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How is poverty best eliminated?

What of the following does the best for eliminating poverty in the world?

  • Total voters
    80
joG said:
It does on the score card.

PS: BTW, they do not own millions. They have billions.
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Oops, you're right, typed that wrong. That's what I get for posting that late at night.
 
Cephus said:
Oops, you're right, typed that wrong. That's what I get for posting that late at night.
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Late night posts are dangerous. ;)
 
Glen Contrarian said:
And if you'll check, both Greece and Spain adopted austerity measures. France did at first, but has since began going back to classic Keynesian economics. Notice a difference in the three nations?
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Austerity measure, no one would lend them the money, now tell me what is the debt of the three socialist countries and who is lending them money to spend there way to prosperity. Remember they were borrowing and spending before they had to cut back as Keynesian did not work.

And how many of those nations are in danger of devolving to third-world status? None - not even Greece which, if you'll check, is finally beginning to recover economically.
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It is not recovering from anything, you call 25% unemployment a recovery, hell I guess Obama's worst recovery in US history after injecting 8 trillion into the economy is according to liberals the best recovery in US history.

And FYI, high unemployment is not necessarily the same as poverty, just as employment is not the same as prosperity. Many third-world nations have high employment rates...and really crappy poverty rates. Not only that, but you've got to be careful to remember that different nations set different benchmarks for poverty. China, for instance, that powerhouse of an economy claims to have a relatively low level of poverty...until one finds out that their poverty level is determined by how many make at less than $400/year.
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When you have high unemployment like Greece at 25%, you telling me they are not at the poverty level. Tell me what are the living on?

In other words, you and the other conservatives can tap-dance all you want, but socialized democracy like that found in ALL first-world democracies (including America) is the best way that mankind's ever had of keeping the poverty rate low, of maintaining a high standard of living for the population as a whole.
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There is not tap dance, all you have to do is look at Spain, France and Greece and any idiot can see socialist countries like these have not prospered, they are overloaded with debt and high unemployment. Hell it's fact. Yet liberals use these countries as models that we should follow. Not if I can help it.
 
Eliminating poverty's impossible. All the options can have both good and bad consequences depending on how and to what degree they're applied.
 
Cephus said:
And for those who choose not to learn?
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soylent.jpg
 
US Conservative said:
What works best to eliminate poverty? Multiple options are available.
Crony%20Capitalism%20Intellectual%20Takeout.jpg
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It can never be eliminated, there will always be some distinction. But the wealth gap in general can be lessened through the use of true free market capitalism.
 
Cephus said:
And for those who choose not to learn?
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They then deserve the consequences of those actions. Hopefully they change their choice at some point.
 
Glen Contrarian said:
REALLY? Care to prove that claim? Care to show which nations among the first-world SOCIALIZED democracies have such high percentages of people in poverty, with closed market economies? Care to show that the US had less people in poverty before the New Deal began bringing socialism to America?

But you're not going to reply. Why? Because the actual numbers, the actual facts are 180-out from your claim...and if you don't know that already, you'll find it out as soon as you begin trying to dig up those numbers and facts...

...and then you won't allow yourself to reply, because not only can you not prove your claims, but all the evidence points to the precise opposite of what you apparently want to believe.
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Well first, show where I said "first-world socialized democracies".

Second,
Number_in_Poverty_and_Poverty_Rate_1959_to_2011._United_States..jpg

Sadly, data prior to 1959 is lacking and would take some determined digging to find. Poverty rates prior to the "New Deal" are of course going to be high considering the affects of the depression and the dust bowl.

List of countries by percentage of population living in poverty - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Feel free to look up the socio-economic structure of the ones you want to. Of course, you probably won't like the fact that data is based upon income vs cost of living, something that the US does not do, as reported by those local governments.

Take a look at standards of living. Quality of Life Index by Country 2014 Mid Year
Look at all those socialist countries and closed market countries at the bottom.

Now take a look at cost of living Cost of Living Index by Country 2014 Mid Year
Wow, look at all those "first-world socialized democracies" at the top.

The US, the least socialized of those nations is second highest in standard of living but way down the list of cost of living and near the bottom of people living in abject poverty (other than homeless people, we don't actually have a population living in abject poverty.)
 
DVSentinel said:
Well first, show where I said "first-world socialized democracies".

Second,
View attachment 67171407

Sadly, data prior to 1959 is lacking and would take some determined digging to find. Poverty rates prior to the "New Deal" are of course going to be high considering the affects of the depression and the dust bowl.

List of countries by percentage of population living in poverty - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Feel free to look up the socio-economic structure of the ones you want to. Of course, you probably won't like the fact that data is based upon income vs cost of living, something that the US does not do, as reported by those local governments.

Take a look at standards of living. Quality of Life Index by Country 2014 Mid Year
Look at all those socialist countries and closed market countries at the bottom.

Now take a look at cost of living Cost of Living Index by Country 2014 Mid Year
Wow, look at all those "first-world socialized democracies" at the top.

The US, the least socialized of those nations is second highest in standard of living but way down the list of cost of living and near the bottom of people living in abject poverty (other than homeless people, we don't actually have a population living in abject poverty.)
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If there was any testament to US exceptionalism, this would have to be it. So why is it that so many want to the US to become EU Jr.?
 
ocean515 said:
Yes it is. $100's of billions in unfunded liabilities, some of the highest unemployment in the country, home to over 30% of the nations welfare cases, among the highest taxes in the nation, and many other Progressive/Socialist accomplishments.

But you know all that, since you spend so much time and effort developing the spin to address such realities.

Anyway, not that interested in a long tete a tete with you right now. Just wanted to pass on the thanks.
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Yeah, California's SO bad off, their economy's REALLY melting down...which is why Moody's and Standard-and-Poor's BOTH raised CA's credit rating, huh? As compared to oh-so-red Kansas which just got downgraded. But yeah, I guess California's really got those credit rating agencies bamboozled, huh? And the three state budget surpluses in a row - those are all lies, too.

And on top of all that, you're still ignoring the point I brought up that the nations with the best standard of living in the world are ALL first-world socialized democracies, whereas the nations with small governments, low effective taxes, and weak regulations are ALL third-world nations. You simply can't get around that fact.
 
Glen Contrarian said:
Oh, boy, but you sure are tap-dancing, aren't you?

Come on, guy, fess up - which first-world democracies (all of which ARE socialized, including America) are in danger of becoming third-world nations?

None.

And which nations with small governments, low effective taxes, and weak regulations are progressing to first-world status?

None.

You've got zero evidence on your side. All you've got are words, with no hard numbers, no FACTS to back you up. All you've got is your personal perception - taught to you by the right-wing echo chamber - that up is down, inside is out, good is bad, everybody carrying guns saves lives, Obama's a Muslim/communist/fascist/terrorist/Kenyan who has a deep-seated hatred for white people, and first-world socialized democracies are tyrannical regimes that are about to fall because we didn't listen to sociopath-loving Ayn Rand.
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Incorrect. The US is very much in danger since it's economy is very unstable, which means all those nations you mention are. Japan has narrowly avoided it several times only by massive loans from the government.

How unstable, look at debt to credit ratios.
U.S._Household_Debt_Relative_to_Disposable_Income_and_GDP.jpg

Notice that our households are way above 100% on debt to income ratio. That is bad, very bad.

Which nations are you referring to that have small governments, low effective taxes and weak regulation? China? Argentina? Thailand? For that matter most of central and South America? Oh, yeah, your ilk loves to bring up Somalia. That has to be who you're referring to.
 
Glen Contrarian said:
Yeah, California's SO bad off, their economy's REALLY melting down...which is why Moody's and Standard-and-Poor's BOTH raised CA's credit rating, huh? As compared to oh-so-red Kansas which just got downgraded. But yeah, I guess California's really got those credit rating agencies bamboozled, huh? And the three state budget surpluses in a row - those are all lies, too.

And on top of all that, you're still ignoring the point I brought up that the nations with the best standard of living in the world are ALL first-world socialized democracies, whereas the nations with small governments, low effective taxes, and weak regulations are ALL third-world nations. You simply can't get around that fact.
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:lamo

Moody's raised it from A1 to Aa3. Awesome. Oh, and every budget passed by the legislature is balanced, it's the law. What Brown and his progressive cronies who control the legislature didn't do again this year is pay back the billions they owe state funds they borrowed from in previous years.

If everything is so peachy, why did Brown call for more taxes when he rolled out his last budget?

The fact is, you really don't want to go down the California debate road GC, I am exceedingly well informed on the subject. It's just not worth my time to engage in such a pointless endeavor.

As to your socialist stuff regarding other countries. I don't care a bit. You've been posting that stuff for the longest time, and no matter what evidence is posted that takes the shine off, you throw it aside and start over again.

I'm glad you like all those socialist countries. I don't, and I'll fight people like you who want to bring it here until I'm dead. That's how it goes my friend.
 
eohrnberger said:
If there was any testament to US exceptionalism, this would have to be it. So why is it that so many want to the US to become EU Jr.?
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Because they think everything should be handed to them without effort to earn it and that they deserve the same salary and benefits as people who actually educate themselves and work for it.
 
Born Free said:
I guess you could equate poverty by the unemployment number. Notice all three of these SOCIALIZED countries are broke besides. Not only are they broke they have high unemployment = poverty. Poverty is the opposite of prosperity and there sure is no prosperity in these three socialist countries.

Greece = 27%
France = 10.4%
Spain = 25.1%
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Those dont count for some reason. :cool:

BTW, my father is Greek and I love the people but they are lazy as hell.
 
zoetherat said:
Eliminating poverty's impossible. All the options can have both good and bad consequences depending on how and to what degree they're applied.
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Thats true with most things in life. Water is both a life sustaining nutrient and a toxin depending on how much you drink. But these options are not equivocal.
 
Ockham said:
They then deserve the consequences of those actions. Hopefully they change their choice at some point.
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They'd either change or die and the problem would be solved either way. Unfortunately, we live in a society where stupid decisions are not punished, where liberals don't want anyone to suffer as a result of their bad decisions. If stupidity were painful, there wouldn't be so many stupid people. This is where 40 years of liberal politics has led us.
 
US Conservative said:
They can vote democrat.
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And they do, the Democrats buy their votes with endless social programs designed to keep anyone from ever having to get off their fat, lazy asses. It's not solving the problem though, just making it worse.
 
DVSentinel said:
Well first, show where I said "first-world socialized democracies".

Second,
View attachment 67171407

Sadly, data prior to 1959 is lacking and would take some determined digging to find. Poverty rates prior to the "New Deal" are of course going to be high considering the affects of the depression and the dust bowl.

List of countries by percentage of population living in poverty - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Feel free to look up the socio-economic structure of the ones you want to. Of course, you probably won't like the fact that data is based upon income vs cost of living, something that the US does not do, as reported by those local governments.

Take a look at standards of living. Quality of Life Index by Country 2014 Mid Year
Look at all those socialist countries and closed market countries at the bottom.

Now take a look at cost of living Cost of Living Index by Country 2014 Mid Year
Wow, look at all those "first-world socialized democracies" at the top.

The US, the least socialized of those nations is second highest in standard of living but way down the list of cost of living and near the bottom of people living in abject poverty (other than homeless people, we don't actually have a population living in abject poverty.)
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And, we have a near constant influx of poor immigrants (the largest in the world, over 1 million legal a year). In other words, checkmate.
 
Glen Contrarian said:
Yeah, California's SO bad off, their economy's REALLY melting down...which is why Moody's and Standard-and-Poor's BOTH raised CA's credit rating, huh? As compared to oh-so-red Kansas which just got downgraded. But yeah, I guess California's really got those credit rating agencies bamboozled, huh? And the three state budget surpluses in a row - those are all lies, too.

And on top of all that, you're still ignoring the point I brought up that the nations with the best standard of living in the world are ALL first-world socialized democracies, whereas the nations with small governments, low effective taxes, and weak regulations are ALL third-world nations. You simply can't get around that fact.
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California is a nightmare living on its legacy. One only need to live here a short time to see the nightmare that is unopposed liberalism.
 
ocean515 said:
:lamo

Moody's raised it from A1 to Aa3. Awesome. Oh, and every budget passed by the legislature is balanced, it's the law. What Brown and his progressive cronies who control the legislature didn't do again this year is pay back the billions they owe state funds they borrowed from in previous years.

If everything is so peachy, why did Brown call for more taxes when he rolled out his last budget?

The fact is, you really don't want to go down the California debate road GC, I am exceedingly well informed on the subject. It's just not worth my time to engage in such a pointless endeavor.

As to your socialist stuff regarding other countries. I don't care a bit. You've been posting that stuff for the longest time, and no matter what evidence is posted that takes the shine off, you throw it aside and start over again.

I'm glad you like all those socialist countries. I don't, and I'll fight people like you who want to bring it here until I'm dead. That's how it goes my friend.
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I participate in a political research group, they pay me (Im the "conservative") to give my opinions on different ideas they are thinking about floating to the public. Brown is desperate, and trying to find new ways to bleed the public in order to pay for his liberal fruitopia. It would be funny if it wasn't so sad how many people clap like seals at silly ideas.
 
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