View Poll Results: Should transwomen be legally trreated as women?

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  • Yes

    77 47.53%
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    63 38.89%
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    11 6.79%
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Thread: Should transwomen be legally treated as women?[W:165,1392]

  1. #261
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    Re: Should transwomen be legally treated as women?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    I know, you want to argue nudity and shared showers and anybody that has a problem with that is irrational and a bigot... I mean, you walked around naked and used to change in front of twenty sailers and were not attacked so everybody's got to feel the same or else we are irrational. Got it. Anything else?
    No. There are absolutely no stats to show that it is dangerous to a woman to have transgendered women changing in the locker rooms with them or for a policy that allows people into the locker room of the gender they identify as. And the women using the locker room, do not own the locker room. They don't get to make the policy about who uses it, the owners do.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  2. #262
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    Re: Should transwomen be legally treated as women?

    Quote Originally Posted by MildSteel View Post
    Please note your use of the word "IF."
    That is of no importance to the case in question. The individual is a man and from the sounds of it they were married before surgery.

  3. #263
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    Re: Should transwomen be legally treated as women?

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    No. There are absolutely no stats to show that it is dangerous to a woman to have transgendered women changing in the locker rooms with them or for a policy that allows people into the locker room of the gender they identify as. And the women using the locker room, do not own the locker room. They don't get to make the policy about who uses it, the owners do.
    As if you really support the owner making that decision.

  4. #264
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    Re: Should transwomen be legally treated as women?

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Yes they are. You're letting appearances deceive you.
    Says the one who determines gender by the presence of a penis.
    Don't work out, work in.

    Never eat anything that's served in a bucket.

  5. #265
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    Re: Should transwomen be legally treated as women?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    I know, you want to argue nudity and shared showers and anybody that has a problem with that is irrational and a bigot... I mean, you walked around naked and used to change in front of twenty sailers and were not attacked so everybody's got to feel the same or else we are irrational. Got it. Anything else?
    Do you believe that story of hers? I don't.

  6. #266
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    Re: Should transwomen be legally treated as women?

    Quote Originally Posted by Manc Skipper View Post
    Says the one who determines gender by the presence of a penis.
    Say what? Well appearances can be deceiving. These days that life lesson is more important than ever thanks to improper medical treatment.

    Edit: Lol, I can't believe I typed conceiving first.

  7. #267
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    Re: Should transwomen be legally treated as women?

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    That is of no importance to the case in question. The individual is a man and from the sounds of it they were married before surgery.
    Which would make a difference to the charge of "fraud" and could very well make a difference when it comes to the case being revisited by the court with new court rulings dealing with marriage.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  8. #268
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    Re: Should transwomen be legally treated as women?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    Biologically they are. A penis makes a person a male. I am not out to hurt anybody's feelings, just to state a fact.

    So the poor guy who's had his amputated due to cancer (yes, it happens) is no longer male?

    Come on Bod, these issues are never that black and white. Gender identity, like sexuality, is so much to do with what you feel inside.
    "C'est le dernier qui a parlé qui a raison"
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  9. #269
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    Re: Should transwomen be legally treated as women?

    Just the facts of the matter. In genetically healthy individuals XY results in the male sex and that cannot be changed. Physiologically and hard coded in the indivudual's DNA their body is male. Similarly XX is female. No amount of surgery, self presentation or self image can change a person's biological sex. You and your body forever carry's those genes and DNA testing of your cells will lead someone to believe you are male or female regardless of how the body may be surgically or hormonally altered.

    Legal differentiation exists in some cases directly due to the fact that real men and women are biologically different from each other with issues facing each sex. Women can get pregnancy coverage from insurance and for other women's health issues, men may get prostate cancer, women (if not infertile) may become pregnant and have different rights and regulations pertaining to reproduction, women also are not forced to sign up for selective service while men are. There are biological changes, and altering your original genitals/body to mimic what the opposite sex has will not result in functional ones. An XY man is not going to have ovaries, a uterus, or a true "vagina." They have an altered form of what they were born with. An XX woman is never going to have a penis, testicles, a prostate or other organs specific to men. The fact is, in genetically healthy individuals your sex never changes and XY denotes male while XX denotes female, there is no changing that. The fact remains that many legal differences between men and women are due to our bodies being different with reproductive health being a major player. A transgender individual will not have the functioning reproductive organs of their desired sex, nor can they ever biologically be their desired sex. Should a transwoman take out pregnancy coverage? Should they be on birth control to prevent pregnancy? Should doctors and others know that they have no internal female organs when making treatment decisions? Should they have rights/privileges afforded to them that are given to women on the basis of biology like free birth control even though there is no real use for it in them?

    From a personal/social standpoint there are gender roles given by society that aren't really dependent upon biology. One may alter their bodies to mimic that of the opposite sex and aesthetically pass as the opposite sex. Their self defined gender is part of their personal identity and is their personal right. I believe in the right to pursue happiness and in my view a man saying he is a woman, going through the surgery on their own choice and presenting how they want to as their own choice is their right and doesn't really harm anyone as far as their personal choice is concerned. I think the government should accommodate their desired sex by allowing fully transitioned individuals to designate themselves as M or F on legal documents, but I do think distinction that they are trans should be made because there are fundamental differences between a trans person and someone who identifies with their birth sex. The two are not the same, a transwoman is not a real biological woman and visa versa. To ignore the facts and supplant them with this hyper-pro LGBT mindset that dictates they are absolutely without a doubt equal and same as their desired sex is not merited or rational. As far as legal recognition goes, they aren't biologically female. To pass off as one and then offer them pregnancy coverage, try to avoid the draft (pre-transition), wanting to denote themselves as a "mother" of a previous biological child or demand restroom use or other such things shouldn't be legally protected nor should the government entertain their personal identity when the biological facts go against that. When it comes to issues of identity like what your license says, how you name yourself (Ms. Mrs.) and other legal things that should be recognized.

    Bottom line though, they have the right to be trans and people shouldn't stop them. But they also should never have the right to demand that others recognize their status, force their identity and definition of gender upon others or be recognized biologically as anything other than their birth sex.
    Last edited by digsbe; 04-10-15 at 12:00 AM.
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  10. #270
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    Re: Should transwomen be legally treated as women?

    It's rare for me to say so about such a long detailed post, but Digsbe's manifesto up there EXACTLY matches my position.

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