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Is the West at war with Islam?[W:118]

Is the West at War with Islam?

  • Yes Mostly

    Votes: 4 10.3%

  • Yes, kind of.

    Votes: 9 23.1%

  • No, kind of.

    Votes: 5 12.8%

  • No Mostly

    Votes: 21 53.8%
  • Total voters
    39
Re: Is the West at war with Islam?

USViking said:
No, not with the exception of black America, and you know, it would not
have been all that difficult for you to have learned that by quickly browsing
any of the innumerable bios available on the net.
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Why don't you enlighten us Mr. Viking? Or at least provide a link to what in the holy hell you reference.
 
Re: Is the West at war with Islam?

cpwill said:
Actually he's right on this. Mohammed didn't just found a faith, he founded an Empire and the Government that ruled it.
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Theocracy is different. Islam is not a political/social movement. There are tons of Muslims who just see their religion as exactly that- a religion.
 
Re: Is the West at war with Islam?

It's not that simple...

I think there is a cultural clash between what you might term "western" values - many of them christian in origin, but not all, and many which were have been co-opted by secular or other religions at this point - And some forms of the Muslim faith. Mostly if not entirely the more radical ones, I believe.


Because of this, more specifically because some persons who believe in a certain path for humanity are willing to initiate armed conflict to forward that path...

We have war.

Or at least I think that's part of it...
 
Re: Is the West at war with Islam?

cpwill said:
The problem being that obedience to that religion also requires the imposition of it on others. You aren't really given a choice on dhimmitude.
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This is true that it is a problem that needs to be dealt with. Imposition is directly at odds with values of freedom. The sooner they learn that imposition will not work ever the better. They should try tolerating freedom to decide instead of imposing theirs and expecting you to respect them!

cpwill said:
We aren't "At War with Islam". However, pretending that Islamists have somehow perverted Islam is equally untrue - theirs is a legitimate brand of Islam, if some of their actions are difficult to justify within the case history.
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Elaborate, and explain the word "dhimmitude" while at it. The dictionary does not provides solutions:

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/dhimmitude?s=ts
 
Re: Is the West at war with Islam?

DDD said:
This is true that it is a problem that needs to be dealt with. Imposition is directly at odds with values of freedom. The sooner they learn that imposition will not work ever the better. They should try tolerating freedom to decide instead of imposing theirs and expecting you to respect them!
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Sadly, it would be a violation of the tenets of their religion to do so.

Elaborate, and explain the word "dhimmitude" while at it. The dictionary does not provides solutions:
Click to expand...

It means the second class citizenship of non-Muslims, who deserve rule to be forced on them by Muslims, of Muslims.
 
Re: Is the West at war with Islam?

stonewall50 said:
This is an interesting question and I am curious to see a poll result. I am watching 60 minutes and some of the "Sharia" patrols are interesting to me. The protests and such in England and France. They are very foreign.

My personal view is that we are at war with Sharia law. Not really Islam. The West will NEVER accept Sharia law. It is not something that our culture will tolerate based on our development over the past few hundred years. So please share your views. I am interested.
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Of course, there are dumbdumbs that feel to be at war with Islam and may even be considered aggressively so. But, if someone knows anything about Islam, they cannot really be more at war with it than with Christianity or Hinduism. There are nuts that do stupid criminal stuff or use Islam as a ruse to justify their fling at conquest or enmity of some ruling house or an other. But that is nothing to do with Islam. So we are not at war with it or its religious. Only with some fanatics, criminals or war lords.
 
Re: Is the West at war with Islam?

Mr. Invisible said:
Theocracy is different. Islam is not a political/social movement. There are tons of Muslims who just see their religion as exactly that- a religion.
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:shrug: there are "Christians" who don't think that Christ dying on the cross was necessary. Islam is indeed a social and especially a political movement. It is holistic. There is no natural church-state division like you get in "render unto Caesar what is Caesar's".
 
Re: Is the West at war with Islam?

cpwill said:
:shrug: there are "Christians" who don't think that Christ dying on the cross was necessary. Islam is indeed a social and especially a political movement. It is holistic. There is no natural church-state division like you get in "render unto Caesar what is Caesar's".
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Like I said, there are people who take their Christianity into the political and social sphere as well.
 
Re: Is the West at war with Islam?

joG said:
Of course, there are dumbdumbs that feel to be at war with Islam and may even be considered aggressively so. But, if someone knows anything about Islam, they cannot really be more at war with it than with Christianity or Hinduism. There are nuts that do stupid criminal stuff or use Islam as a ruse to justify their fling at conquest or enmity of some ruling house or an other. But that is nothing to do with Islam. So we are not at war with it or its religious. Only with some fanatics, criminals or war lords.
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What about sharia law?
 
Re: Is the West at war with Islam?

HogWash said:
Why don't you enlighten us Mr. Viking? Or at least provide a link to what in the holy hell you reference.
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Wiki's bio will do fine.

Read it and you will see that Black was part of the epochal 1954 Brown decision. More tellingly Black with CJ Justice Douglas alone initially insisted upon the 1968 Alexander "desegregate now" order, eventually carrying the day against all the other justices, including the Chief.
 
Re: Is the West at war with Islam?

I wonder how people feel about the recent human rights violations in Egypt, a moderate Islamic society or so I am told.
 
Re: Is the West at war with Islam?

stonewall50 said:
What about sharia law?
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I do not like it much, but it is up to them unless they commit crimes here.
 
Re: Is the West at war with Islam?

joG said:
I do not like it much, but it is up to them unless they commit crimes here.
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How about sharia patrols in London that are potentially responsible for harming an American student from Florida?
 
Re: Is the West at war with Islam?

stonewall50 said:
How about sharia patrols in London that are potentially responsible for harming an American student from Florida?
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Crime. Not war.
 
Re: Is the West at war with Islam?

joG said:
Crime. Not war.
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Not all war is shots fired. Sometimes it can be a Cold War, or a culture war.
 
Re: Is the West at war with Islam?

Mr. Invisible said:
Like I said, there are people who take their Christianity into the political and social sphere as well.
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Sure. But it's not an explicit requirement of their faith, as it is for Islam.
 
Re: Is the West at war with Islam?

cpwill said:
Sadly, it would be a violation of the tenets of their religion to do so.
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I think they get a "free to be oppressed" option or nothing!
 
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Re: Is the West at war with Islam?

Moderator's Warning:
The topic of the OP is :Is the West at war with Islam?

That has nothing to do with the KKK, Robert Byrd or Ronald Reagan or anything dealing with those subjects.

Though the thread seems to be back on topic, please let us resist the temptation to pick up those discussion again, and stick to the topic of the thread. Thread bans are possible if not.
 
Re: Is the West at war with Islam?

USViking said:
Wiki's bio will do fine.

Read it and you will see that Black was part of the epochal 1954 Brown decision. More tellingly Black with CJ Justice Douglas alone initially insisted upon the 1968 Alexander "desegregate now" order, eventually carrying the day against all the other justices, including the Chief.
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Thanks...and which is why I used the terminolgy (I GUESS with the exception of) in the original post...

Originally Posted by HogWash View Post
And obviously had the approval of our U.S. Congress...eh?

He was appointed to the Supreme Court by President Franklin D. Roosevelt, with outrage ensuing over Black's former membership with the Ku Klux Klan. Black served on the court for 34 years, known for his ardent support of the Constitution and Bill of Rights. (I guess with the exception of black America) (emphasis added- USV)
He died on September 25, 1971.
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Re: Is the West at war with Islam?

Mr. Invisible said:
Like I said, there are people who take their Christianity into the political and social sphere as well.
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Something akin to this London cab driver?

A devout Arab Muslim entered a cab in London. He curtly asked the cabbie to turn off the radio because as decreed by his religious teaching, he must not listen to music because in the time of the prophet there was no music, especially Western music which is the music of the infidel.

The cab driver politely switched off the radio, stopped the cab and opened the door.
The Arab Muslim asked him, "What are you doing? "

The cabbie answered, "In the time of the prophet there were no taxis, so piss off and wait for a camel!"
 
Re: Is the West at war with Islam?

Mr. Invisible said:
You a stupid nigga.

Islam is a religion. There are some people who take it into the political/social realm just like there are people in the US who take their religion deeply into the political/social realm. It doesn't change the fact that Islam is a religion.
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I'm not sure I follow you? What was it I said that led you to that insulting and racist statement?

Of course Islam is a religion. It is also a political movement and a social movement and a legal movement. If stating that makes me a 'stupid nigga' (and I hope to God you got points for that), then so be it.
 
Re: Is the West at war with Islam?

Wiggen said:
I'm not sure I follow you? What was it I said that led you to that insulting and racist statement?

Of course Islam is a religion. It is also a political movement and a social movement and a legal movement. If stating that makes me a 'stupid nigga' (and I hope to God you got points for that), then so be it.
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Insulting? Yes. Racist? No.

Like I said, Islam is just a religion and there are those who take it deep into the political and social spheres, just like how we have people who do it with Christianity here in the US.

No I did not get any points. U mad?

cpwill said:
Sure. But it's not an explicit requirement of their faith, as it is for Islam.
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Please show me that it's an explicit requirement in Islam.
 
Re: Is the West at war with Islam?

USViking said:
Yeah, right, sure you did.
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HogWash said:
And obviously had the approval of our U.S. Congress...eh?

He was appointed to the Supreme Court by President Franklin D. Roosevelt, with outrage ensuing over Black's former membership with the Ku Klux Klan. Black served on the court for 34 years, known for his ardent support of the Constitution and Bill of Rights. (I guess with the exception of black America)
He died on September 25, 1971.
Hugo Black - Biography - Lawyer, Supreme Court Justice, US
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I surely did...you even quoted it on page 9...
 
Re: Is the West at war with Islam?

Mr. Invisible said:
Insulting? Yes. Racist? No.

Like I said, Islam is just a religion and there are those who take it deep into the political and social spheres, just like how we have people who do it with Christianity here in the US.

No I did not get any points. U mad?



Please show me that it's an explicit requirement in Islam.
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No, I am not surprised because nothing mods do surprises me. They let the most insulting and racist comments go while nailing the innocuous stuff. You can persist in this nonsense that 'Islam is just a religion' all you want. There are millions of people in the world that would disagree with you, most of them Muslims.
 
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