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Do you agree with this Preachers comments on the Ferguson situation?

Do you agree with this Preachers comments on the Ferguson situation?

  • Im a right leaning American, yes.

    Votes: 9 69.2%

  • Im a left leaning American, yes.

    Votes: 1 7.7%

  • Im not American, yes.

    Votes: 1 7.7%

  • Im a right leaning American, no.

    Votes: 1 7.7%

  • Im a left leaning American, no.

    Votes: 1 7.7%

  • Im not American, no.

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Total voters
    13
What does agreeing or disagreeing with the preacher have to do with which way one is leaning?
 
He has a valid point. And we can include the white kids who feel the need to riot and loot after any city's sports team wins a championship.

The rioting has nothing to do with the police action and one man but rather an opportunity to loot and trash the city you live in. It is like taking a crap in your own bed.
So now the city you live in has less stores and less chance of anyone wanting to invest in bringing a business into your city.

His best line was asking the Black Panthers where were they when the little girl was killed by a stray bullet while riding her tricycle in her front yard .
 
Crosscheck said:
He has a valid point. And we can include the white kids who feel the need to riot and loot after any city's sports team wins a championship.

The rioting has nothing to do with the police action and one man but rather an opportunity to loot and trash the city you live in. It is like taking a crap in your own bed.
So now the city you live in has less stores and less chance of anyone wanting to invest in bringing a business into your city.

His best line was asking the Black Panthers where were they when the little girl was killed by a stray bullet while riding her tricycle in her front yard .
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Its different from the LA riots we had here, in that instead of targeting Koreans and Whites, it appears blacks are hardest hit here. On top of that, its in black communities where rioting is greatest.

Will this mans comments be disparaged by some on the left?
 
US Conservative said:
It adds to the poll and facilitates discussion. Unless you do not wish so-but then why post?
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My problem it that i don't lean, really. So what should I say.
 
I don't understand what God has to do with it but yeah, as I said... being fed up, which those people in ferguson may be, doesn't give you the right to riot. It gives you the right to protest.

And as he said about change.
There are 2 widely known and good examples of black people who are not just examples for black people, but for a lot of people. Thomas Sowell and Neil deGrasse Tyson. They're both well known and make appearances on tv and ofc, the internet. Especially NdGT.

//I'm not talking about political leaders, like Obama, though Obama would be a good role model for black people. He's calm, he's healthy, he's intelligent and educated... he's a role model as a person.
 
joG said:
My problem it that i don't lean, really. So what should I say.
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You could go to a (several are better) political survey site and if it says you are directly in the center, come back and tell everyone about it.

Or you could not vote and say something?
 
Rainman05 said:
I don't understand what God has to do with it but yeah, as I said... being fed up, which those people in ferguson may be, doesn't give you the right to riot. It gives you the right to protest.

And as he said about change.
There are 2 widely known and good examples of black people who are not just examples for black people, but for a lot of people. Thomas Sowell and Neil deGrasse Tyson. They're both well known and make appearances on tv and ofc, the internet. Especially NdGT.

//I'm not talking about political leaders, like Obama, though Obama would be a good role model for black people. He's calm, he's healthy, he's intelligent and educated... he's a role model as a person.
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He's a preacher. Agree, about those two. One leans left, the other right but they are both giants in their fields and by my book in society. Neither are victims.
 
US Conservative said:
He's a preacher. Agree, about those two. One leans left, the other right but they are both giants in their fields and by my book in society. Neither are victims.
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I don't think NdGT leans left, I think he leans SCIENCE.

He was actually on Bush's team of experts and he said he likes republicans because they usually give more money to science and R&D than democrats.
 
Lovebug said:
What does agreeing or disagreeing with the preacher have to do with which way one is leaning?
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I agree with you. It doesn't. This is a simple case of "Stupid is has stupid does".

As to the Preacher's comments on the actions of Blacks in Ferguson, MO destroying businesses and such, I've said pretty much the same thing. It doesn't help their cause at all any more than trumped-up political activism. "No Justice, No Peace" reeks of Jessie Jackson/Al Sharpton opportunist activism. Personally, I've never liked either of them. Regardless, the preacher-man makes a very valid point; I've been echoing his words for years. That's not to say there aren't instances of racism or injustice that takes place. Just that we (Blacks) as a people do need to take control of our own situations and point the finger less at others and more at ourselves.

Personally, I've never blamed anyone else for my shortcomings. I evaluate me and change what I can so that I can be better/do better. But that's always been me.
 
Rainman05 said:
I don't think NdGT leans left, I think he leans SCIENCE.

He was actually on Bush's team of experts and he said he likes republicans because they usually give more money to science and R&D than democrats.
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Politically he's a lefty and he's said as much. However, I also respect his opinion-he's not about the rhetoric, neither is Sowell but he isn't in the lefts good graces.

Niels appearances on the joe rogan podcast discuss his politics, highly worth the view.
 
US Conservative said:
You could go to a (several are better) political survey site and if it says you are directly in the center, come back and tell everyone about it.

Or you could not vote and say something?
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No. I wouldn't say i am center either. Political position is a set of opinions. The ones i hold are sometimes similar to those on the right and sometimes to those on the left.
 
US Conservative said:
I certainly understand his frustrations.
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This guy is spot on, 100% right.
And it's a good thing the's black. He says things that a white man wouldn't get away with saying, but he's still right.

I didn't vote, as I don't lean right or left. I stand up straight.
 
Dittohead not! said:
This guy is spot on, 100% right.
And it's a good thing the's black. He says things that a white man wouldn't get away with saying, but he's still right.

I didn't vote, as I don't lean right or left. I stand up straight.
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Isn't it amazing what a shield of kryptonite (race, here) elicits forth regarding the left?
 
US Conservative said:
I certainly understand his frustrations.
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It is nonsense. It speaks to an incredibly unsophisticated way of viewing the world. Structure exists. Only the blind deny this, yet unsophisticated thinkers cannot process the ways in which structure constricts peoples ability to act. The de jure racism, segregation, and marginalization has largely been done away with. The structures and discourses in society which create de facto racism, segregation, and marginalization still exist. Those structures reproduce poverty, political marginalization, undereducation, etc. Ignoring the fact that 400 years of slavery and segregation left black people in an untenable economic situation, is simply stupid. Expecting black people to overcome their lack of privilege the moment legal obstacles were removed, despite their still existent lack of structural, economic, and political privilege is simply stupid. The lack of legal obstacles is why extraordinary black people like Neil Degrasse Tyson can succeed as they do. The existence of all the other obstacles still in existence, is why average black people do not have the same access to opportunity that average white people do. That is what is important. In our society extraordinary people are likely to succeed no matter their racial or economic background. There are also people from all backgrounds likely to not be successful. It is for the rest of people where the hundreds of years of structural and economic limitations are most clearly viewable. However, it takes a small amount of sophistication of thought to realize this reality.
 
Frodly said:
It is nonsense. It speaks to an incredibly unsophisticated way of viewing the world. Structure exists. Only the blind deny this, yet unsophisticated thinkers cannot process the ways in which structure constricts peoples ability to act. The de jure racism, segregation, and marginalization has largely been done away with. The structures and discourses in society which create de facto racism, segregation, and marginalization still exist. Those structures reproduce poverty, political marginalization, undereducation, etc. Ignoring the fact that 400 years of slavery and segregation left black people in an untenable economic situation, is simply stupid. Expecting black people to overcome their lack of privilege the moment legal obstacles were removed, despite their still existent lack of structural, economic, and political privilege is simply stupid. The lack of legal obstacles is why extraordinary black people like Neil Degrasse Tyson can succeed as they do. The existence of all the other obstacles still in existence, is why average black people do not have the same access to opportunity that average white people do. That is what is important. In our society extraordinary people are likely to succeed no matter their racial or economic background. There are also people from all backgrounds likely to not be successful. It is for the rest of people where the hundreds of years of structural and economic limitations are most clearly viewable. However, it takes a small amount of sophistication of thought to realize this reality.
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This man see's past those excuses. Take an active role. Stop tolerating BS.

Blacks had higher marriage rates and higher employment than whites until before ww1. This phenomenon is not because of slavery-though yes, riots did sometimes happen, etc. Much of the squalor we see today is because of the policies of progressive racist policies in the same time period through to the modern day. Thomas Sowell writes about this, heres a taste....
 
US Conservative said:
This man see's past those excuses. Take an active role. Stop tolerating BS.

Blacks had higher marriage rates and higher employment than whites until before ww1. This phenomenon is not because of slavery-though yes, riots did sometimes happen, etc. Much of the squalor we see today is because of the policies of progressive racist policies in the same time period through to the modern day. Thomas Sowell writes about this, heres a taste....
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That man is a middling thinker in a field of knowledge which is almost universally reductive and lacking in true intellectual rigor. First of all, what does that statistic about black marriage have to do with anything? What sport of statistical trend is that? How many slave marriages were actually legally recognized? None. Slaves weren't allowed to legally marry!! How many people who were unofficially married while slaves, proceed to officially marry their spouse after the end of slavery? Even assuming it was 100%, which it wasn't, you then only have about 40 years of statistics to go by. That is hardly statistically significant. It also speaks to a conception of marriage, in which marriage had little to do with love, and a lot to do with procreation. As differing conceptions of marriage arose, divorce rates increased among all groups of people.

Also, the fact that the divorce rate is higher among black people, absolutely DOES speak to a lack of economic opportunity. Economic instability is one of the leading causes of divorce. A man who cannot provide for his family, is not seen as a fit husband.

But that is besides the point anyways. My argument was more sophisticated than, it is all racism!! That is not even close to what I said. I said structural and discursive realities in existence during an era of de jure racism, didn't simply vanish at the ending of the de jure racism. My argument was about structure, discourse, the poverty trap, etc. Racism is not an irrelevant part of that equation, but it is certainly not the only element nor even the key element. It is more complicated than that. It requires a more sophisticated way of looking at the world, as I pointed out. Something Thomas Sowell has never been accused of having.
 
US Conservative said:
Its different from the LA riots we had here, in that instead of targeting Koreans and Whites, it appears blacks are hardest hit here. On top of that, its in black communities where rioting is greatest.

Will this mans comments be disparaged by some on the left?
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Anyone's comments, including yours, will be disparaged by some on the left and right.

That's reality.

Deal with it, or don't deal with it.

It's all up to you.
 
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Frodly said:
That man is a middling thinker in a field of knowledge which is almost universally reductive and lacking in true intellectual rigor. First of all, what does that statistic about black marriage have to do with anything? What sport of statistical trend is that? How many slave marriages were actually legally recognized? None. Slaves weren't allowed to legally marry!! How many people who were unofficially married while slaves, proceed to officially marry their spouse after the end of slavery? Even assuming it was 100%, which it wasn't, you then only have about 40 years of statistics to go by. That is hardly statistically significant. It also speaks to a conception of marriage, in which marriage had little to do with love, and a lot to do with procreation. As differing conceptions of marriage arose, divorce rates increased among all groups of people.

Also, the fact that the divorce rate is higher among black people, absolutely DOES speak to a lack of economic opportunity. Economic instability is one of the leading causes of divorce. A man who cannot provide for his family, is not seen as a fit husband.

But that is besides the point anyways. My argument was more sophisticated than, it is all racism!! That is not even close to what I said. I said structural and discursive realities in existence during an era of de jure racism, didn't simply vanish at the ending of the de jure racism. My argument was about structure, discourse, the poverty trap, etc. Racism is not an irrelevant part of that equation, but it is certainly not the only element nor even the key element. It is more complicated than that. It requires a more sophisticated way of looking at the world, as I pointed out. Something Thomas Sowell has never been accused of having.
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The single biggest predictor of poverty is a single parent household. This is a legitimate issue.
 
US Conservative said:
I certainly understand his frustrations.
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He's strong on condemnation and impotent frustration, he's just not so hot on suggesting solutions. "We have to CHANGE as black people!" Okay. Any suggestions for how?
 
US Conservative said:
The single biggest predictor of poverty is a single parent household. This is a legitimate issue.
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Ok. The first thing any intelligent person would suggest, is that your statement should say "a significant indicator of poverty is a single parent household." That is because of those two factors, it is unclear which is the causal factor. In other words, do single parent households lead to poverty or does poverty lead to single parent households. If the latter, then it would be more accurate to say poverty predicts single parent households, and not the opposite. That statement is also equally plausible. Or it is quite possible that they are mutually reinforcing phenomenon, single parent households do lead to poverty and poverty does lead to single parent households. One both creates and is created by the other.

The point being, if it is poverty that is the causal factor, then that supports my position, not yours.
 
He doesn't strike me as a preacher, more as an angry man, but he's spot on!!
 
He's both right and wrong. He's generally right that people are out there acting silly, but at the same point there is a legitimate structural poverty problem and racism still has a strong presence in the American "justice" system. Even conservatives like Rand Paul have admitted this. He's right that it has gotten better and that rioting won't change anything, but he's wrong that there aren't legitimate factors holding black people back even today. There's legitimate factors holding poor people of all races back.

Racism still exists, and that needs to be acknowledged, however the man is generally right about people acting silly over the issue. We have alot of work to do in the civil rights department, and I do believe the Michael Brown shooting was entirely unjustified, but burning down stores and looting is definitely not a way to fix the problem.
 
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