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Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?[W:461]

Is there a moral obligation to repay money you borrow?


  • Total voters
    98
Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

You do realize rate of use has a direct affect on rates, right?
I am speaking on an individual level I have already considered aggregate effects of masses of people but in the end the argument comes back to my actions as that alone is my responsibility and I cannot hurt lursa through insurance premiums

If I cost the company $650 and the company has 3,000,000 people buying insurance, the cost to any one individual is .002 cents. That rounds into zero
 
Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

Well if you find I do, I will be happy to mail you a penny
 
Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

Your comments are interesting.

Reminds me some of the logic people have when insurance companies have to pay out large sums. Its the insurance company, right. Well where does the insurance gets its funds to pay out? From individuals, not a company.

While it may not be a moral issue, it is a issue of what is a persons word worth.

I can assure that when a bank makes a loan, what a persons' word is worth is never considered. Not even for the briefest of moments.

For the bank, the making of a loan is a business decision in which they take on a bit of risk for which they charge enough interest to generate profit. Like any risk, sometimes they make a profit, and sometimes they make a loss.

Morality doesn't enter the picture, nor the worth of any person's word.
 
Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

Well if you find I do, I will be happy to mail you a penny

Your dismissal is either ignorance or dishonesty but doesnt change reality.

Altho people try to justify many things to avoid feeling guilty.
 
Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

and you'll be saving a ton of it if you succeed in paying it off in 10 years... well done.

Last year was good, I took about 22% off of the principle....
 
Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

I can assure that when a bank makes a loan, what a persons' word is worth is never considered. Not even for the briefest of moments.

For the bank, the making of a loan is a business decision in which they take on a bit of risk for which they charge enough interest to generate profit. Like any risk, sometimes they make a profit, and sometimes they make a loss.

Morality doesn't enter the picture, nor the worth of any person's word.

Pretty much what I was saying.

But the OP is about morality which a person can have, or not, outside of the legal sytem and contracts and agreements.
 
Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

Your dismissal is either ignorance or dishonesty but doesnt change reality.

Altho people try to justify many things to avoid feeling guilty.
Why does everyone accuse me of justifying myself to avoid guilt! Wtf is with you people I am just giving my honest opinion

(Sorry not you specifically but directed at multiple people)

You people act as I secretly see things your way and feel some sense of shame or guilt. I don't get the reason behind these accusations pointed at me. What is your reasoning behind this accusation because I would like to believe its in good faith and not some stupid debate tactic
 
Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

I think the discussion has taken some ugly turns and went a lil too personal...

take some time..... chill out.... it's just a conversation.

I wonder though... if a person doesn't see paying their loans as a moral obligation, but they still pay their loans on some basis other than morality, can we really declare them to be immoral?... they are acting in accordance to our morality, so determining them to be immoral just doesn't make much sense.

but that brings another question to my mind... why the hell are the generally political persuasions abandoning their traditional arguments?.... libertarians denouncing self-interest and embracing morality.. liberals/progressives embracing self-interest while casting away morality.
cats sleeping with dogs, dogs sleeping with cats... it's a madhouse round here :lol:


in any event.. pay your bills... it's the right thing to do.

Perceptive observations and good questions

I can only speak for myself, but if you were to look at my posts on any issue, you won't find any that have me arguing any policy on the basis of morality alone, nor any that have me argue for a policy that can't be justified on the basis of national interests so my position here is consistent with my position on other issues.
 
Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

I am speaking on an individual level I have already considered aggregate effects of masses of people but in the end the argument comes back to my actions as that alone is my responsibility and I cannot hurt lursa through insurance premiums

If I cost the company $650 and the company has 3,000,000 people buying insurance, the cost to any one individual is .002 cents. That rounds into zero

You don't round costs. What something costs is what it costs. If something costs .99 cents and there is no tax it will cost me .99 cents and if I give the cashier a dollar they will give me back a penny. They're not just going to go, well, .99 cents rounds up to a dollar, so no change for you. What you cost the system is just that, no more or less. Everything you cost the system someone else has to pay no matter the amount.
 
Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

Perceptive observations and good questions

I can only speak for myself, but if you were to look at my posts on any issue, you won't find any that have me arguing any policy on the basis of morality alone, nor any that have me argue for a policy that can't be justified on the basis of national interests so my position here is consistent with my position on other issues.
It seems to be an annoying trait of many conservatives here. The where do you stand type question where they take a moral question and strip it of all context and reality and ask "how do you feel about x" then get either indignant or try to declare some sort of victory when people try to answer realistically by adding context back in.

Very few if any morals stand alone without context

Sorry a little rant there, lol

Its just annoying
 
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Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

Pretty much what I was saying.

But the OP is about morality which a person can have, or not, outside of the legal sytem and contracts and agreements.

And I maintain that morality does not require the paying back of loans made by banks or other financial institutions.

When I take a loan, I create an obligation to adhere to the terms of the contract - which I do. However, the terms do not require that I pay back the loan. At least, none of the loans I've ever taken require that. They have all contained provisions that allow me to not pay back the loan and there's nothing immoral about taking a course of action that the contract has defined
 
Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

And your argument fails as I've already pointed out since if a persons morality is flexible and default can be justified, they'll do that to regular people with the same justification.

I dont know. His posts clearly show that he doesnt recognize that such actions, multiplied by many defaults or fraud, affect the other customers that deal with an institution (rather than an individual). He doesnt recognize it and takes no responsibility and feels no guilt. So no, I'd say that some people do make a false distinction in order to justify it and make themselves feel better.
 
Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

You don't round costs. What something costs is what it costs. If something costs .99 cents and there is no tax it will cost me .99 cents and if I give the cashier a dollar they will give me back a penny. They're not just going to go, well, .99 cents rounds up to a dollar, so no change for you. What you cost the system is just that, no more or less. Everything you cost the system someone else has to pay no matter the amount.
When its less than a penny you kind of have to unless the treasury decides on some new sub penny coin
 
Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

And I maintain that morality does not require the paying back of loans made by banks or other financial institutions.

When I take a loan, I create an obligation to adhere to the terms of the contract - which I do. However, the terms do not require that I pay back the loan. At least, none of the loans I've ever taken require that. They have all contained provisions that allow me to not pay back the loan and there's nothing immoral about taking a course of action that the contract has defined

Neither do I personally because the penalty will be weighed against me, like it or not. However it does not remove the fact that my default does affect others to whom that default (magnified by others defaulting as well) affects. That is built into the business model and does indeed impact others.

To me, it is a moral deficiency for someone to not take that into consideration. Has nothing to do with the business itself.
 
Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

Agreed. The business also has its recourse. Business is business. And it is not immoral for it to carry it out if it is the terms stated in the contact/agreement that a borrower knowingly signed.

Correct

I'm certain that none of the sanctimonious posters in this thread were in a tizzy when banks foreclosed on homes and caused families with children to become homeless.

It's business.
 
Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

The 99% are as "morally" obligated as any CEO, or Mega Rich in the USA is to replaying a loan....................

"Executives at the restaurant chain, known for its toasted sandwiches, agreed to a restructuring plan that will reduce its debt by more than $400 million"

Quiznos files for bankruptcy - Mar. 14, 2014

Just one example of thousands each year.

Of course, the REAL question is, why should you repay a usery loan?

There are many different ways to calculate annual percentage rate of a loan. Depending on which method is used, the rate calculated may differ dramatically. E.g., for a $15 charge on a $100 14-day payday loan, it could be (from the borrower's perspective[6]) anywhere from 391% to 3733%.[7]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Payday_loan
 
Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

Correct

I'm certain that none of the sanctimonious posters in this thread were in a tizzy when banks foreclosed on homes and caused families with children to become homeless.

It's business.

....and I bought one of them. ChaChing!!!!!
 
Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

Neither do I personally because the penalty will be weighed against me, like it or not.

The same here, but the important point is that we don't do so because of self-interest

However it does not remove the fact that my default does affect others to whom that default (magnified by others defaulting as well) affects. That is built into the business model and does indeed impact others.

To me, it is a moral deficiency for someone to not take that into consideration. Has nothing to do with the business itself.

The rate of default does have an effect on others but the rate is not the result of any individuals' decision so no individual can be held responsible for the rate. The rate is the result of economic factors far beyond the control of any ordinary citizen, but if you want to find one to blame, blame bush* whose policies resulted in the largest # of mortgage defaults in the history of the USA. He certainly bares more of the blame than some Joe Schmo who defaulted on his ARM.
 
Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

When its less than a penny you kind of have to unless the treasury decides on some new sub penny coin

Sigh. If you cost me less than penny that is what you cost. It doesn't matter if the treasury has anything for that amount.
 
Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

Correct

I'm certain that none of the sanctimonious posters in this thread were in a tizzy when banks foreclosed on homes and caused families with children to become homeless.

It's business.

[/thread]









............
 
Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

If you borrow money, do you feel there is a moral obligation to repay the money you borrowed?

Morally, no. Legally, yes. The fact that one's credit rating is good enough to get a loan, probably indicates a standard of ethical behaviors and attitudes, but is the payment of the debt itself a moral issue? Not imo.
 
Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

Why does everyone accuse me of justifying myself to avoid guilt! Wtf is with you people I am just giving my honest opinion

(Sorry not you specifically but directed at multiple people)

You people act as I secretly see things your way and feel some sense of shame or guilt. I don't get the reason behind these accusations pointed at me. What is your reasoning behind this accusation because I would like to believe its in good faith and not some stupid debate tactic

We've all read your opinions. And seen your justification of your selective morality.

Fine. It's all yours.
 
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Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

Correct

I'm certain that none of the sanctimonious posters in this thread were in a tizzy when banks foreclosed on homes and caused families with children to become homeless.

It's business.

What exactly is immoral about the bank doing exactly what they said they would?
 
Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

We've all ready your opinions. And seen your justification of your selective morality.

Fine. It's all yours.
Wat??

I think I know what your saying as as far as I can tell you are trying to imply I secretly see things your way. Oh well I guess I won't get my answer this day
 
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Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

Sigh. If you cost me less than penny that is what you cost. It doesn't matter if the treasury has anything for that amount.
Except for practical purposes it is $.00 because its impossible to transact
 
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