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Are Labor and Trade Unions Still Necessary in Our Economy?

Are Labor and Trade Unions Still Necessary in Our Economy?

  • Yes

    Votes: 49 55.1%
  • No

    Votes: 31 34.8%
  • Other

    Votes: 9 10.1%

  • Total voters
    89
As a government worker I have experienced that my employers are almost as interested in short changing us, over-working us, underpaying us, taking away our benefits and ignoring our safety as private employers.
As one of your employers (and also one of my employees, technically, as I do contract work for my state, through several layers of contractors....how's that for a mind****, I pay myself), assuming we're in the same state or that you work federal....

I don't have much interest in short-changing, over-working, underpaying, taking away benefits, or ignoring your safety.

So long as those things are at reasonable levels.

And reasonable levels are in many cases NOT "what currently exists", let alone "what we would prefer" (spoken from the point of view of a public employee).
 
Let me guess, you are a union worker. Did you vote for Obama? Will you vote for Hillary? What has Obama done for unions? Before you say that Obama has done more for unions than Republicans have done, please answer what he has done for unions. Hillary is a well known anti-union person. Unions are toast. Most people do not want to pay for a job. There are laws in place to protect workers. You even said it yourself about unions taking other unions jobs. Unions fell for the old Democratic lie like blacks did from the Democratic Slave Plantation.."Trust us, we know what is best for you". Obama used unions just as he did blacks to garner votes and then pissed on them. The borders are open and it won't be long before amnesty is given to illegals. These people come here to work and will gladly take those overpaid union jobs and will not strike and will be very happy to have a job at half if not less than what union workers are paid. Just my opinion, but you people who voted for Obama got used big time. OUCH. Peace.


WTF are you talking about? Unions taking other unions jobs? I mentioned non-union sheet metal workers taking Union Ironworkers jobs for penny's on the dollar. Paying for a job? Are you talking about union dues? My union dues are like 50 bucks a month, and I make over 8000 a month. If an Ironworker has a problem with paying .6% of his monthly paycheck to cover administration costs then he doesn't need to be an Ironworker, go work at McDonalds for 9 bucks n hour. Why should anyone be happy to take a job for half the union job, when they can just join the union and make twice what they would make otherwise? Why, cause you have to pay union dues? Give me a break.


I shouldn't have to ask the question.. I already know the answer. The reason is that you on the right get filled with so much misinformation and politicized nonsense about how horrible unions are and how they are dragging this country down. You've never actually been a part of one, and never actually learned a single thing about how they operate or how they benefit the people that are part of them. You just keep swallowing the same nonsense and lies that you hear and regurgitate them at me in the form of your previous post.
 
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Off topic? I may have embellished a little, but any union talk is all about the economy in my eyes. Why would a company pay a union worker a higher wage when he can get an open border illegal to do the same job for a whole lot less money, hence economy.

Speaking for the Ironworkers union again. The reason a company would pay a Trade Union member a higher wage to do a job is because it is skilled labor. Do you want someone with no knowledge of how to build a skyscraper or would you want someone who has gone through an apprenticeship and 4 years of school to do that job? .. Are you going to trust an illegal imigrant that you can pay 9 bucks an hour or would you rather have your building be structurally sound and pay them 32 dollars an hour?
 
My answer is still NO "in" this economy. There is cheaper labor either way.

I can understand businesses wanting the cheapest payroll they can get, I will support unions to protect workers rights until something better comes along.
 
As one of your employers (and also one of my employees, technically, as I do contract work for my state, through several layers of contractors....how's that for a mind****, I pay myself), assuming we're in the same state or that you work federal....

I don't have much interest in short-changing, over-working, underpaying, taking away benefits, or ignoring your safety.

So long as those things are at reasonable levels.

And reasonable levels are in many cases NOT "what currently exists", let alone "what we would prefer" (spoken from the point of view of a public employee).

I am glad you dont but there are a lot of supervisors that treat their workers like they are their little serfs.
 
WTF are you talking about? Unions taking other unions jobs? I mentioned non-union sheet metal workers taking Union Ironworkers jobs for penny's on the dollar. Paying for a job? Are you talking about union dues? My union dues are like 50 bucks a month, and I make over 8000 a month. If an Ironworker has a problem with paying .6% of his monthly paycheck to cover administration costs then he doesn't need to be an Ironworker, go work at McDonalds for 9 bucks n hour. Why should anyone be happy to take a job for half the union job, when they can just join the union and make twice what they would make otherwise? Why, cause you have to pay union dues? Give me a break.

I shouldn't have to ask the question.. I already know the answer. The reason is that you on the right get filled with so much misinformation and politicized nonsense about how horrible unions are and how they are dragging this country down. You've never actually been a part of one, and never actually learned a single thing about how they operate or how they benefit the people that are part of them. You just keep swallowing the same nonsense and lies that you hear and regurgitate them at me in the form of your previous post.

If unions are so great, why are union numbers going down instead of up? If your Ironworker job is so "skilled" why do you NEED a union? If you are such a "skilled" workforce you should be able to get your own job w/o having to pay someone no matter what the dues are. How do you know if I have been or not been a part of a union? I have worked with Ironworkers before and they are know in the trades as "laborers without brains". Just because you fall for that "we will take care of you" crap does not mean that all workers need someone to protect their job or have to pay to keep a job.
 
I can understand businesses wanting the cheapest payroll they can get, I will support unions to protect workers rights until something better comes along.

So you have no faith in big government looking out for workers? I have no faith in big government at all.
 
Speaking for the Ironworkers union again. The reason a company would pay a Trade Union member a higher wage to do a job is because it is skilled labor. Do you want someone with no knowledge of how to build a skyscraper or would you want someone who has gone through an apprenticeship and 4 years of school to do that job? .. Are you going to trust an illegal imigrant that you can pay 9 bucks an hour or would you rather have your building be structurally sound and pay them 32 dollars an hour?

How strong are those "unions" who build skyscrapers in Mexico? How well do those "union ironworkers" get paid in Mexico? Or is it maybe they are not union ironworkers? Please tell me about all those "union ironworkers" in China or don't they build skyscrapers in China? Your "skilled" union ironworker claim is a joke. There are many countries that build skyscrapers w/o your self proclaimed "skilled union" workers.
 
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I have worked two different factory jobs one without unions and one with unions. The union job is better. By about 100 miles. I do less and get paid more and the benefits are better. So yeah if you can go union do it.

Now I get it. You used to be a conservative, when you had a non-union job. Now with your union job, your conservative card has been repealed and the best you can do is to be a moderate.
 
It is nice to hear a Liberal not having faith in big government.

I wish the government wasnt needed as much as it is used. If a more appropriate thread comes along I will express more of my wide variety of views.
 
How strong are those "unions" who build skyscrapers in Mexico? How well do those "union ironworkers" get paid in Mexico? Or is it maybe they are not union ironworkers? Please tell me about all those "union ironworkers" in China or don't they build skyscrapers in China? Your "skilled" union ironworker claim is a joke. There are many countries that build skyscrapers w/o your self proclaimed "skilled union" workers.

LoL name one country that builds skyscrapers without skilled workers.

As a union ironworker you are required to have 5000 hours of non-paid schooling. Its a skilled trade regardless of your ignorance.

And yes, there is Skilled Union workers in Mexico, China, all throughout Europe, even in the middle east. Learn a little before you rant.

In fact the largest trade union in the world is in China.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/All-China_Federation_of_Trade_Unions
 
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So you have no faith in big government looking out for workers? I have no faith in big government at all.
Big government tends to be in the pocket of big business. Conservative-led governments more than liberal-led governments, especially with respect to workers, but the latter is certainly not immune from being beholden to the almighty corporate dollar.
 
Big government tends to be in the pocket of big business. Conservative-led governments more than liberal-led governments, especially with respect to workers, but the latter is certainly not immune from being beholden to the almighty corporate dollar.

Hillary Clinton come to mind? Ole Hilly worked for one of the biggest anti-union law firms in America. And when Hillary was on the WalMart Board of Directors she sat in on 33 anti-union board meetings. We all know that Bill and Hillary were owned by Sam.
 
LoL name one country that builds skyscrapers without skilled workers.

As a union ironworker you are required to have 5000 hours of non-paid schooling. Its a skilled trade regardless of your ignorance.

And yes, there is Skilled Union workers in Mexico, China, all throughout Europe, even in the middle east. Learn a little before you rant.

In fact the largest trade union in the world is in China.

All-China Federation of Trade Unions - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Maybe you should read the WHOLE Wiki you put up. It may be a union but it has NO bargaining power and is run by the company......ROTFLMMFAO. You don't have to be "union" to be "skilled". Unions are done. The numbers are dwindling more and more each year. Bye, bye overpaid underworked laborers w/o brains. However, activists within the ACFTU and the World Federation of Trade Unions dispute the claims of the rival trade union federation. ACFTU activist Guo Wencai said that democratic elections were a key standard to measure the effectiveness of a trade union and noted that the practice of company chiefs "appointing union leaders or assigning someone from their human resources department to act as union leader hampers a trade union's independence and its ability to protect workers' rights.[
 
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Now I get it. You used to be a conservative, when you had a non-union job. Now with your union job, your conservative card has been repealed and the best you can do is to be a moderate.

I've been that way far long before my last jobs. Actually a little after 2007 I switched to Democrat as I was getting older.
 
Maybe you should read the WHOLE Wiki you put up. It may be a union but it has NO bargaining power and is run by the company......ROTFLMMFAO. You don't have to be "union" to be "skilled". Unions are done. The numbers are dwindling more and more each year. Bye, bye overpaid underworked laborers w/o brains. However, activists within the ACFTU and the World Federation of Trade Unions dispute the claims of the rival trade union federation. ACFTU activist Guo Wencai said that democratic elections were a key standard to measure the effectiveness of a trade union and noted that the practice of company chiefs "appointing union leaders or assigning someone from their human resources department to act as union leader hampers a trade union's independence and its ability to protect workers' rights.[


You know nothing of what trade unions do. Why do you hate on people making money? You'd rather stick up for big business than the middle class union worker? It just doesn't make sense to me why there is a race to the bottom. Are you just jealous and want to bring everyone down to your level?
 
Many people often claim that labor and trade unions are no longer needed, because "safety regulations, fair wages, days off, 8 hour work day, and child labor" have already been won. They claim because of this labor, and trade unions are no longer needed. My question is: Are Labor and Trade Unions Still Necessary in Our Economy?

Nope. They are simply wings of the democratic party and nothing more. They serve only themselves and Washington.
 
I've been that way far long before my last jobs. Actually a little after 2007 I switched to Democrat as I was getting older.

That's the exact opposite path from what most people take...

It's easy to be a liberal - no thinking required. It is why kids tend to be liberal, b/c they have no life experience, and are easily duped by slogans, calls for "justice" and "fairness", etc.

As people age and grow in experience, idealism gives way to reality, and people tend to abandon the boondoggles and foolishness of their youth and gravitate toward more responsible and informed positions.

As our Founding Fathers maintained, and as history clearly shows - only a fool would want to live in a democracy - how is it that no democrat understands any of this??

I would think the corruption that is unions, and the disasterous effect they are having upon our country, would be obvious - yet it escapes people?? I find it all amazing.
 
Nope. They are simply wings of the democratic party and nothing more. They serve only themselves and Washington.

So they are not necessary because you dont like who many labor unions endorse?
 
Big government tends to be in the pocket of big business. Conservative-led governments more than liberal-led governments, especially with respect to workers, but the latter is certainly not immune from being beholden to the almighty corporate dollar.
Hillary Clinton come to mind? Ole Hilly worked for one of the biggest anti-union law firms in America. And when Hillary was on the WalMart Board of Directors she sat in on 33 anti-union board meetings. [...]
Thank you for proving my point :)

However, if you want to name names then I'm sure a President Hillary would be more friendly to labor than a President Chris, a President Rand, or a President Canada :2razz: so, as I noted above, it is all a matter of degree.
 
[...] It's easy to be a liberal - no thinking required. It is why kids tend to be liberal, b/c they have no life experience, and are easily duped by slogans, calls for "justice" and "fairness", etc. [...]
Pot, meet kettle :lamo

I would think the corruption that is unions, and the disasterous effect they are having upon our country, would be obvious - yet it escapes people?? I find it all amazing.
Offhand I would say the most disastrous things to happen to the country over the past few decades, with respect to harming the economy, are:

1. The 9/11 attacks -- effectively caused by a corrupt foreign policy.

2. The subsequent Iraq war -- decidedly caused by a corrupt Republican government (ours).

3. The Great Recession of 2008 -- decidedly caused by corrupt, careless corporations.

Tell me again how unions are destroying the country?
confuse.gif
 
So they are not necessary because you dont like who many labor unions endorse?

I dont' think they're necessary as they don't serve the people they claim to. They are simply exist to put democrats in office.
 
I dont' think they're necessary as they don't serve the people they claim to. They are simply exist to put democrats in office.

I would say providing generally good insurance, providing better pay, benefits, and better job security serves their members...
 
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