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Is the left becoming more and more authoritarian?

Is the American left becoming more and more authoritarian?


  • Total voters
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To me the question is whether the mainstream American Left or the mainstream American Right is more authoritarian. You can't look at extremists on either side because extremists are almost always going to be authoritarian regardless of their ideology. So really its a question of what does the Democratic voting base support vs what the Republican voting base supports.

The Democratic base tends to support social liberalism, is pro-choice, is pro-drug decriminalization, is pro-gay marriage, is in favor of strong environmental protections, is in favor of universal healthcare, in favor of reductions in defense spending, and in favor of progressive taxation.

The Republican base tends to be socially conservative, pro-life, anti-gay marriage, in favor of strong defense spending, in favor of less regulation, and in favor of a flatter tax system.

If we look at authoritarian requiems throughout history we don't see too many of them that arise due to progressive taxation, reductions in defense spending, strong environmental regulations, universal healthcare, or social liberalism. In fact, I can't think of a single authoritarian requiem in all of history that came about in that way. Usually authoritarian regimes come about either by social conservatism and the mixing of church and state or by a government military industrial complex that convinces its citizenry to give up freedoms in exchange for security. So while you could argue that the American right is in favor of more economic freedom than the American left, the authoritarian problem on the American right is their embrace of militarization and their rampant social conservationism - which is inherently authoritarian. Using the state as a vehicle to endorse, promote, or compel your cultural and or religious moral views is by definition authoritarian. Drug laws, anti-sodomy laws, blue laws, mandatory sentencing, dry counties, book bans, and all sorts of mixing of church and state have all been brought to you by the American Right, so I don't think they have a leg to stand on when accusing the left of authoritarianism.
 
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Upon further review, the ACLU does not support hate speech laws, at least not in an overt manner that I can easily find.

A great many other Leftist organizations, including the ones I mentioned, most certainly do, however. Such laws are also more or less ubiquitous in nations where the political Left holds a disproportionate amount of social and legislative power.

My original point still stands.
The ACLU neither overtly nor covertly supports hate speech laws.
 
What you may consider "Amuck" others may not.

No where in the Bible that I know of, does it say anything about forcing people to believe the way you do. You can talk to them, you can read to them, you can "try" to convince them, but in the end it's their decision. It's called free will.

I agree but, when such actions fly in the face of morality and decency where we are retrograding as a society, what should be done?

Remember the path the Roman empire took.

The Major Causes for the Fall of the Roman Empire

Antagonism between the Senate and the Emperor
Decline in Morals
Political Corruption and the Praetorian Guard
Fast expansion of the Empire
Constant Wars and Heavy Military Spending
Barbarian Knowledge of Roman Military Tactics
Failing Economy
Unemployment of the Working Classes (The Plebs)
The 'Mob' and the cost of the 'Games'
Decline in Ethics and Values
Slave Labor
Natural Disasters
Christianity
Barbarian Invasion

Notice that Christianity was a cause. If we get back to being a Christian nation, many of these issues will cease to be a problem
 
Another incompetently worded poll. :roll:
 
No my point is not that the right is the bad guy and the left is not.. my point is that the right is worse than the left but both are in their own ways trying to control things.

As for GITMO is not a device for dealing with US citizens.. no that is what you have Supermax for.



LOL you have an open KKK member of Congress now in a leading position in the House. The man held a speech at a white supremacist meeting and is now trying to back track and make excuses. You do not hold speeches at such places unless you have sympathy with their racist views and you certainly dont hold a speech at such a place "by mistake".




What are his votes in the House that support your implication?
 
I agree but, when such actions fly in the face of morality and decency where we are retrograding as a society, what should be done?

Remember the path the Roman empire took.

The Major Causes for the Fall of the Roman Empire

Antagonism between the Senate and the Emperor
Decline in Morals
Political Corruption and the Praetorian Guard
Fast expansion of the Empire
Constant Wars and Heavy Military Spending
Barbarian Knowledge of Roman Military Tactics
Failing Economy
Unemployment of the Working Classes (The Plebs)
The 'Mob' and the cost of the 'Games'
Decline in Ethics and Values
Slave Labor
Natural Disasters
Christianity
Barbarian Invasion

Notice that Christianity was a cause. If we get back to being a Christian nation, many of these issues will cease to be a problem

The bolded part I agree with 100%. But passing laws that try to control people is not going to make that happen. Lets go a step further. Take ball caps, you see so called thugs wearing them side ways or backwards, do we pass a law saying you can only wear ball caps with the bill facing forward.

Antagonism between the Senate and the Emperor: When Bush took office the Dems hated him and worked against him all the could. When Obama took office the Reps. did the same to him.

Political Corruption: All our politicians are corrupt.

I could go thru the list and show where a lot of that is happening today. And yet we keep electing the same people over and over.

We can not legislate morality.

I don't know how old you are, I'm 73 and I've seen the world change a lot. Some good changes and some not so good. IMHO one of the biggest problems with today's youth is lack of parenting. Looking back I think that started in the mid 80's. When technology was being renewed by leaps and bounds. I don't remember the last time I saw a teenager without a phone. The changes need to start with the parents and grandparents. that's where the changes need to start. But I just don't see that happening.
 
I agree but, when such actions fly in the face of morality and decency where we are retrograding as a society, what should be done?

Remember the path the Roman empire took.

The Major Causes for the Fall of the Roman Empire

Antagonism between the Senate and the Emperor
Decline in Morals
Political Corruption and the Praetorian Guard
Fast expansion of the Empire
Constant Wars and Heavy Military Spending
Barbarian Knowledge of Roman Military Tactics
Failing Economy
Unemployment of the Working Classes (The Plebs)
The 'Mob' and the cost of the 'Games'
Decline in Ethics and Values
Slave Labor
Natural Disasters
Christianity
Barbarian Invasion

Notice that Christianity was a cause. If we get back to being a Christian nation, many of these issues will cease to be a problem

Christianity was a cause because it created a major schism in the empire. Many of the "causes" you listed ("decline in morals," "decline in ethics and values") are BS platitudes regurgitated by culture scolds in order to lament the disappearance of many of the old-fashioned virtues they held dear.

The biggest issue with the Roman Empire is that it got too big for its britches and virtually impossible to keep unified. Control of the empire had long been decentralized from Rome, and the empire was so large and diverse that it was only a matter of time before it fractured and fell.

"Being a Christian nation" sure didn't prevent war, corruption, slavery, poverty, decades upon decades of racial, ethnic and gender discrimination, or a host of other issues. People like to pretend the United States was some ****ing utopia when everyone was God-fearin', but that is a figment of their imagination.
 
Christianity was a cause because it created a major schism in the empire. Many of the "causes" you listed ("decline in morals," "decline in ethics and values") are BS platitudes regurgitated by culture scolds in order to lament the disappearance of many of the old-fashioned virtues they held dear.

The biggest issue with the Roman Empire is that it got too big for its britches and virtually impossible to keep unified. Control of the empire had long been decentralized from Rome, and the empire was so large and diverse that it was only a matter of time before it fractured and fell.

"Being a Christian nation" sure didn't prevent war, corruption, slavery, poverty, decades upon decades of racial, ethnic and gender discrimination, or a host of other issues. People like to pretend the United States was some ****ing utopia when everyone was God-fearin', but that is a figment of their imagination.

Kobie, Christianity is practiced by imperfect men. The empire held strong in the east, and you appear uninformed.
 
The bolded part I agree with 100%. But passing laws that try to control people is not going to make that happen. Lets go a step further. Take ball caps, you see so called thugs wearing them side ways or backwards, do we pass a law saying you can only wear ball caps with the bill facing forward.

Antagonism between the Senate and the Emperor: When Bush took office the Dems hated him and worked against him all the could. When Obama took office the Reps. did the same to him.

Political Corruption: All our politicians are corrupt.

I could go thru the list and show where a lot of that is happening today. And yet we keep electing the same people over and over.

We can not legislate morality.

I don't know how old you are, I'm 73 and I've seen the world change a lot. Some good changes and some not so good. IMHO one of the biggest problems with today's youth is lack of parenting. Looking back I think that started in the mid 80's. When technology was being renewed by leaps and bounds. I don't remember the last time I saw a teenager without a phone. The changes need to start with the parents and grandparents. that's where the changes need to start. But I just don't see that happening.

Much of that non-parentling stems from the overall decay of society through the lack of morality and values. As with you, I blame technology but also the homosexual and feminism movements that have pushed acceptance of all sorts of vulgar, indecent practices. Things that use to be illegal in this country.

We're all going to be punished for letting this happen. IMO
 
Christianity was a cause because it created a major schism in the empire. Many of the "causes" you listed ("decline in morals," "decline in ethics and values") are BS platitudes regurgitated by culture scolds in order to lament the disappearance of many of the old-fashioned virtues they held dear.

The biggest issue with the Roman Empire is that it got too big for its britches and virtually impossible to keep unified. Control of the empire had long been decentralized from Rome, and the empire was so large and diverse that it was only a matter of time before it fractured and fell.

"Being a Christian nation" sure didn't prevent war, corruption, slavery, poverty, decades upon decades of racial, ethnic and gender discrimination, or a host of other issues. People like to pretend the United States was some ****ing utopia when everyone was God-fearin', but that is a figment of their imagination.

The battle between good and evil is ever-present and continual. Never has this country been completely God-fearing. There's always been those who support the dark side.
 
The battle between good and evil is ever-present and continual. Never has this country been completely God-fearing. There's always been those who support the dark side.
Implication that non Christians are evil, noted.
 
The battle between good and evil is ever-present and continual. Never has this country been completely God-fearing. There's always been those who support the dark side.

What is this, Star Wars? We're talking about how to run a nation, not defeat Darth Vader.
 
It is without doubt that there exists an extremely authoritarian section of the US left ,particularly in academia, who are against freedom of speech and demand that people express themselves within very narrow confines of what they think is acceptable. Wether or not the right in the US is authoritarian (and I believe they are) is beside the point.
 
What part of "schism in the empire" didn't register?

The part where you imply it was because of religion between the east and west. If anything, the religious schism was between the elites and the common people-the elites were amongst the last to convert.
 
It is without doubt that there exists an extremely authoritarian section of the US left ,particularly in academia, who are against freedom of speech and demand that people express themselves within very narrow confines of what they think is acceptable. Wether or not the right in the US is authoritarian (and I believe they are) is beside the point.

Seems reasonable to me.
 
Hmmm....

-Obama has actively executed American citizens with out trial

And who says Bush has not done the same? Remember Bush was the most secretive government for decades.

-Obama has actively sought (but apparently not used) executive powers to suspend the writ of Habeus Corpus

Bush is the president that has used executive powers the most in history.

-Obama has sought to end the long standing ministierial exception which prevents government involvement in internal church, temple and mosque matters (Obama lost 9-0 at the US Supreme Court).

Dont understand the significance on this one.

-Obama has attempted to define "free" birth control from a specific source as a "right"- and then ordered churches to violate their own teaching by fullfilling this non existent "right".

As he should. Work place rights should not be defined by religious dogma.

-Obama appointed a justice to the US Supreme Court who claims that private ownership of weapons is not an individual right.

And? One of the most corrupt Justices was put in place by Bush..

-Obama has attempted to merge the judicial and legislative branch into one via very broad use of executive orders.

HAHAHA Bush actually did that..

Sorry but Obama may have done many things that piss of people like you, but Bush, your hero, has nothing on him when it comes to corruption, croynism and abuse of power. For **** sake, Bush used the Justice department as a political tool to target the Democratic opposition! He put in place a whole new department that has turned into an American version of the Gestapo basically. He kidnapped people world wide and tortured these people..
 
This thread belongs in basement. Two cops are killed and that is evidence of "the left" being authoritarian? This view is the definition of partisan hack

Not to mention defending racism homophobia etc as nothing more than conservative reaction to those who call them bigots
 
This thread belongs in basement. Two cops are killed and that is evidence of "the left" being authoritarian? This view is the definition of partisan hack

Not to mention defending racism homophobia etc as nothing more than conservative reaction to those who call them bigots

Not very tolerant of you. In fact, that sounds a bit authoritarian.
 
The part where you imply it was because of religion between the east and west. If anything, the religious schism was between the elites and the common people-the elites were amongst the last to convert.

It was part of the schism. Did I delineate that geographically?

Perhaps you should just read what people post and try not to draw implications. You're not very good at that.
 
LOL it is the right that is becoming more and more authoritarian and has been for decades. Everything from denying rights to minorities to GITMO and the Patriot Act.. all acts by the American Taliban Right.

By your logic both parties are authoritarian. Which I agree with. They are authoritarian based on the idea that it is their way or the highway, no negotiating. That is everything wrong with the current system. No one on either side wants to come to an agreement of any kind.

This poll didn't have my option: Both parties are authoritarian. This should have been known 12 or more years ago.
 
PC is an issue that is primarily brought up by the right, mostly FOX News and the like, although to my disappointment, some factions of the left feel the need to actually debate this issue. It has little to no real world implications and is used by the media as a method of distracting voters from issues that actually matter.

The primary flaw in your argument is that you view the "American Left" and "American Right" as single entities, when that is clearly not the case, as there are obviously huge differences within these two categories. Furthermore, the very definition of what is "left" and what is "right" in a political context is questionable, because these are totally arbitrary terms that can be twisted to mean anything you want.

Sadly they are one and the same nowadays, they just have different social talking points. Whoopty doo, who the hell cares where someone stands on being P.C. when the economy still hasn't recovered? They both succeed at screwing things up equally. Both are an abomination of what is supposed to be a Congress for the people.
 
What is this, Star Wars? We're talking about how to run a nation, not defeat Darth Vader.

Sorry...was that a little over your head? When you start reverting to fictional Hollywood works to make your point, I have to wonder.
 
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