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Is banning convicted felons from voting compliant with the constitution?

Is banning felons from voting constitutional?

  • Yes. Felons should lose their right to vote under the constitution during and after incarceration.

    Votes: 7 20.6%
  • Felons constitutionally lose their right to vote only during incarceration.

    Votes: 15 44.1%
  • There is no constitutional justification to ban felons from voting during or after incarceration

    Votes: 12 35.3%
  • Stop using the race card!

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    34

Smeagol

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First, let me say I have traditionally opposed felons having the right to vote. However, in 2012 with what seemed to ME to be deliberate efforts to create obstacles for certain people to vote based on how they are likely to vote, I began to ponder the legality to restrictions and hindrances to voting and the one man one vote concept. I might be missing something, admittedly, but I see nothing in the constitution that justifies stripping an an American citizen of their civil rights with the exception of involuntary servitude specifically limited to the duration of their sentance. This means, if I'm correct felons have a right to vote after their incarceration. I also believe, not based on any personal desire or agenda but objective understanding of what US citizenship affords, specifically equal protection under the law; felons currently incarcerated also have a right to vote no different than their rights to access to the courts.

Have fun responding. :)
 
I could see the argument for forbidding felons who are still serving their time from voting but I feel that once you finish your prison time you should have every single right to vote.
 
I don't think it is necessarily unconstitutional as the right was stripped through "due process". But I do think it is wrong. Once you have paid your debt to society I think all rights should be reinstated. If they are on probation that is different as their debt is still being paid.
 
Once their time is served all rights and I mean all rights need to be restored to them.
 
Once their time is served all rights and I mean all rights need to be restored to them.

The attorney leading the push for felons to get their voting rights back is former NAACP legal counsel Pamela Karlan of Stanford Law's faculty and a well known brilliant (btw she would have been a far better choice than Kagan for the USSC if you wanted a far left lesbian liberal-she's one of the 5-6 smartest people I know). At the Taft annual lecture at the local law school she said if felons could have voted in Florida, Al Gore would have won easily since the vast majority of felons support Democrats when and they vote.

I asked her if she was equally supportive of said felons being restored state and federal 2A rights as well. The evasion was priceless but since Professor Karlan doesn't believe that there is such an individual right I expected it
 
First, let me say I have traditionally opposed felons having the right to vote. However, in 2012 with what seemed to ME to be deliberate efforts to create obstacles for certain people to vote based on how they are likely to vote, I began to ponder the legality to restrictions and hindrances to voting and the one man one vote concept. I might be missing something, admittedly, but I see nothing in the constitution that justifies stripping an an American citizen of their civil rights with the exception of involuntary servitude specifically limited to the duration of their sentance. This means, if I'm correct felons have a right to vote after their incarceration. I also believe, not based on any personal desire or agenda but objective understanding of what US citizenship affords, specifically equal protection under the law; felons currently incarcerated also have a right to vote no different than their rights to access to the courts.

Have fun responding. :)

My "fun" begins with the folks that take the opposite position when it comes to efforts to suppress the 2A right(s) or the ability (privilege?) to secure government employment. The rationale that a prior felony conviction deserves a lifetime sentence of reduced rights/privileges is by no means limited to the right/privilege to vote (at the state level). You make an excellent point that only some rights/privileges are denied (past the "due process" sentence term) due to a felony conviction - amounting to a one strike and you are out mentality.
 
The attorney leading the push for felons to get their voting rights back is former NAACP legal counsel Pamela Karlan of Stanford Law's faculty and a well known brilliant (btw she would have been a far better choice than Kagan for the USSC if you wanted a far left lesbian liberal-she's one of the 5-6 smartest people I know). At the Taft annual lecture at the local law school she said if felons could have voted in Florida, Al Gore would have won easily since the vast majority of felons support Democrats when and they vote.

I asked her if she was equally supportive of said felons being restored state and federal 2A rights as well. The evasion was priceless but since Professor Karlan doesn't believe that there is such an individual right I expected it

Dems only support that which gives more power. Personally I don't care how they vote. Once your no longer a prisoner all rights should be restored, Your rights are only taken from by due process during time as a guest of that state.
 
Dems only support that which gives more power. Personally I don't care how they vote. Once your no longer a prisoner all rights should be restored, Your rights are only taken from by due process during time as a guest of that state.

Wait for those that see the exact opposite as "fair" (only?) when it comes to gun control. ;)
 
Dems only support that which gives more power. Personally I don't care how they vote. Once your no longer a prisoner all rights should be restored, Your rights are only taken from by due process during time as a guest of that state.

yeah the don't trust them to have guns but they sure trust them to vote for the nanny state. then again the attitudes of criminals and the left have much in common including the attitude that the property of others is something they are entitled to


and both don't want armed tax payers!
 
First, let me say I have traditionally opposed felons having the right to vote. However, in 2012 with what seemed to ME to be deliberate efforts to create obstacles for certain people to vote based on how they are likely to vote, I began to ponder the legality to restrictions and hindrances to voting and the one man one vote concept. I might be missing something, admittedly, but I see nothing in the constitution that justifies stripping an an American citizen of their civil rights with the exception of involuntary servitude specifically limited to the duration of their sentance. This means, if I'm correct felons have a right to vote after their incarceration. I also believe, not based on any personal desire or agenda but objective understanding of what US citizenship affords, specifically equal protection under the law; felons currently incarcerated also have a right to vote no different than their rights to access to the courts.

Have fun responding. :)

We seem to have a bigger problem that is not really covered in the polling as a result.

Our biggest problem is no where in our Constitution is the explicit statement "right to vote." I would agree that we have the 15th, 19th, and 26th Amendments that forbid discrimination in voting (or denial to vote) based on race, or sex, or age. But, we have no real Constitutional documentation that by language guarantees American citizens the right to vote. Consequently we have no real Constitutional documentation that defines who is eligible to vote. Because of that we have election jurisdictions were there is legal precedence for State's rights and local controls. We may have a right under State Constitutionality to vote but based on that State's laws. Which explains why some states keep convicted felons from voting regardless of their disposition with the Prison system (i.e. still in jail, on parole, free from condition.) Other States do allow convicted felons ability to vote but based on that disposition. For instance California allows a convicted felon the right to vote after prison sentence and parole term. However, as another example DC allows voting right after prison sentence (meaning on parole or even while on probation a convicted felon can vote.) Maine and Vermont allows a convicted felon the right to vote while still in prison.

Because of this disparity and in conjunction with what our Federal Constitution does and more importantly does not say I am unsure there is a valid argument that at the Federal level it is "unconstitutional" to prevent convicted felons from voting. Your voting options are then voided as we have no real "right to vote." Just several amendments saying who cannot be restricted from voting based on those three standards thus far. Based on how all three were argued, I do not see enough correlation to make that argument work for convicted felons either.
 
Wait for those that see the exact opposite as "fair" (only?) when it comes to gun control. ;)

I don't think those who are living off the government tit ought to have a say in how that tit is funded myself. If a felon has served his time and is a productive citizen he should be able to vote. If he's living on welfare (like many are-sadly due to the fact that many cannot get jobs due to either the fact they are felons or the fact that they never had any skills to start with and thus they became mopes) I don't want him voting: record or no record
 
I don't think those who are living off the government tit ought to have a say in how that tit is funded myself. If a felon has served his time and is a productive citizen he should be able to vote. If he's living on welfare (like many are-sadly due to the fact that many cannot get jobs due to either the fact they are felons or the fact that they never had any skills to start with and thus they became mopes) I don't want him voting: record or no record
Interesting that you consider welfare recipients lower than convicted criminals.
 
First, let me say I have traditionally opposed felons having the right to vote. However, in 2012 with what seemed to ME to be deliberate efforts to create obstacles for certain people to vote based on how they are likely to vote, I began to ponder the legality to restrictions and hindrances to voting and the one man one vote concept. I might be missing something, admittedly, but I see nothing in the constitution that justifies stripping an an American citizen of their civil rights with the exception of involuntary servitude specifically limited to the duration of their sentance. This means, if I'm correct felons have a right to vote after their incarceration. I also believe, not based on any personal desire or agenda but objective understanding of what US citizenship affords, specifically equal protection under the law; felons currently incarcerated also have a right to vote no different than their rights to access to the courts.

Have fun responding. :)

You're wrong. The 14th Amendment specifically allows criminals to be deprived of the vote.

As far as how things should be, once felons have done their time (including parole and probation), they should be allowed to vote in local elections provided that they're land owning Christians.
 
I don't think those who are living off the government tit ought to have a say in how that tit is funded myself. If a felon has served his time and is a productive citizen he should be able to vote. If he's living on welfare (like many are-sadly due to the fact that many cannot get jobs due to either the fact they are felons or the fact that they never had any skills to start with and thus they became mopes) I don't want him voting: record or no record

I disagree with that concept since nothing in the constitution limits (or grants) constitutional rights in such a manner. It is not a crime, that I am aware of, to not be "productive" - what you describe comes too close to a literacy test or a poll tax to deny "them" the right to vote. What of the disabled (short or long term), those receiving SS/Medicare or government pensions? I think it best to have only "due process" used to define a period of time (or monetary amount) as a sentence, and once satisfying that sentence alone, then one's rights are no longer subject to limitations.
 
I disagree with that concept since nothing in the constitution limits (or grants) constitutional rights in such a manner. It is not a crime, that I am aware of, to not be "productive" - what you describe comes too close to a literacy test or a poll tax to deny "them" the right to vote. What of the disabled (short or long term), those receiving SS/Medicare or government pensions? I think it best to have only "due process" used to define a period of time (or monetary amount) as a sentence, and once satisfying that sentence alone, then one's rights are no longer subject to limitations.

actually nothing actually requires a right to vote. The 17th amendment is an abomination and we need to get rid of it. But the point I was making is that former felon status doesn't mean much to me
 
I don't think those who are living off the government tit ought to have a say in how that tit is funded myself.

I agree. The influence of big business in government should be removed. Anyone who owns or runs a business that receives government funding/subsidies/etc should be banned from participating in the political process.
 
actually nothing actually requires a right to vote. The 17th amendment is an abomination and we need to get rid of it. But the point I was making is that former felon status doesn't mean much to me

Paying taxes doesn't mean much to me. ;)
 
I agree. The influence of big business in government should be removed. Anyone who owns or runs a business that receives government funding/subsidies/etc should be banned from participating in the political process.

That's just plain stupid leaping lizard man:mrgreen:

the government lives off of businesses, not the other way around
 
as opposed to licensing fees for CCW?:mrgreen:

That is not an opposite view - that is the supporting view. Rights are not granted (or denied) by paying (or not paying) fees/taxes. The only possible exception is for not paying a court ordered (due process) fine or victim restitution, which can then be used to assign an alternate sentence.
 
That is not an opposite view - that is the supporting view. Rights are not granted (or denied) by paying (or not paying) fees/taxes. The only possible exception is for not paying a court ordered (due process) fine or victim restitution, which can then be used to assign an alternate sentence.

The problem here is that you're assuming voting to be a right. This is incorrect.
 
I could see the argument for forbidding felons who are still serving their time from voting but I feel that once you finish your prison time you should have every single right to vote.

Im pretty much in agreement, I can't imagine being permenantly dehumanized and deprived of responsibility in such a way being good for the rehabilitation process, which kind of defeats of the object of prison.
 
I don't think those who are living off the government tit ought to have a say in how that tit is funded myself. If a felon has served his time and is a productive citizen he should be able to vote. If he's living on welfare (like many are-sadly due to the fact that many cannot get jobs due to either the fact they are felons or the fact that they never had any skills to start with and thus they became mopes) I don't want him voting: record or no record

Yeah, any one using any government service should not be allowed to vote. You drive on a government funded road, you do not get to vote. Just ****ing brilliant.

And yes, I do realize you mean just those people you don't like who get benefits from the government...
 
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