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Do you really believe in religion or do you conform for socioeconomic advantages?

Do you really believe in religion or do you conform for socioeconomic advantages?

  • Yes I really believe in religion.

    Votes: 20 83.3%

  • No I conform belief in religion for socioeconomic advantages

    Votes: 4 16.7%
  • Total voters
    24
SmokeAndMirrors said:
There are plenty of other non-religious groups one can belong to, and not all peers are so judgmental that they'd dislike you because of your religion.

Any group gives you certain opportunities, and also takes some away (if you conform to it to such an extent that going outside of it is a non-option).
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Oh that's completely not true I'm sorry to say.


America is a VERY socially conservative country intermeshed with religion even among its supposed liberals. If you want access to quality in America you're going to have to play along to some extent.
 
Lovebug said:
You are either a Christian, meaning you are surrender to Christ as your Savior for exactly that reason, or you are not.
It is not a bargaining position for socio economic advantages.
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It absolutely is a bargaining position for socioeconomic advantages.


A pretty Christian woman's pants coming down because you're wearing a piece of metal around your neck shaped a certain way is evidence enough of that.


Religion is merely a social club that grants access to its benefits structure. You're either going to be a part of that social club and reap the benefits or you're not and you're going to lose out.
 
Ryan5 said:
Oh that's completely not true I'm sorry to say.


America is a VERY socially conservative country intermeshed with religion even among its supposed liberals. If you want access to quality in America you're going to have to play along to some extent.
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Not unless you're in boondock nowhere in the deep South.

I've never had any problems with it. Non-religious is the second biggest category of religious opinion in the country. And in probably the majority of the country, the religious are perfectly accepting of the non-religious.

My best friend is religious, and cares not even a little that I'm not. I've had religious boyfriends. I've been part of a number of groups of mixed types of belief.

There is nothing you can't have as a non-religious person in this country, that you could have otherwise.

Yes, we're the most religious country in the developed world, but we're not frickin' Iran. Most people don't care so much that they'd malign you for not agreeing with them. Those who do are intolerant and ignorant, and not people any decent person would spend time with anyway.
 
Bigfoot 88 said:
So you call yourself a Christian, even though you aren't.

I'll remember that you are a dishonest person.
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I call myself a Christian because I want the social and monetary benefits of that club.


Christian is simply a 9 letter word. I get that. You don't. (Or maybe you do and you're just staying in character).
 
SmokeAndMirrors said:
Not unless you're in boondock nowhere in the deep South.

I've never had any problems with it. Non-religious is the second biggest category of religious opinion in the country. And in probably the majority of the country, the religious are perfectly accepting of the non-religious.

My best friend is religious, and cares not even a little that I'm not. I've had religious boyfriends. I've been part of a number of groups of mixed types of belief.

There is nothing you can't have as a non-religious person in this country, that you could have otherwise.

Yes, we're the most religious country in the developed world, but we're not frickin' Iran. Most people don't care so much that they'd malign you for not agreeing with them. Those who do are intolerant and ignorant, and not people any decent person would spend time with anyway.
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I'm not saying you can't be nonreligious, I'm saying if you want access to the best looking women, the "high life" in America in terms of socioeconomics and flesh, then you need to be religious or at least maintain a fervent moderateness.
 
Ryan5 said:
I'm not saying you can't be nonreligious, I'm saying if you want access to the best looking women, the "high life" in America in terms of socioeconomics and flesh, then you need to be religious or at least maintain a fervent moderateness.
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So non religious women are ugly, and conning women into sleeping with you is a life goal.

Gee, how pleasant.
 
SmokeAndMirrors said:
There are plenty of other non-religious groups one can belong to, and not all peers are so judgmental that they'd dislike you because of your religion.

Any group gives you certain opportunities, and also takes some away (if you conform to it to such an extent that going outside of it is a non-option).
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Sure, but the vast majority of Americans and likely the vast majority of people in your community are at least ostensibly members of a religion. Furthermore religious communities are among the largest and most accessible in the country. Yeah you could go to your local AHA group but I think you're kidding yourself if you think its on the same level.
 
Sherman123 said:
Sure, but the vast majority of Americans and likely the vast majority of people in your community are at least ostensibly members of a religion. Furthermore religious communities are among the largest and most accessible in the country. Yeah you could go to your local AHA group but I think you're kidding yourself if you think its on the same level.
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Who says I want it to be?

Not all religious groups are good. Some are extremely judgmental and damaging to their members.

Others are good. Just depends.

But non-religious groups usually lack the extremes of judgmentality, which I think is a good thing -- it makes things less of a guessing game.

Religious people also join non-religious groups with people of diverse beliefs or non-beliefs.
 
Ryan5 said:
I know for a fact that I don't believe in religion at all but I'm officially a Christian for socioeconomic reasons.
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First off, what "socioeconomic advantages" are you even referring to here?

There might very well be "good ole' boy networks" of sorts in place in a few very insular religious communities, but I've certainly never taken advantage of any such thing, nor has anyone in my family.
 
SmokeAndMirrors said:
So non religious women are ugly, and conning women into sleeping with you is a life goal.

Gee, how pleasant.
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Have at least some respect for women, goodness! If a woman makes the choice to sleep with anyone I think you need to respect her right as a woman to make that choice.



Who is saying nonreligious women are ugly? All I'm saying and have been saying is that the better looking women are usually on the mainstream sociocultural grapevine. They aren't running around in their twenties as avowed atheists. It just is what it is. The women who are secular in their twenties aren't generally ones you'd much want to be with. That's just life.


I don't view as a male going for the most socioeconomically connected, best looking women (which in America happens to mean Christian) as "conning" women.
 
Cephus said:
You are a prime example of what I've always called the "social Christian". You don't really buy into the beliefs, you pretend to do so because you think it makes you look better to the neighbors. I think the vast majority of people who claim to be Christians are actually "social Christians". They don't care about the Bible, they have no idea what they're supposed to believe but wearing a cross or showing up at church for networking purposes now and then gets them somewhere socially.
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"Christians in name only."
 
Gathomas88 said:
There might very well be "good ole' boy networks" of sorts in place in a few very insular religious communities, but I've certainly never taken advantage of any such thing, nor has anyone in my family.
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:lamo
 
Jesse Booth said:
I am religious for the psychological advantages. There was a short period in my life that I considered myself an atheist, and I felt that it did nothing to improve my life; if anything, I felt depressed and pessimistic much of the time. I eventually got back into being a Christian (but not a member of any church or branch of Christianity, as I do not trust organized religion), and have found no reason to regret my decision. I've never felt the kind of sweeping passion for my religion that some people describe, but I take comfort in my religious principles; they make the bad times more bearable and the good times more enjoyable.

But as for socioeconomic reasons, no. Haven't considered those, actually. Guess it's an INTJ thing.
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Would you say that you intentionally deceive yourself because it is comforting to do so?
 
Ryan5 said:
Have at least some respect for women, goodness! If a woman makes the choice to sleep with anyone I think you need to respect her right as a woman to make that choice.

Who is saying nonreligious women are ugly? All I'm saying and have been saying is that the better looking women are usually on the mainstream sociocultural grapevine. They aren't running around in their twenties as avowed atheists. It just is what it is. The women who are secular in their twenties aren't generally ones you'd much want to be with. That's just life.

I don't view as a male going for the most socioeconomically connected, best looking women (which in America happens to mean Christian) as "conning" women.
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I do. I just don't respect people who lie for manipulative reasons.

It is? According to whom? So yes, you think nonreligious women must be ugly or otherwise undesirable.
 
Ryan5 said:
I know for a fact that I don't believe in religion at all but I'm officially a Christian for socioeconomic reasons.
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Religion is one thing and God or Gods another. I don't see what they have in common. Religion is a profitable control mechanism using a God or Gods to induce fear of transgressing the control mechanism's protocols/rules/beliefs. Some God is likely the mechanism behind the Universe. Many religions say "watch out or he's gonna getcha." "Ya' better tithe or he's gonna getcha." "Ya' better behave (protocols/rules/beliefs) or he's gonna getcha." The merciful, all seeing, magnaminous God is gonna getcha and they just don't see their own contradictions. God is good, or he's not, eh?
 
SmokeAndMirrors said:
There are plenty of other non-religious groups one can belong to, and not all peers are so judgmental that they'd dislike you because of your religion.

Any group gives you certain opportunities, and also takes some away (if you conform to it to such an extent that going outside of it is a non-option).
Click to expand...

I have heard that in some smaller towns church membership is almost mandatory if you want to get along with most of your neighbors.
 
Ryan5 said:
Have at least some respect for women, goodness! If a woman makes the choice to sleep with anyone I think you need to respect her right as a woman to make that choice.



Who is saying nonreligious women are ugly? All I'm saying and have been saying is that the better looking women are usually on the mainstream sociocultural grapevine. They aren't running around in their twenties as avowed atheists. It just is what it is. The women who are secular in their twenties aren't generally ones you'd much want to be with. That's just life.


I don't view as a male going for the most socioeconomically connected, best looking women (which in America happens to mean Christian) as "conning" women.
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* In your opinion.
 
DaveFagan said:
Religion is one thing and God or Gods another. I don't see what they have in common. Religion is a profitable control mechanism using a God or Gods to induce fear of transgressing the control mechanism's protocols/rules/beliefs. Some God is likely the mechanism behind the Universe. Many religions say "watch out or he's gonna getcha." "Ya' better tithe or he's gonna getcha." "Ya' better behave (protocols/rules/beliefs) or he's gonna getcha." The merciful, all seeing, magnaminous God is gonna getcha and they just don't see their own contradictions. God is good, or he's not, eh?
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Is it so bad to accept that nature is just nature as awesome and majestic as it is and that there is no (and never was) "god" figure? I don't think equating nature to god is a good idea either, not to say that's what you mean, just saying.
 
Hard Truth said:
I have heard that in some smaller towns church membership is almost mandatory if you want to get along with most of your neighbors.
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Oh yeah, there are definitely very close-minded little places in this country. I've been in a couple of them. An atheist has legitimate reason to fear for their well-being, in those kinds of places.

But most of the country isn't like that.
 
ecofarm said:
No 'and' needed.
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Do tell, Eco, what "advantages" have I received because of my religion?

Hell! I've spent basically my entire life in the "Bible Belt" of the American Southeast, where Catholics are a minority, and not a particularly well liked one at that.
 
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Ryan5 said:
I know for a fact that I don't believe in religion at all but I'm officially a Christian for socioeconomic reasons.
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Have you ever considered a career in politics?
 
brothern said:
Have you ever heard of secular Jews? You're similar, but Christian.

Also to note: I hate secular Christians. Lol - :lol: But that's because I feel like moderates and conformers only serve to legitimize the behavior of the fundamentalists/extremists.
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I can't discuss secular Christians, but my observation of secular Jews that I have known is that they are motivated by a desire to keep their ethnic/religious culture alive, and especially want to share it with their children.
 
SmokeAndMirrors said:
I do. I just don't respect people who lie for manipulative reasons.

It is? According to whom? So yes, you think nonreligious women must be ugly or otherwise undesirable.
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If you respect women then let me pose this basic question to you and try to answer it objectively if you would please.



If a woman decides to be with a man based off her judgement about that man, who are you to judge her as an independent woman that she "was conned"? That sounds extremely degrading to your faith in women if you ask me. Perhaps you might want to check your claimed respect of your fellow women.
 
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