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Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?[W:296, 650]

Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?


  • Total voters
    118
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

It didn't work out well for Iraq. Though Israel "stifled" Saddam's WMD ambitions, Bush insisted that he still had them, and a gullible nation followed him into a senseless war, a war that cost a couple hundred thousand Iraqi lives and has left their country in ruins for a dozen years now.

Iraq Resolution. [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rationale_for_the_Iraq_War]


The U.S. stated that the intent was to remove "a regime that developed and used weapons of mass destruction, that harbored and supported terrorists, committed outrageous human rights abuses, and defied the just demands of the United Nations and the world"

Hardly all Bush's war.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

Your opponents arguments haven't really been that nations have a "right" to nuclear arms, it's been that it's insanely hypocritical for us to try to enforce massive sanctions and even threaten war over something we have and refuse to give up. It's not really surprising why Iran feels the need for nuclear weapons. We have them completely surrounded by dozens of bases and actively threaten them.

This isn't about world peace, it's about America trying to ensure its dominance. We have more nukes than every other country combined, minus Russia, and we're the only nation on earth to use them against human beings. Where is our moral high ground?

The moral high ground is that the US does not target civilians and does not commit atrocities while Iran does through its terror proxies. What happened 70 years ago isn't really an indication to the current American behavior, and if you believe that the US using nukes 70 years ago means anything regarding how they will use them in the future you're not thinking straight. Your comparison between a state ruled over by radical Islam and a Western democracy is thus invalid, and it's not hypocrisy to point out the differences between the two nations and why one holding nukes should be a hell of a bigger concern to us than the other.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

I really don't care if Iran has nukes or not. Certainly, they have entirely valid reasons for wanting them, after all, Israel and the west haven't treated them particularly well, they have every reason to distrust us and I don't blame them a bit. Heck, I probably trust our own government, with the yahoo Jesus squad anywhere near the big red button, less than I would trust Iran.

So the "Jesus squad" now wants to drop nukes on other nations?? How do you guys come up with this stuff?
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

The moral high ground is that the US does not target civilians and does not commit atrocities while Iran does through its terror proxies. What happened 70 years ago isn't really an indication to the current American behavior, and if you believe that the US using nukes 70 years ago means anything regarding how they will use them in the future you're not thinking straight. Your comparison between a state ruled over by radical Islam and a Western democracy is thus invalid, and it's not hypocrisy to point out the differences between the two nations and why one holding nukes should be a hell of a bigger concern to us than the other.

I'm not saying that I want them to have nukes, but what you sound like to Iranian ears is "We're going to do everything in our power to prevent YOU from having nuclear weapons, while we continue to be the world leader in nuclear weapon ownership." It's simply not going to convince them. We've surrounded them militarily and are making demands we don't even make of ourselves. This drives them to want it more.

I'd rather see an international push to reduce the number of nuclear arms world wide. Wouldn't it be a lot more convincing if we said "Look, everyone is disarming right now. Nukes are a bad idea and the international community agrees. You're not special, we're all doing this." Taking zero steps to disarm anyone except our enemies makes us look hypocritical and isn't going to convince them to cooperate.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

I'm not saying that I want them to have nukes, but what you sound like to Iranian ears is "We're going to do everything in our power to prevent YOU from having nuclear weapons, while we continue to be the world leader in nuclear weapon ownership." It's simply not going to convince them. We've surrounded them militarily and are making demands we don't even make of ourselves. This drives them to want it more.

I'd rather see an international push to reduce the number of nuclear arms world wide. Wouldn't it be a lot more convincing if we said "Look, everyone is disarming right now. Nukes are a bad idea and the international community agrees. You're not special, we're all doing this." Taking zero steps to disarm anyone except our enemies makes us look hypocritical and isn't going to convince them to cooperate.

Yeah only that when we're talking about 'Iranian ears' we're really just talking about the Ayatollah's ears, not those of the Iranian people, since Iran is a theocracy practically ruled over by a single person. So is what Iranians feel really relevant?

As to the argument regarding how the West should disarm itself from nukes before preaching to Iran - it's really nice to wish that one day everyone will be disarmed from these horrible weapons, but it's not going to happen. Just like disarming everyone in the world from small arms is not going to happen. If we in the West decide tomorrow to throw all of our nukes to the sea, who ensures us that Russia, China, Pakistan, North Korea, etc. will drop theirs? Who ensures us that in the future countries like Iran, Saudi Arabia, Syria, etc. won't try to have their own when we would no longer have ours? So what are we supposed to do, gamble on it?
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

If Iran has the ability, does it have the "right" to nuclear weapons? (By "right", I mean the U.S. and other nations would be unjustified in trying to prevent it.)

I'd have to say NO. I firmly believe that an Iran with nukes would be dangerous based on how heated their rhetoric has been against America and Israel. However, I wouldn't have a problem with Iran having nuclear energy. Some folks might disagree with this if for no other reason than it's too tempting for a (tyrannical) government to take that next step and go from low-grade uranium enrichment to weapons grade enrichment, but I think if Iran changes its ways AND the right inspection parameters are in place this can be prevented. Same could be said of North Korea.

Both are long shots, but from the reports I'm reading it would appear than Iran has become far more cooperative and has been compliant with the IAEA w/nuclear facility inspections since 2013 than NKor has ever been.
 
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Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

Actually, the answer is a Clear Cut "No".

Iran Gave Away that "right" by signing the NPT.
It reaffirmed that Position/Treaty under a previous Revolutionary/post-1979 Govt, fully Knowing Israel had Nukes and they did not.
Iran would regain that "right" by withdrawing. (but would be admitting the obvious)

Conditions of the NPT are No weapons, but assistance with, but Supervised, Civilian Power acquisition.
Such as the EU offering to settle the whole issue 8 YEARS ago by giving Iran Free Off-site Enrichment, to guarantee Iran would Not Divert materials to a weapons program.
Iran refused.
This really is as Obvious as the OJ Trial.

It is SO tiring to EVERY Day hear the Numb-Nuts: "If they have them..."
And I do mean EVERY Day.

It's really a poll on Ignorance of issue.
And of course, despite reading my post, many will vote the opposite position withOut being able to challenge mine.

And I am tired of people treating Iran like the devil incarnated and wanting war. I have no love for Iran, but I fully understand the psychology behind their wishes and fears..it is nothing new. Israel has nukes for EXACTLY the same fears. North Korea has nukes for EXACTLY the same fears. So coming here and saying "no" just because we dont like their political leaders is just bull**** from top to bottom as we have allowed other countries access to nukes without any consequences. India and Pakistan, both countries who have been at war more times in the last 200 years than Iran has.... both conducted secret tests, refuse to sign up to NFT and what did the US and the west do? Slap them over the fingers.. pathetic attitude, just because they happened to be allies.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

Name the ONLY country that's ever used a nuclear weapon on humans?

Name the country that has been the most active in starting/fighting wars in the last 100 years?

Who exactly can be trusted and who can't? And who decides such lists?

Case in point. We can be trusted because we knew when to use it. Terrorists cant be trusted. Who keeps the list? The UN.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

It didn't work out well for Iraq. Though Israel "stifled" Saddam's WMD ambitions, Bush insisted that he still had them, and a gullible nation followed him into a senseless war, a war that cost a couple hundred thousand Iraqi lives and has left their country in ruins for a dozen years now.

But not being thrown off buildings by the govt, and 7% GDP growth. Would Iraqis want to go back?
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

I heard someone make the argument that Obama doesn't believe the US has any rightful role in preventing or hindering Iran from developing and maintaining nuclear weapons. I don't know that that's true, and nobody but the President can answer to what he believes, so I'll ask what you believe. If Iran has the ability, does it have the "right" to nuclear weapons? (By "right", I mean the U.S. and other nations would not be unjustified in trying to prevent it.)

working on the poll

I don't know that Obama has ever said or suggested that Iran has a right to nuclear weapons. That would be Ron Paul actually who said that. Obama just BEHAVES in a way that practically ensures Iran will get nuclear weapons if that is in fact what their goal is.

And this is one of those issues that doesn't fit into any kind of 'equality' or 'fair play' mold. We are dealing with a nation controlled by religious fanatics and who for some time have been the No. 1 exporter and supporter of terrorism in the world. To say that Iran has as much right as any other nation to nuclear weapons is like saying that a rabid dog has a right to run free in the neighborhood if there is no leash law for other dogs or that a rattlesnake has as much right to be in my living room as does the Shih Tzu or calico cat.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

I heard someone make the argument that Obama doesn't believe the US has any rightful role in preventing or hindering Iran from developing and maintaining nuclear weapons. I don't know that that's true, and nobody but the President can answer to what he believes, so I'll ask what you believe. If Iran has the ability, does it have the "right" to nuclear weapons? (By "right", I mean the U.S. and other nations would not be unjustified in trying to prevent it.)

working on the poll



Considering my Country has been in a mini war with Iran since the hostage crisis, I say **** no!

When you all were worrying the Benghazi attack story, my country was on alert; we had, for only the second time in history, sever all diplomatic relations with Tehran for the safety of our diplomatic staff. There has been a death warrant out against Ken Taylor since he aided Americans in escaping.

If you look at the history of Iran after the fall of the Persian empire till the institution of the Shah with America's backing, you will see these are not a people who soon forget. And while Obama seems to be selling this message that they're just like Americans or whatever, belies the fact they routinely torture they're own citizens, disappear them etc. in far greater horror than Cuba, and yet he trusts them enough to negotiate with them.

Canada has few enemies, probably just Iran and ISIS now, but one having nuclear capabilities is too many.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

Seems to me that would go against CFR's goal of a one world government.

Rev 17:13
These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast.

I don't think the senior fellows at the CFR are given to scripture.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

Iraq Resolution. [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rationale_for_the_Iraq_War]


The U.S. stated that the intent was to remove "a regime that developed and used weapons of mass destruction, that harbored and supported terrorists, committed outrageous human rights abuses, and defied the just demands of the United Nations and the world"

Hardly all Bush's war.

The other regime scared Americans with things like, "do we have to wait for the smoking gun in the form of a mushroom cloud over a US city". Something that Saddam Hussein was incapable of pulling off.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

But not being thrown off buildings by the govt, and 7% GDP growth. Would Iraqis want to go back?

Don't you wish you could ask that question to the many Iraqis that fell pray to our bombs and missiles?
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

The USofA's fearmongering machine of doom has done a bang-up job of demonizing Iran and making them the great boogieman of the world.

Is it hard to understand why they'd want the best weapons they could develop?

Also - please tell us, when was the last time Iran declared war on another country?
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

PeteEU said:
No one has the right to have nukes.
But if one country has the "right", then all must have the "right".
Actually, the answer is a Clear Cut "No".

Iran Gave Away that "right" by signing the NPT.
It reaffirmed that Position/Treaty under a previous Revolutionary/post-1979 Govt, fully Knowing Israel had Nukes and they did not.
Iran would regain that "right" by withdrawing. (but would be admitting the obvious)

Conditions of the NPT are No weapons, but assistance with, but Supervised, Civilian Power acquisition.
Such as the EU offering to settle the whole issue 8 YEARS ago by giving Iran Free Off-site Enrichment, to guarantee Iran would Not Divert materials to a weapons program.
Iran refused.
This really is as Obvious as the OJ Trial.

It is SO tiring to EVERY Day hear the Numb-Nuts: "If they have them..."
And I do mean EVERY Day.

It's really a poll on Ignorance of issue.
And of course, despite reading my post, many will vote the opposite position withOut being able to challenge mine.
And I am tired of people treating Iran like the devil incarnated and wanting war. I have no love for Iran, but I fully understand the psychology behind their wishes and fears..it is nothing new. Israel has nukes for EXACTLY the same fears. North Korea has nukes for EXACTLY the same fears. So coming here and saying "no" just because we dont like their political leaders is just bull**** from top to bottom as we have allowed other countries access to nukes without any consequences. India and Pakistan, both countries who have been at war more times in the last 200 years than Iran has.... both conducted secret tests, refuse to sign up to NFT and what did the US and the west do? Slap them over the fingers.. pathetic attitude, just because they happened to be allies.
So you have No REAL answer to Iran having Signed AWAY that 'Right'. (Reaffirmed under the Revolutionary Govt)
Just your usual Empty Hostility/Deflection after getting Gutted again.
What's that now.. 0-fer-4612?
 
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Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

I don't think the senior fellows at the CFR are given to scripture.


You bet some are [just not in a good way] but, the scripture describes the One [New] World Order.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

The USofA's fearmongering machine of doom has done a bang-up job of demonizing Iran and making them the great boogieman of the world.

Is it hard to understand why they'd want the best weapons they could develop?

Also - please tell us, when was the last time Iran declared war on another country?

They have supported proxy wars for decades.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

The other regime scared Americans with things like, "do we have to wait for the smoking gun in the form of a mushroom cloud over a US city". Something that Saddam Hussein was incapable of pulling off.

I'm over it...how about you?
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

You bet some are [just not in a good way] but, the scripture describes the One [New] World Order.

Ok, but I don't get your point. A metaphoric book, written by a dude in a trance a couple thousand years ago has what bearing on Iran's nuclear power program today?
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

I'm over it...how about you?

Well, sense Iraq is still in far worse condition then it was when Powell warned of the pottery barn rule, no, not so much. And for many Iraqis, they will likely never get over it, and don't really care that Bush's lies were no inconvenience to YOU!!
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

I don't think Iran even wants nuclear weapons. It's doing nicely without them -
glomming up Iraq/Hiz in Lebanon / and a few other places I cn't think of off the top of my head.

What would a nuke do for Iran, except make it a target?
Iran's interest is in empire ( both hard and soft power projection) - and it's doing just fine.
Doesn't make me happy, but it is what it is, and as long as the Sunnis continue internecine war, it will take advantage of that
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

Ok, but I don't get your point. A metaphoric book, written by a dude in a trance a couple thousand years ago has what bearing on Iran's nuclear power program today?

does Iran have a right to nukes?

Would you give a known terrorist a batch of nerve gas?

Would you give skinheads an arsenal of high explosives?

Would you give a known threat a weapon capable of changing the power structure of the planet?
 
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