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Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?[W:296, 650]

Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?


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I heard someone make the argument that Obama doesn't believe the US has any rightful role in preventing or hindering Iran from developing and maintaining nuclear weapons. I don't know that that's true, and nobody but the President can answer to what he believes, so I'll ask what you believe. If Iran has the ability, does it have the "right" to nuclear weapons? (By "right", I mean the U.S. and other nations would not be unjustified in trying to prevent it.)

working on the poll
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

I think the answer really depends on your point of view.

Should they have them?

Absolutely ****ing not.

I think that we as a collection of nations (The West) in our best interests should not allow Iran to obtain a nuclear weapon.

But lets not kid ourselves.

Their desire for a Nuclear Weapon isn't entirely to do with some apocalyptic desire to incinerate Israel and all non believers or whatever colorful language the regime decides to use for the day... it's about the survival of the regime.

For North Korea and Iran it's more about gaining the ultimate deterrence against what they perceive as an imminent invasion and destruction of their governments as well as gaining influence of course.

Ultimately both governments are extremely abhorrent to any civilized order or proliferation of basic human rights in the world and must one day, face the axe... especially in the case of the North Koreans.

But to do that... is no easy task.

Lots of blood, lots of treasure.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

I heard someone make the argument that Obama doesn't believe the US has any rightful role in preventing or hindering Iran from developing and maintaining nuclear weapons. I don't know that that's true, and nobody but the President can answer to what he believes, so I'll ask what you believe. If Iran has the ability, does it have the "right" to nuclear weapons? (By "right", I mean the U.S. and other nations would not be unjustified in trying to prevent it.)

working on the poll

From a Realist perspective, they have the "right" to whatever they can get away with.

We, in turn, have the "right" to impede them in such pursuits if it goes against our own interests.

At the end of the day, it's really as simple as that. Iran has an agenda, and we have an agenda. Unfortunately, those agendas simply happen to be mutually incompatible.

May the best nation win. :shrug:
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

Iran could conceivably already possess several nuclear devices and possibly a means to deliver.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

From a Realist perspective, they have the "right" to whatever they can get away with.

We, in turn, have the "right" to impede them in such pursuits if it goes against our own interests.

So God gave men the "right" to defend themselves.

But governments have the right, assuming they have the power, to take that God-given "right" away.

Don't let the folks over in the 2A forum know that a "very conservative" fella like yourself is spewing this liberal hogwash.

:mrgreen:
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

What is the one country that has actually used such weapons aggressively? I don't see how the US has justifiable say in the matter and will just be ignored anyway

The concern is always that rogue elements like ISIS will take advantage, but that is actually very contrary to iran's own interests.

Does israel have right to be concerned? Absolutely, and so it will continue to play out in the form of israeli agents whacking iranian scientists. For me to have a problem with such a focused attack, the iranian leaders would have to give up the explicit threats like "eliminate the zionist regime" that have been condemned by the UN and EU, something that would be very difficult to do with any believable sincerity
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

Their desire for a Nuclear Weapon isn't entirely to do with some apocalyptic desire to incinerate Israel and all non believers or whatever colorful language the regime decides to use for the day... it's about the survival of the regime.

i believe that as well, so there's no reason for outside interference, but also not worth the risk for israel to do nothing at all in response to such threats
 
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Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

Iran has as much right to nukes as anyone else. Nations with nukes don't get invaded, so it is understandable that they want them. I know of no principal that denies their right to have them while others have them. In my opinion, no one has a right to have them or use them. Using them is genocide.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

I really don't care if Iran has nukes or not. Certainly, they have entirely valid reasons for wanting them, after all, Israel and the west haven't treated them particularly well, they have every reason to distrust us and I don't blame them a bit. Heck, I probably trust our own government, with the yahoo Jesus squad anywhere near the big red button, less than I would trust Iran.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

No one has the right to have nukes.

But if one country has the "right", then all must have the "right".
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

Well, I find it a bit odd that people express so much fear about Iran possessing nuke capabilities and don't see the need to shut down Pakistan's nuke bomb program. That's a disaster waiting to happen. In fact, I would worry much more about Pakistan than say North Korea or Iran (at this particular moment). Radical groups like ISIS - already know where their prize is. They don't have to wait for nuke programs to be developed in the Middle East. It's there for the taking. Pakistani government officials don't have all that much control over the bombs they have. And Pakistan has, on a number of occasions, threatened to nuke India.

But to answer the poll. No, Iran shouldn't have a nuke bomb program.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

You might as well ask if Nazi Germany had a right to take over most of Europe to gain lebensraum. Sometimes you only have a right to a thing if you can make it stick.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

You might as well ask if Nazi Germany had a right to take over most of Europe to gain lebensraum. Sometimes you only have a right to a thing if you can make it stick.

Nobody has a "right" to nuclear weapons, they only have the "ability" to have them. People spend way too much time concerned with "rights", which really don't exist.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

I heard someone make the argument that Obama doesn't believe the US has any rightful role in preventing or hindering Iran from developing and maintaining nuclear weapons. I don't know that that's true, and nobody but the President can answer to what he believes, so I'll ask what you believe. If Iran has the ability, does it have the "right" to nuclear weapons? (By "right", I mean the U.S. and other nations would not be unjustified in trying to prevent it.)

working on the poll

Rights are claimed, demanded. I suppose Iran has the right to do whatever they wish, even create a nuclear weapon. It would be much better if we were talking about the elimination of nuclear weapons, completely, seems that's yet far off though. If anybody has a right to them, then everybody has a right to them. And if Iran is to be denied them on the merits that they might use them, then certainly the only country that ever has used them ought to have them taken away so that they're not used again.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

From a Realist perspective, they have the "right" to whatever they can get away with.

We, in turn, have the "right" to impede them in such pursuits if it goes against our own interests.

At the end of the day, it's really as simple as that. Iran has an agenda, and we have an agenda. Unfortunately, those agendas simply happen to be mutually incompatible.

May the best nation win. :shrug:

The best? Or the militarily strongest nation, the one with nukes and a history of using them?
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

Iran could conceivably already possess several nuclear devices and possibly a means to deliver.

You're privy to knowledge unknown to both US and Israeli intelligence services?
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

I am going to go with "other" on this one, mainly because of the inherent flaws with the Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons.

I think India's complaint was best phrased. Basically their lack of interest in signing the agreement was not because of its lack of commitment for non-proliferation, but rather because the treaty was flawed enough that it did not explicitly suggest a universal and non-discriminatory application of the agreement. Because of, it is easy to argue that the current treaty creates an exclusive club of those with these weapons and a much larger group of those without. But the treaty does not do a very good job in suggesting the ethical or moral grounds for why there is a distinction of those nations "trusted" with them vs. the grounds for other nations to not be trusted.

Basically, the whole thing is hypocritical making this poll a bit nonsensical because of how useless these agreements are. Plenty of nations still have nukes, most under the agreement but a few who never signed it. While I would not be thrilled at all for Iran to have a nuclear weapon we have some underline flaws in determining why, especially with a nation like Iran who also has signed it but never really stayed in compliance to the content of most the UN Security Council.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

Well, I find it a bit odd that people express so much fear about Iran possessing nuke capabilities and don't see the need to shut down Pakistan's nuke bomb program. That's a disaster waiting to happen. In fact, I would worry much more about Pakistan than say North Korea or Iran (at this particular moment). Radical groups like ISIS - already know where their prize is. They don't have to wait for nuke programs to be developed in the Middle East. It's there for the taking. Pakistani government officials don't have all that much control over the bombs they have. And Pakistan has, on a number of occasions, threatened to nuke India.

But to answer the poll. No, Iran shouldn't have a nuke bomb program.

There's no doubt that the Pakistani nuclear program is a dangerous thing, and that the fear that any nuclear weapon they may hold might fall to the wrong hands is a rational and logical one - but in the case of Iran there isn't even the fear that it might fall to the wrong hands as it already will be in the wrong hands.

There is not much difference between the Iranian government, which is really the largest representative of radical Shiite Islam, and organizations such as ISIS, Boko Haram, Hezbollah, al-Qaeda etc. The Iranian government including the revolutionary guard and the Mullahs are a branch of radical Islam and are just as dangerous as any of these organizations (and by the way Hezbollah is practically the Iranian government).

I see no logic at all in the words of those who are claiming that perhaps due to the fact that the Ayatollah and the rest are leading a nation they are somehow more rational or logical than these radical Islamic organizations. It doesn't make them more rational, it doesn't make them more logical, they are just as much as nutjobs as every other Islamic terrorist out there and letting them hold nuclear weapons will probably be the greatest mistake of modern age.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

No one has the right to have nukes.
But if one country has the "right", then all must have the "right".
Iran has as much right to nukes as anyone else. Nations with nukes don't get invaded, so it is understandable that they want them. I know of no principal that denies their right to have them while others have them. In my opinion, no one has a right to have them or use them. Using them is genocide.
Actually, the answer is a Clear Cut "No".

Iran Gave Away that "right" by signing the NPT.
It reaffirmed that Position/Treaty under a previous Revolutionary/post-1979 Govt, fully Knowing Israel had Nukes and they did not.
Iran would regain that "right" by withdrawing. (but would be admitting the obvious)

Conditions of the NPT are No weapons, but assistance with, but Supervised, Civilian Power acquisition.
Such as the EU offering to settle the whole issue 8 YEARS ago by giving Iran Free Off-site Enrichment, to guarantee Iran would Not Divert materials to a weapons program.
Iran refused.
This really is as Obvious as the OJ Trial.

It is SO tiring to EVERY Day hear the Numb-Nuts: "If they have them..."
And I do mean EVERY Day.

It's really a poll on Ignorance of issue.
And of course, despite reading my post, many will vote the opposite position withOut being able to challenge mine.
 
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Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

So God gave men the "right" to defend themselves.

But governments have the right, assuming they have the power, to take that God-given "right" away.

Don't let the folks over in the 2A forum know that a "very conservative" fella like yourself is spewing this liberal hogwash.

:mrgreen:

Well, actually... That's the whole reason the 2A exists in the first place. :lol:

If Government ever tries to exercise the power to oppress its people, the Founders hoped to ensure that they would be armed, so that they could (in theory, anyway) effectively resist that tyranny.

The best? Or the militarily strongest nation, the one with nukes and a history of using them?

Both. Obviously, I view the United States as being objectively superior to Iran with regards to prevailing ideology as well as long term motivations.

However, "victory" in this particular struggle will, undeniably, ultimately boil down to which side actually has the will, clout, and power to impose their own desires upon the situation one way or another.
 
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Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

I heard someone make the argument that Obama doesn't believe the US has any rightful role in preventing or hindering Iran from developing and maintaining nuclear weapons. I don't know that that's true, and nobody but the President can answer to what he believes, so I'll ask what you believe. If Iran has the ability, does it have the "right" to nuclear weapons? (By "right", I mean the U.S. and other nations would not be unjustified in trying to prevent it.)

working on the poll

Every nation has a right to further it's self interests. While Iran may have a right to nuclear weapons, the world has the right to limit trade with them and make it difficult or disadvantageous to develop them.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

Well, actually... That's the whole reason the 2A exists in the first place. :lol:

If Government ever tries to exercise the power to oppress the people, the Founders hoped to ensure that they would be armed, so that they could (in theory, anyway) effectively resist that tyranny.



Both. Obviously, I view the United States as being objectively superior to Iran both with regards to prevailing ideological and long term motivations.

However, "victory" in this particular struggle will, undeniably, ultimately boil down to which side actually has the will, clout, and power to impose their own desires on the situation one way or another.

Naw, U.S. is just like Iran, wait, scratch that. The U.S. is actually worse.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

I know the history of Iran's relationship with Russia, China , Pakistan and North Korea....all nuclear powers.

Then there's this:

Iran Unveils New Ground-Based Cruise Missile System > Strategic-Culture.org - Strategic Culture Foundation

Nice link. I didn't see the part about Iran and cruise missiles. I did however see the part about Germany's angst over the US's attempts to undermine their negotiated cease fire agreement with Russia, and the US's war agenda! Interesting. Conventional weapons can be used on cruise missiles too.
 
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