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Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?[W:296, 650]

Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?


  • Total voters
    118
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

I don't want them to have nukes but they have the right to have them, especially since Israel has them.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

Well, actually... That's the whole reason the 2A exists in the first place. :lol:

If Government ever tries to exercise the power to oppress its people, the Founders hoped to ensure that they would be armed, so that they could (in theory, anyway) effectively resist that tyranny.



Both. Obviously, I view the United States as being objectively superior to Iran with regards to prevailing ideology as well as long term motivations.

However, "victory" in this particular struggle will, undeniably, ultimately boil down to which side actually has the will, clout, and power to impose their own desires upon the situation one way or another.

I'd be more concerned about a nation that has used nuclear weapons, then hand wringing over what some nation that doesn't even have them may do should they get them.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

Other. Who (or what) grants rights to nations? Clearly neither this poll nor I can do so.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

Other. Who (or what) grants rights to nations? Clearly neither this poll nor I can do so.

Well crap, man. And I was totally anticipating this poll being dispositive of the issue and appropriately globally recognized as such.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

As a sovereign country, yes, they have the same right to defend themselves as any other country. HOWEVER, they signed a treaty which said they wouldnt pursue them, so until they revoke it, they dont.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

From a Realist perspective, they have the "right" to whatever they can get away with.

We, in turn, have the "right" to impede them in such pursuits if it goes against our own interests.

At the end of the day, it's really as simple as that. Iran has an agenda, and we have an agenda. Unfortunately, those agendas simply happen to be mutually incompatible.

May the best nation win. :shrug:

Thats not true though, we dont have a right to infringe on others freedoms. We even signed a international treaty which said we wouldnt. We have a right to defend ourselves, but its a stretch to claim that keeping others from being strong is defensive.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

I heard someone make the argument that Obama doesn't believe the US has any rightful role in preventing or hindering Iran from developing and maintaining nuclear weapons. I don't know that that's true, and nobody but the President can answer to what he believes, so I'll ask what you believe. If Iran has the ability, does it have the "right" to nuclear weapons? (By "right", I mean the U.S. and other nations would not be unjustified in trying to prevent it.)

working on the poll

Persia is one of the oldest civilizations, deserving of respect. The neighborhood is full of nukes: India, Pakistan, Israel, Russia, China. It is hard to make the case that Iran does not have at least as much right to nuclear weapons as those other states. It is, however, easy to make the case that an Iran with nuclear weapons would make the world a more dangerous place.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

Thats not true though, we dont have a right to infringe on others freedoms. We even signed a international treaty which said we wouldnt. We have a right to defend ourselves, but its a stretch to claim that keeping others from being strong is defensive.

"Stop quoting law, we carry swords!" - Gnaeus Pompeius Magnus

Laws aren't worth the paper they're printed on if no one is going to enforce them. Guess what? Where the affairs of powerful nation states are concerned, no one does.

Frankly, I'd argue that any law which upholds the ability of nations like Iran or North Korea to produce weapons of mass destruction is flawed, and therefore should be ignored or worked around in any way possible.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

Well crap, man. And I was totally anticipating this poll being dispositive of the issue and appropriately globally recognized as such.

In that case we should just ask Obama, leader of the free (and not so free) world. ;)

As far as I can tell, that makes the answer a firm "he'd rather not have that happen during his term as POTUS".
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

There's no doubt that the Pakistani nuclear program is a dangerous thing, and that the fear that any nuclear weapon they may hold might fall to the wrong hands is a rational and logical one - but in the case of Iran there isn't even the fear that it might fall to the wrong hands as it already will be in the wrong hands.

There is not much difference between the Iranian government, which is really the largest representative of radical Shiite Islam, and organizations such as ISIS, Boko Haram, Hezbollah, al-Qaeda etc. The Iranian government including the revolutionary guard and the Mullahs are a branch of radical Islam and are just as dangerous as any of these organizations (and by the way Hezbollah is practically the Iranian government).

I see no logic at all in the words of those who are claiming that perhaps due to the fact that the Ayatollah and the rest are leading a nation they are somehow more rational or logical than these radical Islamic organizations. It doesn't make them more rational, it doesn't make them more logical, they are just as much as nutjobs as every other Islamic terrorist out there and letting them hold nuclear weapons will probably be the greatest mistake of modern age.

I can pretty agree with your perspective. In these modern days of Internet, it's not hard to spot psychopaths a half of world away. How many decades have passed in which various Iranian figure-heads say that the sacrifice of the entire population of Iran would be worth taking out Israel alone. Well, I think maybe on some occasions these maniacal martinets throw in..."Israel along with the US."

I think it's naive for any person with the capacity to follow current events to "genuinely believe" that Iranians will forego what's apparently been an aggressive pursuit of building a formidable program until they get the blessings of the president and/or the congress. As you implied, they may already possess a higher degree of technology and even material.

North Korea at times would pretend that they hadn't advanced their efforts to have nukes. But then their psychosis would take over and jam it down the West's throats that they were nuke ready and armageddon was just around the corner.

If Obama, the military and members of Congress aren't pondering the possibility that the stage of Iran's program is advanced, then what verifiable intelligences would be available to them, which would alleviate their need to ponder - and choose to engage in some type of agreement? Obviously by the Republican's recent reaction with the open letter to Iran, I'm guessing that they aren't getting such intelligence.

But as the old saying goes, "A bird in hand is worth two in a bush." There's no second guessing about Pakistan's possession of numbers of nukes, which I don't think they've managed to keep an accurate accounting of. It's been said that not even Russia has an accurate inventory. That's freaky, in and of itself.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

There's no doubt that the Pakistani nuclear program is a dangerous thing, and that the fear that any nuclear weapon they may hold might fall to the wrong hands is a rational and logical one - but in the case of Iran there isn't even the fear that it might fall to the wrong hands as it already will be in the wrong hands.

There is not much difference between the Iranian government, which is really the largest representative of radical Shiite Islam, and organizations such as ISIS, Boko Haram, Hezbollah, al-Qaeda etc. The Iranian government including the revolutionary guard and the Mullahs are a branch of radical Islam and are just as dangerous as any of these organizations (and by the way Hezbollah is practically the Iranian government).

I see no logic at all in the words of those who are claiming that perhaps due to the fact that the Ayatollah and the rest are leading a nation they are somehow more rational or logical than these radical Islamic organizations. It doesn't make them more rational, it doesn't make them more logical, they are just as much as nutjobs as every other Islamic terrorist out there and letting them hold nuclear weapons will probably be the greatest mistake of modern age.

You realize bin laden was hiding out in the heart of the pakistan military district...just sayin

Reason i'm not worried is they are deterred by the same reality of MAD as every other nuclear regime since the cold war. Any statements to the contrary are most likely meant to appease the hard liners within and to convince the population the regime is needed. I don't see why the ayatollah is more of a suicidal war hawk than putin
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

I heard someone make the argument that Obama doesn't believe the US has any rightful role in preventing or hindering Iran from developing and maintaining nuclear weapons. I don't know that that's true, and nobody but the President can answer to what he believes, so I'll ask what you believe. If Iran has the ability, does it have the "right" to nuclear weapons? (By "right", I mean the U.S. and other nations would not be unjustified in trying to prevent it.)

working on the poll

Your opponents arguments haven't really been that nations have a "right" to nuclear arms, it's been that it's insanely hypocritical for us to try to enforce massive sanctions and even threaten war over something we have and refuse to give up. It's not really surprising why Iran feels the need for nuclear weapons. We have them completely surrounded by dozens of bases and actively threaten them.

This isn't about world peace, it's about America trying to ensure its dominance. We have more nukes than every other country combined, minus Russia, and we're the only nation on earth to use them against human beings. Where is our moral high ground?
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

If Iran does get nukes I believe it will help stabilize the Middle east. No nation would attack another when both have nukes. MAD worked for us and the USSR and it should work for foes like Isreal and Iran.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

Does ANY country have a "right" to build, store, maintain, and/or develop nuclear weapons and delivery systems?

It's very hypocritical to say countries A,B, and C have the right, but countries G,H, and J don't.
Especially if the "justification" for having them is "self defense".

How does any country justify having WMD's?
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

"Stop quoting law, we carry swords!" - Gnaeus Pompeius Magnus

Laws aren't worth the paper they're printed on if no one is going to enforce them. Guess what? Where the affairs of powerful nation states are concerned, no one does.

Frankly, I'd argue that any law which upholds the ability of nations like Iran or North Korea to produce weapons of mass destruction is flawed, and therefore should be ignored or worked around in any way possible.

WE enforce them on ourselves. But its not even about that. Americans believe in inherent rights which supersede the law. Life and liberty, and that goes for individuals or their groups (states).
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

If Iran does get nukes I believe it will help stabilize the Middle east. No nation would attack another when both have nukes. MAD worked for us and the USSR and it should work for foes like Isreal and Iran.

On a different note, Israel has successfully stifled the nuclear ambitions of Iraq [under Saddam] and Syria by bombing them. So far it's worked out rather well.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

Your opponents arguments haven't really been that nations have a "right" to nuclear arms, it's been that it's insanely hypocritical for us to try to enforce massive sanctions and even threaten war over something we have and refuse to give up. It's not really surprising why Iran feels the need for nuclear weapons. We have them completely surrounded by dozens of bases and actively threaten them.

This isn't about world peace, it's about America trying to ensure its dominance. We have more nukes than every other country combined, minus Russia, and we're the only nation on earth to use them against human beings. Where is our moral high ground?

To be fair, Iran is a state sponsor of terrorism and a active threat to the region. They are in violation of any number of treaties.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

Does ANY country have a "right" to build, store, maintain, and/or develop nuclear weapons and delivery systems?

It's very hypocritical to say countries A,B, and C have the right, but countries G,H, and J don't.
Especially if the "justification" for having them is "self defense".

How does any country justify having WMD's?

Just like the police, some people can be trusted with deadly force. Some people cant.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

Just like the police, some people can be trusted with deadly force. Some people cant.

Name the ONLY country that's ever used a nuclear weapon on humans?

Name the country that has been the most active in starting/fighting wars in the last 100 years?

Who exactly can be trusted and who can't? And who decides such lists?
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

To be fair, Iran is a state sponsor of terrorism and a active threat to the region. They are in violation of any number of treaties.

To be fair.

The director of the National Security Agency under Ronald Reagan – Lt. General William Odom said:

By any measure the US has long used terrorism. In ‘78-79 the Senate was trying to pass a law against international terrorism – in every version they produced, the lawyers said the US would be in violation.

(audio here).

The Washington Post reported in 2010:

The United States has long been an exporter of terrorism, according to a secret CIA analysis released Wednesday by the Web site WikiLeaks.

The head and special agent in charge of the FBI’s Los Angeles office said that most terror attacks are committed by our CIA and FBI.
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

From a Realist perspective, they have the "right" to whatever they can get away with.

We, in turn, have the "right" to impede them in such pursuits if it goes against our own interests.
At the end of the day, it's really as simple as that. Iran has an agenda, and we have an agenda. Unfortunately, those agendas simply happen to be mutually incompatible.

May the best nation win. :shrug:

what kind of interests ? not everything is about your interests in international arena I think
 
Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

On a different note, Israel has successfully stifled the nuclear ambitions of Iraq [under Saddam] and Syria by bombing them. So far it's worked out rather well.

It didn't work out well for Iraq. Though Israel "stifled" Saddam's WMD ambitions, Bush insisted that he still had them, and a gullible nation followed him into a senseless war, a war that cost a couple hundred thousand Iraqi lives and has left their country in ruins for a dozen years now.
 
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