a lot of other religions (our religious wars have been fought and the battle is largely over).

Most Muslims live in countries where people are as uneducated as it humanly possible. The only education they get is either from the Imam or from the equally undemocratic, totally not enlightened rulers. It took "us" in the West centuries to have the enlightened and democratic society we have now. Our educational system has grown throughout the centuries. Our people are (usually) free to think for themselves.

We cannot expect that Muslims will make this jump from uneducated dumb religious isolated tribal morons to Western society standard citizens. To even think that is absolutely outside of reality. If you have been told for centuries that gays are bad, Jews are evil, Christians are violent oppressors and that Islam is the only path to enlightenment, you will not be swayed by a government put in place by Western powers/forced to adopt more Western morality.

In two or three generations the situation will have been massively changed, in part because of the internet and people getting to know more people outside of their own very restrictive/conservative societies and getting to realize that there is not so much difference between them and the rest of the world.

Unfortunately, in the eyes of most conservatives, you are now officially a commie/nazi/socialist/atheist/Muslim heretic who hates freedom and wants to impose Sharia law on America. Welcome to the group!
 
I got an idea! Let's try remaking one of our favorite brands - let's call it...New Coke!

That could work... what doesn't work is remaking Swayze flicks.
 
Unfortunately, in the eyes of most conservatives, you are now officially a commie/nazi/socialist/atheist/Muslim heretic who hates freedom and wants to impose Sharia law on America. Welcome to the group!

Well, I am a social democrat, already owned up to that and I am, as I have already owned up to too, an atheist.

The commie, nazi, muslim characters do not rally fit but in the past I have been made out for this and more but as I know better, these comments always run off me a like water of a ducks back.
 
Well, I am a social democrat, already owned up to that and I am, as I have already owned up to too, an atheist.

The commie, nazi, muslim characters do not rally fit but in the past I have been made out for this and more but as I know better, these comments always run off me a like water of a ducks back.

I know - I was just being facetious. The conservatives' Islamophobia just makes me want to get into their faces and scream about their ignorance and rank hypocrisy. Personally, I felt a heck of a lot safer walking down the street in Dubai than I do in downtown Seattle...and Seattle's a fairly safe city, as far as America goes....
 
I honestly can't see how the question of the post-event wisdom of invading Iraq, can even be in dispute.

And, I don't understand the Islamic references, in relation.

(BTW - in case anyone wonders, the OP's absence in his thread can be explained by his appearing to have received a temp suspension)
 
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I know - I was just being facetious. The conservatives' Islamophobia just makes me want to get into their faces and scream about their ignorance and rank hypocrisy. Personally, I felt a heck of a lot safer walking down the street in Dubai than I do in downtown Seattle...and Seattle's a fairly safe city, as far as America goes....

I would not know about Dubai. I have never been towards there. Most I have been is the UK, Germany, Belgium, Austria, Switzerland and Italy. And where I live in the Netherlands (the deepest South) it is pretty safe from most crimes. Especially violent crimes. Last year we had 137 murders over the entire year, in the entire country. Being killed here is not that big of a risk. In fact I am more likely to die in a traffic accident than from murder (570 deaths last year).
 
Saddam was murdering countless people who had no way to defend themselves against him. Saddam needed to be removed from power, and sentenced for his crimes. The US should have found a better way to remove him from power, but I absolutely believe it was the right thing to do.

I am under no false belief that his murdering was the primary reason our government invaded Iraq, but it is the reason I believe removing him was the right thing to do.
 
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