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Do you agree with Ben Stein's unique Christmas perspective?

Do you agree with Ben Stein's unique Christmas perspective?

  • Im a right leaning American, yes.

    Votes: 8 33.3%
  • Im a left leaning American, yes.

    Votes: 5 20.8%
  • Im not American, yes.

    Votes: 1 4.2%
  • Im a right leaning American, no.

    Votes: 3 12.5%
  • Im a left leaning American, no.

    Votes: 6 25.0%
  • Im not American, no.

    Votes: 1 4.2%

  • Total voters
    24
I agree with your conclusion but not the premise, PC is about censorship to impede honest discussion,

Political correctness is about behavior which goes against what most find acceptable. It's not about silencing discussion. That's why people on the right complaining that it's politically incorrect to be a homophobe/racist etc. It's because the majority are simply not racist/homophobic etc. Again, right wingers in those cases are complaining that they can't be racist/homophobic because it is politically incorrect. They're not complaining about the discussion being silenced but the fact that their behavior is not accepted by the majority.

With that said, it is politically incorrect to not celebrate Christmas. The politically correct stance is to do as Ben Stein says and celebrate Christmas because you're in a country where the majority are white Christian protestants. Are you going to stay consistent and oppose the PC that Ben Stein is espousing? Or are you going to be inconsistent and say that it's fine for people to celebrate or not celebrate or criticize Christmas as they wish and embrace an anti-PC stance?
 
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Can Red not participate in the general celebration of American Christmas?

Red can do whatever he so chooses, but what's the point? I guess I could fast during Ramadan but why would I? Am not Muslim so what purpose would it serve me? Essential when you remove Christ from his own birthday celebration you having nothing left but to spend money on trinkets and out of control materialism.... Merry Christmas
 
Oh Bull****. If someone is nice enough to wish you "Merry Christmas," "Happy Holidays," or even "Happy Kwanzaa," just thank them for the well wishes and wish them the same. Otherwise you're just being an uptight ass.

This is why I always go out of my way to wish a Merry Christmas to the lefties I know. I can see veins popping but they dont want to appear uptight (though they often are).
 
This is why I always go out of my way to wish a Merry Christmas to the lefties I know. I can see veins popping but they dont want to appear uptight (though they often are).

May you have a joyous Kwanzaa.
 
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Its not hard to top a Clear Eyes ad, is it?

Lets see here. In the beginning of the clip Stein says, "My wife and I celebrate Christmas, big-time. I am sure we have more decorations than anyone within miles of here has.". But then he goes on to rail against commercialism... Hmmmmmmm... He admits he just bought a **** ton of Christmas lights and decorations and proudly showed them off in the video, but then goes on to rail against the "commercialism" of the Christmas season.... Can you say hypocrite..??
 
Political correctness is about behavior which goes against what most find acceptable. It's not about silencing discussion. That's why people on the right complaining that it's politically incorrect to be a homophobe/racist etc. It's because the majority are simply not racist/homophobic etc. Likewise, it is politically incorrect to not celebrate Christmas. The politically correct stance is to do as Ben Stein says and celebrate Christmas because you're in a country where the majority are white Christian protestants.

Its about control, in my example speech control-in yours behavior control in general. And thats something most Americans aren't cool with. People despise PC because it forces them (under threat of stigmatization) to use the words of another. And no, they dont need to be racists for that to be the case.

Serious question who do you know that really likes PC? Do you have something against free speech?
 
Merry Christmas BTW! Im sure unlike our lefties you know that is meant as a good thing.

Any expression of affection and good wishes, I take as a good thing. There's way too much suffering in the world, to be offended by good wishes. If you can't just appreciate that someone wishes you well in a season that is special to them, then your attitude sucks.

I don't know if you've ever read my story about my old friend from when I used to work the pedi icu unit back in the 80's. One of the pediatricians was a Jewish man from NYC, and he moved down here to be the medical director of the unit I worked on. Over the first year that he was here, we became good friends- close enough that he would take me to lunch for my birthday, or spend time in his office just talking about life. One year for Christmas, I gave him a funny Christmas card. On front of the card, was a picture of a red rose. Inside, it read :

Roses are Reddish
Violets are Bluish
If it wasn't for Jesus
We all would be Jewish.

We got some great laughs out of that, and it was nice to have a friend who was Jewish, who also celebrated Christmas, and wasn't offended that I joked about religion, and didn't get his ass upon his shoulders if someone said Merry Christmas to him.
 
Not necessarily, my mother had a friend from her school days named Stein. Relatively good Catholic - not the most devout person you'll meet, but not Jewish.

Bruce Springsteen isn't Jewish either, for the record.

Sorry- I thought it would be pretty obvious that I was joking, when I used a lol emoticon.
 
Christmas always was about giving and receiving presents. Christians tried to change it into being about Jesus, but no one really bought it, not even Christians.

The gift part is fairly recent. It was a stern religious holiday for most of history. Maybe there was a feast at most. Even in the US it hasn't been about just gifts. Besides, there are worse things than spending time with friends and family and giving and receiving gifts you know.
 
From my experience the ones who celebrate the REAL meaning of Christmas are not the ones going into debt for Christmas gifts. It seems to be more of the secular folks who focus on the big ticket gifts and trying to out spend the other person. But as far as giving some one a gift? I see nothing wrong with it. And the more america becomes secular the more materialistic it becomes.

This is true, and we see less charity.
 
Its about control,

I'm glad you agree that what Ben Stein is advocating is about control. He has advocated that we should all abide by the wishes of the dominant culture and live in a world where the anti-PC position of not celebrating Christmas is frowned upon.

in my example speech control-in yours behavior control in general. And thats something most Americans aren't cool with. People despise PC because it forces them (under threat of stigmatization) to use the words of another. And no, they dont need to be racists for that to be the case.

Serious question who do you know that really likes PC? Do you have something against free speech?

Free speech includes not celebrating Christmas and criticizing it. Being anti-free speech would be to tell people that they should celebrate it because it goes against what the dominant culture believes. More importantly, the politically correct stance is to tell people that they should celebrate Christmas in order to fit in better with the dominant culture.
 
Red can do whatever he so chooses, but what's the point? I guess I could fast during Ramadan but why would I? Am not Muslim so what purpose would it serve me? Essential when you remove Christ from his own birthday celebration you having nothing left but to spend money on trinkets and out of control materialism.... Merry Christmas

And on that note if a muslim or anyone else wished me a joyous holiday I wouldn't be offended in the least.
 
Oh Bull****. If someone is nice enough to wish you "Merry Christmas," "Happy Holidays," or even "Happy Kwanzaa," just thank them for the well wishes and wish them the same. Otherwise you're just being an uptight ass.

I'm not the one getting uptight about whether Merry Christmas or Happy Holidays is said. So...
 
Lets see here. In the beginning of the clip Stein says, "My wife and I celebrate Christmas, big-time. I am sure we have more decorations than anyone within miles of here has.". But then he goes on to rail against commercialism... Hmmmmmmm... He admits he just bought a **** ton of Christmas lights and decorations and proudly showed them off in the video, but then goes on to rail against the "commercialism" of the Christmas season.... Can you say hypocrite..??

I noticed you glanced completely over his point on Christmas though, while interjecting your own marxist spin. Care to comment on his thoughts on Christmas?
 
Black Friday disproves that. Christmas is about unbridled consumerism and greed.

No, actually it's about the birth of Jesus Christ. You should look it up, really cool story. Even if you don't believe. :)
 
Why are you offended by a Target cashier saying Merry Christmas?? And how is happy HOLY days any less Offensive?

I don't care, that is the point. I don't care whether someone chooses to say Merry Christmas, Happy Holidays, Season's Greetings, or Have a Wonderful Holiday Season. None of it offends me, I don't care. The only reason why any of that ever became controversial was a bunch of social conservatives wanted to gin up another opportunity to play the victim.
 
Any expression of affection and good wishes, I take as a good thing. There's way too much suffering in the world, to be offended by good wishes. If you can't just appreciate that someone wishes you well in a season that is special to them, then your attitude sucks.

I don't know if you've ever read my story about my old friend from when I used to work the pedi icu unit back in the 80's. One of the pediatricians was a Jewish man from NYC, and he moved down here to be the medical director of the unit I worked on. Over the first year that he was here, we became good friends- close enough that he would take me to lunch for my birthday, or spend time in his office just talking about life. One year for Christmas, I gave him a funny Christmas card. On front of the card, was a picture of a red rose. Inside, it read :

Roses are Reddish
Violets are Bluish
If it wasn't for Jesus
We all would be Jewish.

We got some great laughs out of that, and it was nice to have a friend who was Jewish, who also celebrated Christmas, and wasn't offended that I joked about religion, and didn't get his ass upon his shoulders if someone said Merry Christmas to him.

Thats what Im talking about! Theres no need to get butthurt over whats meant as a pleasant comment. And we should laugh about the differences a bit, instead of all the "outrage". BTW, "ass upon his shoulders" is hilarious, im gonna use that.
 
I noticed you glanced completely over his point on Christmas though, while interjecting your own marxist spin.
Awhhh man showing that his own words go against a major part of this rant is "Marxist". Wahh, wahhh.
I forget anything that goes against your points in any given thread is "Marxist".

Care to comment on his thoughts on Christmas?
What that it makes a lot of people feel warm and fuzzy inside?
Sure. I celebrate it. Im an atheist, but I dont celebrate it for the "birth of Christ". I celebrate it because its an excuse to bring my family together, my extended family together. I celebrate it because I was always raised to celebrate it. Was that the point?
 
So why isn't the reverse also true? We all know what "Seasons Greetings" or "Happy Holidays" means. Why not just say that?

Perhaps because when someone says Happy Holidays they are including New Years in with it. That is how everyone took those phrases until the religious right bunch wanted to gin up yet another opportunity to somehow play the victim.
 
I'm glad you agree that what Ben Stein is advocating is about control. He has advocated that we should all abide by the wishes of the dominant culture and live in a world where the anti-PC position of not celebrating Christmas is frowned upon.



Free speech includes not celebrating Christmas and criticizing it. Being anti-free speech would be to tell people that they should celebrate it because it goes against what the dominant culture believes. More importantly, the politically correct stance is to tell people that they should celebrate Christmas in order to fit in better with the dominant culture.

:doh ok. Look, Merry Christmas ok?
 
The gift part is fairly recent. It was a stern religious holiday for most of history. Maybe there was a feast at most. Even in the US it hasn't been about just gifts. Besides, there are worse things than spending time with friends and family and giving and receiving gifts you know.

Christmas was derived from Saturnalia, a pagan celebration during the Winter Solstice in which gifts were exchanged. When Rome converted to Christianity, Jesus' birthday was moved to December 25 and the celebration became Christmas.
 
Care to comment on his thoughts on Christmas?

He seems to choose the materialistic aspect of the holidays over the religious significance. Why do you see that as a good thing?

He said it right there the gentiles had cooler parties and he felt left out, but doesn't really care for the whole "Christ" part.
 
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