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Who thinks the US military should be replaced with a citizen defensive body?

Should the US military be replaced with a citizen defensive body?

  • Total voters
    68
RFR said:
Who thinks the US military should be replaced with a citizen defensive body like Switzerland has? As in every able-bodied adult (except for conscientious objectors) owns and knows how to use a military grade rifle and advanced weaponry is under local civillian control.
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This is the dumbest idea, ever. There isn't even an election coming up soon and these guys are in full force? What gives? Full moon? Shortened month? I'm also getting sick and tired of Americans (I'm assuming) praising Switzerland... I'll write a thread about that one later, though.

Since when did the buzzword change from militia to citizen defensive body? I missed the memo.
 
ModerateGOP said:
This is the dumbest idea, ever. There isn't even an election coming up soon and these guys are in full force? What gives? Full moon? Shortened month? I'm also getting sick and tired of Americans (I'm assuming) praising Switzerland... I'll write a thread about that one later, though.

Since when did the buzzword change from militia to citizen defensive body? I missed the memo.
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Well you're ahead of me since I didn't know "militia" was a buzword at all.
 
RFR said:
Who thinks the US military should be replaced with a citizen defensive body like Switzerland has? As in every able-bodied adult (except for conscientious objectors) owns and knows how to use a military grade rifle and advanced weaponry is under local civillian control.
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The USA has had continuous war for most of its' history. The weapons manufacturors have been in existence for most of that time. For example, one of the Bush fortunes comes from Walker Arms and has for a hundred years. Just the tip of the iceberg. "War is good business, and business is good." How many more of our bluebloods have a direct lineage to weapons manufacturing? Is that why we have perpetual war?
 
joko104 said:
Why not just a pointed stick?
A rifle has no use against aircraft, armor, and certainly not against nuclear weapons.
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That's why I said this.
RFR said:
and advanced weaponry is under local civillian control.
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Although for clarification I do NOT think nukes should be under civillian control.
 
Jerry said:
In post #14 you defined "military grade" as meaning full auto. The M16 is not full auto, nore is it issued with large capacity magaziens. The military explicitly forbids use of those magazines, only allowing the standard 30rnd mags. If you want to use 60/100rnd mags in your M16, the military won't let you.


I'm of the opinion that Artical 1 Section 8 already requires the government to issue an M16 to every able-bodied male between ages 18-41 since according to Title-10 USC that's who's in the unorganized militia.
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By large capacity I meant 30rd. And yes the m-16 is full-auto, Wikipedia: "The M16 rifle, officially designated Rifle, Caliber 5.56 mm, M16, is the United States military select-fire adaptation of the AR-15 rifle. The rifle was adapted for semi-automatic and full-automatic fire." The M-16 is a ful-auto capable AR-15. That is the only intrinsic difference between the two. Yes I agree that government should issue rifles to the unorganized militia. But it shouldn't be the federal government, ideally it would be a county level thing.
 
Kal'Stang said:
This is SLIGHTLY debatable.....but not by much. Political hackery at its finest here folks.
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`
What is called "political hackery" by one is also merely an opinion expressed by another. It all depends on ones perspective.
 
Montecresto said:
That canard again.

isolationism definition

The doctrine that a nation should stay out of the disputes and affairs of other nations. The United States practiced a policy of isolationism until World War I and did not pursue an active international policy until after World War II. ( See “ entangling alliances with none.”)

The American Heritage® New Dictionary of Cultural Literacy, Third Edition
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I don't have a problem with isolationism, as long as it includes not only no interference militarily, but also includes no economic interference which means no aid at all, no medical interference which means no medical aid, no interference in any way, shape or form.......none. It also, as far as I am concerned, means no outsourcing of jobs to other countries, no immigration from other countries, no trade with other countries....want to be isolationist then do so totally, not picking and choosing and just limiting it to the military.
 
RFR said:
Who thinks the US military should be replaced with a citizen defensive body like Switzerland has? As in every able-bodied adult (except for conscientious objectors) owns and knows how to use a military grade rifle and advanced weaponry is under local civillian control.
Click to expand...

The only reason Switzerland can afford to do that is because they're a land-locked country surrounded by many countries with actual militaries and plenty of treaties to keep them protected. It is absolutely impractical for a large country and no, I have no interest in going to drill once a month.
 
RFR said:
By large capacity I meant 30rd.
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Army FM 3-22.9 specifies that the battle load for an M16/M4 is "210rnds total, 7 magaziens of 30rnds each." 30rnd mags are standard, not large capacity. Stop believing the media. 10rnd mags for the M4/16 aren't even an option.

RFR said:
And yes the m-16 is full-auto, Wikipedia: "The M16 rifle, officially designated Rifle, Caliber 5.56 mm, M16, is the United States military select-fire adaptation of the AR-15 rifle. The rifle was adapted for semi-automatic and full-automatic fire." The M-16 is a ful-auto capable AR-15. That is the only intrinsic difference between the two. Yes I agree that government should issue rifles to the unorganized militia. But it shouldn't be the federal government, ideally it would be a county level thing.
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Wikipedia isn't a valid source for anything. I have an M4 issued to me. It is not full-auto. They haven't been full-auto since the middle of the Vietnam war. They have 3 settings: safe, semi & burst (3rnds).
 
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RabidAlpaca said:
The only reason Switzerland can afford to do that is because they're a land-locked country surrounded by many countries with actual militaries and plenty of treaties to keep them protected. It is absolutely impractical for a large country and no, I have no interest in going to drill once a month.
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Then you have no interest in living in America.
 
Jerry said:
Then you have no interest in living in America.
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I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. I was in the army 7 years with a 15 month afghanistan deployment. I've paid my dues to be american, not that it's a requirement. One does not need to be permanently in the reserves to be an American. Stop with this nonsense hyperbole. You're just trying to bait me into an argument because we both know you're being ridiculous.

But please, POG, tell me why you're so much more of a true American because you're still in and I'm not.
 
RabidAlpaca said:
I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about.
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Well it's simple. I was talking about everyone serving, and you didn't like that idea. If you don't want to serve, gtfo. Simple as that.

And save your attempts at calling people pogs for those who are actually pogs, it helps when the term actualy applies.
 
Jerry said:
Well it's simple. I was talking about everyone serving, and you didn't like that idea. If you don't want to serve, gtfo. Simple as that.

And save your attempts at calling people pogs for those who are actually pogs, it helps when the term actualy applies.
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This is the typical bull**** I expect from you. You know I've already served but you're telling me to GTFO because I'm not a real American like you because I don't support universal conscription. It's actually my bad for responding to your nonsense in the first place. You should GTFO of America if you don't oppose universal conscription. (Since we're arbitrarily conflating our opinion with being a real American)

And yes, you're not actually combat arms, you were some kind of bull**** construction if I remember correctly, so yes you're a POG. I'm not here to play whose dick is bigger games, so go peddle your nonsense elsewhere. Good bye.
 
LadyMoonlight said:
I don't have a problem with isolationism, as long as it includes not only no interference militarily, but also includes no economic interference which means no aid at all, no medical interference which means no medical aid, no interference in any way, shape or form.......none. It also, as far as I am concerned, means no outsourcing of jobs to other countries, no immigration from other countries, no trade with other countries....want to be isolationist then do so totally, not picking and choosing and just limiting it to the military.
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I appreciate your opinion, but that seems extreme to me Lady. No aid, none. I don't think we should be writing a 2,3,4 billion dollar check to a prosperous country like Israel every year, we all know what that is, and it's not aid. But disaster help, why not, the work and money we traditionally supply to the worst of third world countries, straight up trade, partnerships to tackle things that are threats globally, I can't see the harm. Entangling alliances that draw us into things like the Ukraine mess, or into things like the disputes between China and Japan, hell no.
 
DaveFagan said:
The USA has had continuous war for most of its' history. The weapons manufacturors have been in existence for most of that time. For example, one of the Bush fortunes comes from Walker Arms and has for a hundred years. Just the tip of the iceberg. "War is good business, and business is good." How many more of our bluebloods have a direct lineage to weapons manufacturing? Is that why we have perpetual war?
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World history is of perpetual war. What you lament in your messages is that the USA has not been defeated. You make no secret in your messages of your hatred of the USA and wish it to be destroyed. But does anyone remember your messages as to why - your explaining how corporations and government conspired to keep your brilliant inventions from being sold as reason for the fury of your messages against the USA?

That, combined with extreme homophobia and hatred of Jews, gives the motives of why you continuously express love of Putin, hate of the USA and hate of Israel.

There is nothing unique about the USA and war, other than being undefeated.
 
DaveFagan said:
The USA has had continuous war for most of its' history. The weapons manufacturors have been in existence for most of that time. For example, one of the Bush fortunes comes from Walker Arms and has for a hundred years. Just the tip of the iceberg. "War is good business, and business is good." How many more of our bluebloods have a direct lineage to weapons manufacturing? Is that why we have perpetual war?
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Citation?
 
Perhaps the single stupidest, most worthless poll in the history of this forum. And that's saying a lot. I feel dumb for actually having participated in it.
 
Jerry said:
You're saying the M16 is not a "military grade" weapon, then, even though it's the standard rifle of the military. This would also mean the M9 is not a "military grade" weapon, either, eventhough it's the standard military pistol.

Are you sure you know enough about this topic to be speaking on it?
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Neither is the MK14 or the DMR yeah? Neither sniper rifles nor shotguns nor anything. Huh, good point.

+1

The military's only few relevant military guns are the M4 carbine, SAW, M240, and .50 cal browning I guess.

The dozens of other guns aren't military guns.
 
joko104 said:
Why not just a pointed stick?
A rifle has no use against aircraft, armor, and certainly not against nuclear weapons.
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Mind responding to Jerry's post in which he dished out a bunch of rekt?
 
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