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Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

Would you support the decision of Texas to peacefully and democratically secede, if voted upon


  • Total voters
    133
The nation would quickly call them on it and basically butch slap them for such an attempt. There is no reason anyone would recognize their sovereign currency, especially when any such attempt to secede would be challenged by the US government, which would lead many, if not all, US allies to refuse to recognize any such currency due to the fact that the commodity that that currency would be based off of would have to be presumed to not actually belong to Texas without recognizing Texas' sovereignty, something that would put them in opposition to the US.

you're going to have to start another thread on the scenario you have in mind... this one is about peaceful and democratic secession.
 
the thread isn't about a civil war.. it's about a peaceful and democratic secession.

Which the nation has declared it would not recognize. Chances are good this position is not going to change in the near future. And this thread asked simply if people would support their secession, but did not state that there would be no federal opposition to their secession.
 
Which the nation has declared it would not recognize. Chances are good this position is not going to change in the near future. And this thread asked simply if people would support their secession, but did not state that there would be no federal opposition to their secession.

"peaceful"...

you guys are speaking specifically of a civil wars and Russian subs and federal invasions...... which is pretty much the opposite of "peaceful".
 
you're going to have to start another thread on the scenario you have in mind... this one is about peaceful and democratic secession.

Actually, no. The OP said only that the internal state vote was peaceful and democratic. Nothing about the response from the rest of the nation. This thread easily includes what would realistically happen.
 
"peaceful"...

you guys are speaking specifically of a civil wars and Russian subs and federal invasions...... which is pretty much the opposite of "peaceful".

Which the OP was talking about the internal state vote to secede, not about the potential response from the rest of the nation. This is obvious from the context.
 
Actually, no. The OP said only that the internal state vote was peaceful and democratic. Nothing about the response from the rest of the nation. This thread easily includes what would realistically happen.

I forgot that "peaceful" now means "war"... my bad.


carry on with the civil war fantasies... I've no desire to entertain them.
 
Why would they? The first thing they're going to do is stop funding NASA and all Federal military outlets in Texas which alone would completely end the Texas economy. Why does "Currency" even matter at that point? Texas would be in the equivalent of 500 great depressions.

Not to mentioned Houston would be half burned to the ground by that point likely and Mexico might have annexed Southern Texas.

I don't think you're taking an honest look at the scope of Texas' economy. NASA and whatever federal bases there are comprise only a small fraction of the state's economy.

The economy and population of Texas is roughly equivalent in size to that of Canada. We have a population of nearly 30 million, with two of the nation's top 5 metro areas being in the state. Texas is home to 53 Fortune 500 companies, or one out of every ten of the workd's largest corporations. We have an abundance of natural resources, and major shipping access via the Gulf of Mexico.

Texas is probably the largest and most important contributor to the overall American economy, rivaled only by California in that respect.
 
Actually, no. The OP said only that the internal state vote was peaceful and democratic. Nothing about the response from the rest of the nation. This thread easily includes what would realistically happen.

You think the rest of the nation would go to war with Texas, if we peacefully and democratically elected to withdraw via a statewide referendum?

Why?

I don't think the American people have that kind of bloodlust.

I don't think you could get the general public to back a war which would A.) take the lives of countless relatives, friends, and loved ones of those on both sides B.) which would inevitably spill over to other states where people live and C.) which would inevitably be drawn out and bloody, as even if you did conquer and colonize Texas, a large part of the population own guns and are pretty diehard.

I'm not buying it. I don't think it would come to war, this isn't the 1850's. I think if the people of Texas overwhelmingly wanted to secede, it would happen peacefully a la Scotland.
 
You think the rest of the nation would go to war with Texas, if we peacefully and democratically elected to withdraw via a statewide referendum?

Why?

I don't think the American people have that kind of bloodlust.

I don't think you could get the general public to back a war which would A.) take the lives of countless relatives, friends, and loved ones of those on both sides B.) which would inevitably spill over to other states where people live and C.) which would inevitably be drawn out and bloody, as even if you did conquer and colonize Texas, a large part of the population own guns and are pretty diehard.

I'm not buying it. I don't think it would come to war, this isn't the 1850's. I think if the people of Texas overwhelmingly wanted to secede, it would happen peacefully a la Scotland.

Is this a UT Austin wet dream?
 
Is this a UT Austin wet dream?

Just realism. The American Public didn't have the stomach to finish out wars in Vietnam or Iraq...but you think they're going to sit happily by and watch friends, relatives, neighbors and loved ones get butchered?

Never happen.
 
You think the rest of the nation would go to war with Texas, if we peacefully and democratically elected to withdraw via a statewide referendum?

Why?

I don't think the American people have that kind of bloodlust.

I don't think you could get the general public to back a war which would A.) take the lives of countless relatives, friends, and loved ones of those on both sides B.) which would inevitably spill over to other states where people live and C.) which would inevitably be drawn out and bloody, as even if you did conquer and colonize Texas, a large part of the population own guns and are pretty diehard.

I'm not buying it. I don't think it would come to war, this isn't the 1850's. I think if the people of Texas overwhelmingly wanted to secede, it would happen peacefully a la Scotland.

There doesn't have to be a "war". All we have to do is enact sanctions, refuse to recognize any Texas sovereignty, and remove all military funds into Texas (setup US bases there as not being allowed to get all their goods onbase, rather than off, do many of the things that have already been mentioned). Opposition doesn't have to result in violence unless Texas started it, although I'm sure they would claim it was justified due to the sanctions that would be likely to be imposed and the lack of recognition of their sovereignty as a nation on their own.
 
Just realism. The American Public didn't have the stomach to finish out wars in Vietnam or Iraq...but you think they're going to sit happily by and watch friends, relatives, neighbors and loved ones get butchered?

Never happen.

LOL realism? Whatever
 
There doesn't have to be a "war". All we have to do is enact sanctions, refuse to recognize any Texas sovereignty, and remove all military funds into Texas (setup US bases there as not being allowed to get all their goods onbase, rather than off, do many of the things that have already been mentioned). Opposition doesn't have to result in violence unless Texas started it, although I'm sure they would claim it was justified due to the sanctions that would be likely to be imposed and the lack of recognition of their sovereignty as a nation on their own.

And crash your own economy in the process? Where do you think you get your oil from? Where do you think the refineries and pipelines are? You'd have to shut down every Exon station in the United States, you'd not have semiconductors, and your military industrial complex (MacArthur Douglas, Raytheon, etc) are all headquartered in Texas

We dominate the Fortune 500 with 53 companies. You gonna sanction them all?

Would be economic suicide for both sides, as well as a national security risk, and hence would never happen.
 
Just realism. The American Public didn't have the stomach to finish out wars in Vietnam or Iraq...but you think they're going to sit happily by and watch friends, relatives, neighbors and loved ones get butchered?

Never happen.

There is no way they would "sit happily by" and allow their friends, relatives, neighbors, and loved ones get ousted from their property, or give up their US citizenship just because a "majority" of Texans wished to secede.

Plus, most Americans recognize the problems that would inherently come with such an action. There would have to be some sort of agreement to such an action on a federal level, something that would not be likely to occur. Therefore, the proposition would face opposition, likely in the form of penalties placed on Texas when it comes to federal funding, and some of those already described. Texas could not live as a nation on its own without the US government agreeing to such a division from the start.
 
And crash your own economy in the process? Where do you think you get your oil from? Where do you think the refineries and pipelines are? You'd have to shut down every Exon station in the United States, you'd not have semiconductors, and your military industrial complex (MacArthur Douglas, Raytheon, etc) are all headquartered in Texas

We dominate the Fortune 500 with 53 companies. You gonna sanction them all?

Would be economic suicide for both sides, as well as a national security risk, and hence would never happen.

Do you really think those companies would agree to the secession? Almost certainly not. They would leave Texas in a heartbeat before agreeing to secession with Texas, or work to help the US to oppose Texas, selling their oil to the US, without paying anything to Texas. There are plenty of things that the companies could do, because there is no way that those companies, or those major oil producers would support Texas in sovereignty.
 
There is no way they would "sit happily by" and allow their friends, relatives, neighbors, and loved ones get ousted from their property, or give up their US citizenship just because a "majority" of Texans wished to secede.

Plus, most Americans recognize the problems that would inherently come with such an action. There would have to be some sort of agreement to such an action on a federal level, something that would not be likely to occur. Therefore, the proposition would face opposition, likely in the form of penalties placed on Texas when it comes to federal funding, and some of those already described. Texas could not live as a nation on its own without the US government agreeing to such a division from the start.

Texas couldn't make it on its own?

I don't think you're taking an honest look at the scope of Texas' economy. If we were our own country, we'd have the 14tg largest economy in the world.

The economy and population of Texas is roughly equivalent in size to that of Canada. We have a population of nearly 30 million, with two of the nation's top 5 metro areas being in the state. Texas is home to 53 Fortune 500 companies, or one out of every ten of the workd's largest corporations. We have an abundance of natural resources, and major shipping access via the Gulf of Mexico.

Texas is probably the largest and most important contributor to the overall American economy, rivaled only by California in that respect. We would do just fine, just as Canada does just fine, and similar sized European countries do just fine.
 
Do you really think those companies would agree to the secession? Almost certainly not. They would leave Texas in a heartbeat before agreeing to secession with Texas, or work to help the US to oppose Texas, selling their oil to the US, without paying anything to Texas. There are plenty of things that the companies could do, because there is no way that those companies, or those major oil producers would support Texas in sovereignty.

Have you thought that through? How would they physically sell their oil? You can't pick up an oilfield and move it. A refinery takes a decade to build and is a multi billion dollar investment. These companies are headquartered in billion dollar skyscrapers and are chiefly run by Texans. They couldn't just pick up and move.

Conversely, I'm sure a lot of Anerican companies would be attracted to a Texas which surely would have a lower corporate tax rate and be more business friendly,being that we're conservatives and all
 
Have you thought that through? How would they physically sell their oil? You can't pick up an oilfield and move it. A refinery takes a decade to build and is a multi billion dollar investment. These companies are headquartered in billion dollar skyscrapers and are chiefly run by Texans. They couldn't just pick up and move.

Conversely, I'm sure a lot of Anerican companies would be attracted to a Texas which surely would have a lower corporate tax rate and be more business friendly,being that we're conservatives and all

You are greatly overestimating Texas and underestimating the abilities of the US to cut Texas off. It wouldn't take long. There is no chance of those businesses moving immediately to Texas, and in that time, the US government could do a lot of damage to Texas and any company choosing to agree to secession.
 
Texas couldn't make it on its own?

I don't think you're taking an honest look at the scope of Texas' economy. If we were our own country, we'd have the 14tg largest economy in the world.

The economy and population of Texas is roughly equivalent in size to that of Canada. We have a population of nearly 30 million, with two of the nation's top 5 metro areas being in the state. Texas is home to 53 Fortune 500 companies, or one out of every ten of the workd's largest corporations. We have an abundance of natural resources, and major shipping access via the Gulf of Mexico.

Texas is probably the largest and most important contributor to the overall American economy, rivaled only by California in that respect. We would do just fine, just as Canada does just fine, and similar sized European countries do just fine.

The economy of Texas is very much dependent on the US supplying many things, including business deals, open access to airspace, waterways, and many other things. There is plenty that can be done to cut off Texas, and ruin its economy til they had to give in.
 
Secessionists have never been realists. It's an emotion-driven ideology. They resort to cussing at individuals who start to rationalize actual secession. They have no actual logic. It's all emotion with no plan. They don't even factor in the racial demographics of Texas or places that are critical to Texas such as Houston which is full of blacks and mexicans. They aren't rational.
 
You are greatly overestimating Texas and underestimating the abilities of the US to cut Texas off. It wouldn't take long. There is no chance of those businesses moving immediately to Texas, and in that time, the US government could do a lot of damage to Texas and any company choosing to agree to secession.

Sanctions would undeniably do a lot of damage to Texas, but they would unarguably cripple the U.S. as well.

Texas has you by the balls, so any retaliatory action such as sanctions or war would devastate the U.S. and would be politically untenable.

Aside from oil, the lack of which would grind the entire U.S. economy to a halt, you're talking something worse than the Great Depression if 53 of the Fortune 500 were suddenly blacklisted, sanctioned, and removed from the DOW.

Wall Street would crash. Powerful people, political backers, would lose a lot of money. Retirement funds would go poof. People would be pissed off and angry.

No president would allow that.
 
You think the rest of the nation would go to war with Texas, if we peacefully and democratically elected to withdraw via a statewide referendum?

Why?

I don't think the American people have that kind of bloodlust.

I don't think you could get the general public to back a war which would A.) take the lives of countless relatives, friends, and loved ones of those on both sides B.) which would inevitably spill over to other states where people live and C.) which would inevitably be drawn out and bloody, as even if you did conquer and colonize Texas, a large part of the population own guns and are pretty diehard.

I'm not buying it. I don't think it would come to war, this isn't the 1850's. I think if the people of Texas overwhelmingly wanted to secede, it would happen peacefully a la Scotland.

I don't think it would come to that either... but I dunno, from reading the folks in this thread, I think we've underestimated the blood-lust... these folks can't even conceive of a peaceful secession... the only things in their heads is war, destruction, slaughter, and blood.
 
You are greatly overestimating Texas and underestimating the abilities of the US to cut Texas off. It wouldn't take long. There is no chance of those businesses moving immediately to Texas, and in that time, the US government could do a lot of damage to Texas and any company choosing to agree to secession.

Sanctions would undeniably do a lot of damage to Texas, but they would unarguably cripple the U.S. as well.

Texas has you by the balls, so any retaliatory action such as sanctions or war would devastate the U.S. and would be politically untenable.

Aside from oil, the lack of which would grind the entire U.S. economy to a halt, you're talking something worse than the Great Depression if 53 of the Fortune 500 were suddenly blacklisted, sanctioned, and removed from the DOW.

Wall Street would crash. Powerful people, political backers, would lose a lot of money. Retirement funds would go poof. People would be pissed off and angry.

No president would allow that.
 
Sanctions would undeniably do a lot of damage to Texas, but they would unarguably cripple the U.S. as well.

Texas has you by the balls, so any retaliatory action such as sanctions or war would devastate the U.S. and would be politically untenable.

Aside from oil, the lack of which would grind the entire U.S. economy to a halt, you're talking something worse than the Great Depression if 53 of the Fortune 500 were suddenly blacklisted, sanctioned, and removed from the DOW.

Wall Street would crash. Powerful people, political backers, would lose a lot of money. Retirement funds would go poof. People would be pissed off and angry.

No president would allow that.

Bull ****. Texas doesn't have any one "by the balls" because the US can last a whole lot longer without Texas than Texas can with sanctions imposed.

And the same thing you describe happening would happen anyway if Texas left the US, so it would be a losing situation for the US to allow Texas to leave anyway.

Show me which Fortune 500 companies would support Texas secession from the US first. Not just those that are based in Texas, but actually would support a secession. Evidence of this support please.
 
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