• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

Would you support the decision of Texas to peacefully and democratically secede, if voted upon


  • Total voters
    133
so Texans don't want to be Americans anymore.......that says a mouthful right there confederate tea party.....lol no the feds are not going to give up any real estate sorry

5th gen Texan here and I think the whole succession thing is BS.
 
I'm against self determination.

At any rate the U.S. Civil War settled this matter through the only currency that ultimately matters.

Blood.
 
im sorry there are more whites on welfare than blacks we are only 12 percent of the country and 85 percent of us work....do the math...that was a sad thing to say..but what do we expect from some people .......but I will tell you something if texas left the u.s. the blacks would leave texas if they had to walk...that's one way to get rid of us....lol... http://www.dol.gov/_Sec/media/reports/blacklaborforce/
 
Last edited:
I'm against self determination.

At any rate the U.S. Civil War settled this matter through the only currency that ultimately matters.

Blood.

that's interesting... being against self determination.

can you elaborate on why you are against it?
 
And a heavy reliance on federal funded infrastructure

Which we pay in for proportionate to what we receive, so that could be offset by the fact that we don't have to pay federal tax anymore as an independent state, we would be able to raise the state tax to make up the full difference
 
I can't see that happening, as much as Texans fantasize about another civil war. The US government would arrest the leaders and then reincorporate Texas, or bring economic pressure to bear until they gave up.


if the state left, it would be by the people not the state government.

so the federal government would have to subdue the people......many people of other states would probability rebel against the federal government. creating even a larger conformation.
 
To understand why the answer is NO a person only has to look at Eastern Europe, the Middle East and even the European Union.

The smaller an entity is, the more vulnerable it is to invasion and revolution, subject to the whims of MAJOR powers, and the worse off it's economy becomes.

Why just Texas? Why not every county in Texas being it's own country? Or every town? Or what about my own house and property being my own country? Why can't I do that? Why not abolish all government and declare each person is their own country and their own nation?

Yeah, it sounds cool to some to say the Confederates should have had their own country, arguing some zealotry zippyhead head ideological slogans - pretending then reality MUST exist consistent with it because it is so philosophically corrrect.

It would be the coolness of Germany and Japan winning WWII cool or, if not, the USSR having come to dominate the world.

Historically, for thousands of years, none federalized regions were militarily defeated and, often, totally erased from history's future. EMPIRES can last a long time. Tiny countries do not.

Texas is comparable in population and economic output as the entire nation of Canada.
 
I've been here a mere 5 or 6 years... haven't met a secessionist yet.

....read about a few in the papers though.

It is basically folklore we all kid around about
 
To understand why the answer is NO a person only has to look at Eastern Europe, the Middle East and even the European Union.

The smaller an entity is, the more vulnerable it is to invasion and revolution, subject to the whims of MAJOR powers, and the worse off it's economy becomes.

Why just Texas? Why not every county in Texas being it's own country? Or every town? Or what about my own house and property being my own country? Why can't I do that? Why not abolish all government and declare each person is their own country and their own nation?

Yeah, it sounds cool to some to say the Confederates should have had their own country, arguing some zealotry zippyhead head ideological slogans - pretending then reality MUST exist consistent with it because it is so philosophically corrrect.

It would be the coolness of Germany and Japan winning WWII cool or, if not, the USSR having come to dominate the world.

Historically, for thousands of years, none federalized regions were militarily defeated and, often, totally erased from history's future. EMPIRES can last a long time. Tiny countries do not.
On the issue of small countries being vulnerable to big ones, I think it's too hard to generalise like this and I don't understand your last sentence at all. Colonial Britain managed to rule India for a time. Japan controlled large parts of China at times. On the other hand, small countries which stay out of international political conflicts are less likely to attract the attention of aggressors e.g. Switzerland, Iceland, various countries in Central and South America.

On the economic success of small countries, Norway and Switzerland are small in population and they lead the way in Europe. Neither are even in the EU. Russia is a huge country with huge resources and still it has not managed to achieve Western lifestyles for most of its people.

On self-determination, there are a number of loose criteria in international law including size. There has to be a certain element of self-sufficiency for a group to reasonably claim sovereignty, which would not be the case for a town with no agriculture or independent electricity supply, for example. It is an interesting discussion though. There are still sovereignty disputes in the world and consideration of the criteria for nationhood which we could talk about.
 
there's lots of very small countries that would like to have a word with you...;)

How many small countries rely on BIG countries to protect them?
 
On the issue of small countries being vulnerable to big ones, I think it's too hard to generalise like this and I don't understand your last sentence at all. Colonial Britain managed to rule India for a time. Japan controlled large parts of China at times. On the other hand, small countries which stay out of international political conflicts are less likely to attract the attention of aggressors e.g. Switzerland, Iceland, various countries in Central and South America.

On the economic success of small countries, Norway and Switzerland are small in population and they lead the way in Europe. Neither are even in the EU. Russia is a huge country with huge resources and still it has not managed to achieve Western lifestyles for most of its people.

On self-determination, there are a number of loose criteria in international law including size. There has to be a certain element of self-sufficiency for a group to reasonably claim sovereignty, which would not be the case for a town with no agriculture or independent electricity supply, for example. It is an interesting discussion though. There are still sovereignty disputes in the world and consideration of the criteria for nationhood which we could talk about.

Iceland and Switzerland historically had geographic natural protection. Switzerland was unique not only for the mountains, but also all parties had a mutual interest in maintaining a universal safe-haven for money and money brokering. The UK had the natural barrier of water and still does. No land access are still significant barriers to invasion. But for that, Britain would have fallen to Germany.
Norway was overrun by Germany. I don't know much about S. American countries.

India was NOT a federalized system when the West arrived, but a mass array of little royalties of nearly 1000 different languages. Despite being totally militarily inferior, Japan never could completely conquer China. Of continental Europe, only massive Russia could withstand the onslaught.
 
Here's food for thought. If there are government retirees living in the state of Texas, and Texas secedes, will these retirees still get their pensions or be cut off, unless they move to another state? Now, there are retired Americans living in foreign countries, and they still receive their pensions, so maybe the government would gladly still pay these pensions to these secessionists as well.
 
that's interesting... being against self determination.

can you elaborate on why you are against it?

As someone who condemned the idea after World War 1 said.

"There will never be enough territory to satisfy the demands of EVERY distinct religious, ethnic, or political group"
 
In accordance with the OP hypothetical and having lived 27 years of life in Texas:



-Within 24 hours of Texas GOP declaring secession the Hard-Blue Democrat black/Mexican lower class majorities of Houston Texas would burn the entire city down. Houston is where all of Texas's oil is refined as well as most of US's, Venezuela's and Mexico's oil refined. This would both end the Texas's economy and send the global economy into a "Super Great Depression" that would last several years at minimum. Global oil would hit $400 a barrel.

-South Texas for thousands of miles is over 90% Mexican and is generational dark-blue Democrat and is near completely dependent, even now, on US Federal benefits. Once Texas GOP secedes South Texas would likely secede from Texas. This entire region of Texas has a visceral hatred and has for decades of Texas GOP.

-Upon finding out that Texas GOP secessionists were actually going to secede, the Houston/Dallas oil Oligarchs would order contract killings on those key politicians. The oligarchs would never accept being ruined by Texas secessionists. These are people in downtown Houston that live in high rise apartments with millions of dollars intertwined in international markets. Their kids all fly to NYC on a whim. They go to top notch schools. They're deeply interconnected to the global jet set crowd. They stand with scotch at funeral parlors and talk of "the white trash scum" who they represent with callousness. They know exactly what will happen to their fortunes if secession is allowed. Their bought and paid for whore politicians will never even "usher in" secession. That's why this whole thread is illogical. (And I sympathize with that, your average Texan hasn't talked to these people. They haven't seen the Texas Jet Set crowd or met them. They don't realize these people are international capitalists totally tied at the hip to places like NYC, Chicago, London, Berlin. The average person in Texas simply doesn't grasp that.)



VwkjJdM.jpg
 
Last edited:
As someone who condemned the idea after World War 1 said.

"There will never be enough territory to satisfy the demands of EVERY distinct religious, ethnic, or political group"

so not having enough land is your reason why you don't believe a people should be able to determine the government they live under?

i guess that works in strictly utilitarian terms... it's just odd to me, as an American, to come across folks who oppose self determination.
 
In accordance with the OP hypothetical and having lived 27 years of life in Texas:



-Within 24 hours of Texas GOP declaring secession the Hard-Blue Democrat black/Mexican lower class majorities of Houston Texas would burn the entire city down. Houston is where all of Texas's oil is refined as well as most of US's, Venezuela's and Mexico's oil refined. This would both end the Texas's economy and send the global economy into a "Super Great Depression" that would last several years at minimum. Global oil would hit $400 a barrel.

-South Texas for thousands of miles is over 90% Mexican and is generational dark-blue Democrat and is near completely dependent, even now, on US Federal benefits. Once Texas GOP secedes South Texas would likely secede from Texas. This entire region of Texas has a visceral hatred and has for decades of Texas GOP.

-Upon finding out that Texas GOP secessionists were actually going to secede, the Houston/Dallas oil Oligarchs would order contract killings on those key politicians. The oligarchs would never accept being ruined by Texas secessionists. These are people in downtown Houston that live in high rise apartments with millions of dollars intertwined in international markets. Their kids all fly to NYC on a whim. They go to top notch schools. They're deeply interconnected to the global jet set crowd. They stand with scotch at funeral parlors and talk of "the white trash scum" who they represent with callousness. They know exactly what will happen to their fortunes if secession is allowed. Their bought and paid for whore politicians will never even "usher in" secession. That's why this whole thread is illogical. (And I sympathize with that, your average Texan hasn't talked to these people. They haven't seen the Texas Jet Set crowd or met them. They don't realize these people are international capitalists totally tied at the hip to places like NYC, Chicago, London, Berlin. The average person in Texas simply doesn't grasp that.)



VwkjJdM.jpg

we've heard your "the sky will fall based on race and party affiliation" bull**** already...
 
we've heard your "the sky will fall based on race and party affiliation" bull**** already...

Oh yeah didn't think you'd like that post lol :)

Still pretending that Texas Democrats who hate Texas GOP would support secession eh? You never do answer that do you? Instead just ignoring that fact :)
 
Here's food for thought. If there are government retirees living in the state of Texas, and Texas secedes, will these retirees still get their pensions or be cut off, unless they move to another state? Now, there are retired Americans living in foreign countries, and they still receive their pensions, so maybe the government would gladly still pay these pensions to these secessionists as well.

I guess that would depend on whether or not those retirees retained their US citizenship or not.... if they were US citizens , but living in Texas, they would still get their benefits...if the chose to become Texas citizens, they be cut off.
 
Oh yeah didn't think you'd like that psot lol :)

Still pretending that Texas Democrats who hate Texas GOP would support secession eh? You never do answer that do you? Instead just ignoring that fact :)

nope, it was a stupid post...why would i like it?

I'm not pretending anything...this is like the 3rd time you blatantly lied like that... you would best served not to get the reputation as a liar.
 
Back
Top Bottom