Pentagon leaders: Iraq probably needs outside help to retake seized territory

anatta · Jul 3, 2014

Iraqi security forces are probably incapable of retaking large swaths of territory seized by Sunni insurgents in recent weeks without outside help, the Pentagon’s top leaders said Thursday as they sketched a bleak assessment of turmoil in the country.

Dempsey said the U.S. government was contemplating the possibility of airstrikes, as well as providing help beyond what is being provided by about 750 U.S. military advisers and other troops that have deployed to Iraq in recent weeks “What will we be willing to contribute to that cause?” he said. “That’s not a question that we’re prepared to answer just yet.”

The answer, he added, would depend on political developments in Iraq. Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki, a Shiite Muslim, has alienated Sunnis, Kurds and other groups, and it is unclear whether he can muster the votes in parliament to win a third term. If Iraq is unable to form a new government that can draw support from all factions, “then the future’s pretty bleak,” Dempsey said.

what do you think? I've been for airstrikes al along, without conditions -ISIL/ISIS is the target either way, whether Iraq partitions by itself or not.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world...2d0-11e4-8572-4b1b969b6322_story.html?hpid=z1

So I don't see any reason to condition strikes (drone/air) on "political developments"

MMC · Jul 3, 2014

annata said:
what do you think? I've been for airstrikes al along, without conditions -ISIL/ISIS is the target either way, whether Iraq partitions by itself or not.

So I don't see any reason to condition strikes (drone/air) on "political developments"

Heya AT :2wave: .....have you checked out the War on Terror Forum? Check out what I have up on Concerning Syria and The Concerning Iraq thread as well.

Also check this out.

The US Is Flying Right Into The Iran-Russia-Syria Plan In Iraq.....

The skies of Iraq are getting crowded. U.S. Apache attack helicopters and unarmed drones are being deployed along with the 500 American troops already ordered to the country. They're just the latest foreign aircraft to join the fight against ISIS, the jihadist group that's swept through northern and western Iraq in recent weeks.

The Syrian Air Force bombed targets that were allegedly ISIS positions in western Iraq last week. Iran has reportedly sent its entire fleet of Sukoi-24 fighter jets to Iraq. And Russia has sent jets and "advisors" to assist Baghdad.....snip~

MMC · Jul 3, 2014

Yet the alliance between these three countries has transformed the Middle East in the years after the "Arab Spring" protests of 2011. Russian and Iranian support allowed the Syrian regime of Bashar al Assad to survive against a constellation of secular and jihadist rebel groups — feeding a war that's killed over 150,000 people and leading to the displacement of over 9 million.

Iran's strong position in Syria — enabled through Russian financial, diplomatic and military support for Assad — has allowed it to turn Baghdad into a veritable client, to the point where Qods Force commander Qassem Suleimani is arguably the most powerful person in the country.

And there's been plenty of blowback from these policies throughout the Middle East, from the destabilization of Lebanon to the ongoing falling out between the U.S. and its Gulf allies to the potential creation of an independent Kurdistan.

"If you want to build up a non-jihadi Sunni force that is capable of commanding loyalty from people on the ground then you have to fight Assad and push against Iran, and you push back against ISIS and Iran at the same time," he said. "If you're just fighting ISIS then you're building an Iranian security system in the region."

"The Iraqis are a thin membrane between the U.S. and the Qods Force" says Doran, referring to the foreign arm of the Iranian Revolutionary Guards. "Any intelligence that we give to the Iraqis is probably going to be on the desk of Qassem Suleimani in less than a day.".....snip~

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/us-flying-iran-russia-syria-164839784.html

anatta · Jul 3, 2014

MMC said:
Heya AT :2wave: .....have you checked out the War on Terror Forum? Check out what I have up on Concerning Syria and The Concerning Iraq thread as well.

Also check this out.

The US Is Flying Right Into The Iran-Russia-Syria Plan In Iraq.....

The skies of Iraq are getting crowded. U.S. Apache attack helicopters and unarmed drones are being deployed along with the 500 American troops already ordered to the country. They're just the latest foreign aircraft to join the fight against ISIS, the jihadist group that's swept through northern and western Iraq in recent weeks.

The Syrian Air Force bombed targets that were allegedly ISIS positions in western Iraq last week. Iran has reportedly sent its entire fleet of Sukoi-24 fighter jets to Iraq. And Russia has sent jets and "advisors" to assist Baghdad.....snip~

hi MMC -will do - I also saw Iranian SU-25's seized during the Iran Iraq war, are now showing up on Iraqi runways, with Iranian flags, and prolly Iranian pilots.
IISS Report: Iraq's Latest Su-25s Come From Iran | Defense News | defensenews.com

We need to get off the pot, if nothing else then to support ANYONE not ISIL. I'm not crazy about Iranian hegemony, but it's already there.

Ryan5 · Jul 3, 2014

Yes YES!!!! Let's spend tens of millions of USD on AIRSTRIKES on random men running around with machine guns in Iraq whom posses 3rd grade educations!!!!!!

Let's even send troops and spend hundreds of millions on those logistics as well!!!

Let's do it!!!!!!!! INSANITY for the win!!!!!!!!!

iliveonramen · Jul 3, 2014

It doesn't matter how many bombs we drop as long as the Iraqi forces surrender without a fight.

MMC · Jul 3, 2014

iliveonramen said:
It doesn't matter how many bombs we drop as long as the Iraqi forces surrender without a fight.

All we need do.....is kill terrorists. Just a few small bombs and proper placed drones. Then we can get out of there.

The_US_Is_Flying_Right-a7491b13c52883a3ed488779967a16fd

jamesrage · Jul 3, 2014

annata said:
what do you think? I've been for airstrikes al along, without conditions -ISIL/ISIS is the target either way, whether Iraq partitions by itself or not.

Pentagon leaders: Iraq probably needs outside help to retake seized territory - The Washington Post

So I don't see any reason to condition strikes (drone/air) on "political developments"

We stay out of it.We pack out **** up and get any American there of government business out of there. Iraq is not worth any more American lives and dollars. We removed a genocidal brutal dictator for them and gave these people a chance and they blew it.

polgara · Jul 3, 2014

annata said:
hi MMC -will do - I also saw Iranian SU-25's seized during the Iran Iraq war, are now showing up on Iraqi runways, with Iranian flags, and prolly Iranian pilots.
IISS Report: Iraq's Latest Su-25s Come From Iran | Defense News | defensenews.com

We need to get off the pot, if nothing else then to support ANYONE not ISIL. I'm not crazy about Iranian hegemony, but it's already there.

We're going to get blamed for whatever happens, if it doesn't turn out well. Russia and Syria will be the good guys as far as Iraq is concerned, since we're way too late to try and take credit, as far as Maliki is concerned. I just hope none of our people are hurt or killed! Who's coordinating this anyway?

Greetings, Annata. :2wave:

anatta · Jul 3, 2014

well ISIL isn't just an Iraqi problem it's REGIONAL PROBLEM, threating a caliphate - and that becomes a true terrorist state.

AQAP is working on undetectable bombs. and would love to have a caliphate alongside with al-Qaeda; but I get the idea Americans are sick of war - so am I, unfortunately we have the burden to keep the region sane.

Russia is a so-so partner, not wanting a terrorist state, but Russia is always willing to take the short term gains over long term stability

anatta · Jul 3, 2014

Ryan5 said:
Yes YES!!!! Let's spend tens of millions of USD on AIRSTRIKES on random men running around with machine guns in Iraq whom posses 3rd grade educations!!!!!!

Let's even send troops and spend hundreds of millions on those logistics as well!!!

Let's do it!!!!!!!! INSANITY for the win!!!!!!!!!

they aren't stupid schoolchildren ; al - Baghdadi is a savvy character, quite capable of governing, military command, and worldwide financial reach.

I tend to think of him as a very brutal mafia type, but with religious fervor to glom in the jihadis, where the mafia were content to play behind the scenes.

our intel is pretty good, nothing "random" about it. we are using Shadow drones

MMC · Jul 3, 2014

annata said:
well ISIL isn't just an Iraqi problem it's REGIONAL PROBLEM, threating a caliphate - and that becomes a true terrorist state.

AQAP is working on undetectable bombs. and would love to have a caliphate alongside with al-Qaeda; but I get the idea Americans are sick of war - so am I, unfortunately we have the burden to keep the region sane.

Russia is a so-so partner, not wanting a terrorist state, but Russia is always willing to take the short term gains over long term stability

Its more than a regional problem now AT.....and more of threat to the US and Europe than it ever was before.

The only ones that are not at the Table are the Europeans.....everyone needs to start hitting these guys now. In Syria, In Iraq, and all should strike any known targets anywhere else.

Let the message be sent.

Moreover ISIL says the next to be conquered will be Rome and Italy.....which now Any Organized Crime Syndicates should also be interested in removing any they know of....including all mules.

anatta · Jul 3, 2014

MMC said:
All we need do.....is kill terrorists. Just a few small bombs and proper placed drones. Then we can get out of there.

exactly. counter-terrorism, not counter-insurgency for ISIL

What is the difference between counter-insurgency and counter-terrorism?

The difference between counter-terrorism and counter-insurgency is simple: counter-terrorism focuses more narrowly on combating the tactics and strategy of terrorism and those who employ it, while counter-insurgency is a broader category of responses to political violence carried out by minority groups, both terroristic and otherwise

anatta · Jul 3, 2014

MMC said:
Its more than a regional problem now AT.....and more of threat to the US and Europe than it ever was before.

The only ones that are not at the Table are the Europeans.....everyone needs to start hitting these guys now. In Syria, In Iraq, and all should strike any known targets anywhere else.

Let the message be sent.

understood, but for now the region is the battlefield; but I take the idea of ISIL's ambitions, as well as the undetectable bombs.

The Europeans are worthless, content to have Syrian talks -though how you "talk" to ISIl & al-Baghdadai..:roll:

still they have more direct contact (European jihadists -Brits, etc) we can hope they'll lend whatever support

anatta · Jul 3, 2014

MMC said:
Its more than a regional problem now AT.....and more of threat to the US and Europe than it ever was before.

The only ones that are not at the Table are the Europeans.....everyone needs to start hitting these guys now. In Syria, In Iraq, and all should strike any known targets anywhere else.

Let the message be sent.

Moreover ISIL says the next to be conquered will be Rome and Italy.....which now Any Organized Crime Syndicates should also be interested in removing any they know of....including all mules.

the Levant , (if not more) is the realistic target of ISIL

MMC · Jul 3, 2014

annata said:
understood, but for now the region is the battlefield; but I take the idea of ISIL's ambitions, as well as the undetectable bombs.

The Europeans are worthless, content to have Syrian talks -though how you "talk" to ISIl & al-Baghdadai..:roll:

still they have more direct contact (European jihadists -Brits, etc) we can hope they'll lend whatever support

Yeah and there are several there now.....which should be going after ISIL. Not waiting.

Already the Kurds and the Sunni have walked away from this first parliamentary meeting. All because Maliki wasn't removed. Kerry visited the Kurds trying to get them to take to the offensive.

MMC · Jul 3, 2014

annata said:
the Levant , (if not more) is the realistic target of ISIL

This is their 5 year plan.

See the Terrifying ISIS Map Showing Its 5-Year Expansion Plan.....

The Islamic militant group currently marching across Iraq trying to seize territory in order to create an Islamic state has purportedly published a map showing their plans for the next five years.

The maps were widely shared on Twitter this weekend. They show parts of Africa, the Middle East, and even Europe shaded in black, to represent the territories that ISIS hopes will be part of its Sunni-run state.

See the Terrifying ISIS Map Showing Its 5-Year Expansion Plan - ABC News

http://www.debatepolitics.com/war-t...pe-and-us-homeland-threat-extremely-high.html

anatta · Jul 3, 2014

MMC said:
Yeah and there are several there now.....which should be going after ISIL. Not waiting.

Already the Kurds and the Sunni have walked away from this first parliamentary meeting. All because Maliki wasn't removed. Kerry visited the Kurds trying to get them to take to the offensive.

ya. I did see that parliamentarian attempt at 'reconciliation" same old poisoned well.

A very large part of the failure/breakup of Iraq is al-Malaki;not to underplay the sectarianism, but he is worse then worthless

iliveonramen · Jul 9, 2014

MMC said:
All we need do.....is kill terrorists. Just a few small bombs and proper placed drones. Then we can get out of there.

And new ones will take their place. We've been killing terrorists in Iraq for 10 years. I'm not sure how we'd ever drop more bombs or kill more than we did over that 10 year period

shrubnose · Jul 9, 2014

annata said:
what do you think?

Click to expand...

I've been for airstrikes al along, without conditions -ISIL/ISIS is the target either way, whether Iraq partitions by itself or not.

Pentagon leaders: Iraq probably needs outside help to retake seized territory - The Washington Post

So I don't see any reason to condition strikes (drone/air) on "political developments"

I think that the USA needs to stay far away from that place and let those losers fight their own civil war.

No matter who wins they'll never be real friends of the USA.

MMC · Jul 9, 2014

iliveonramen said:
And new ones will take their place. We've been killing terrorists in Iraq for 10 years. I'm not sure how we'd ever drop more bombs or kill more than we did over that 10 year period

Well most would disagree.....as the Sunni and the Shia combined with the US and NATO forced had driven AQ and the Main Terrorists out of Iraq.

Now the Sunni and Shia have let them return.....while they have been fighting each other and politicking against one another.

These ones have to be taken out.....they overran a Military base that housed Stinger Missiles.

As for the rest of it.....its not our affair. Going forward......Terrorists means the war on Terror. Everybody else own personal issues will need to be put on hold. All needs to do what they need to and then go back to their issues.

Lursa · Jul 9, 2014

Why do it? It wont fix anything. It will help short term probably but so? We *cannot* fix their problems...we dont know how, afaik, it's not possible. We couldnt in 2003. We couldnt in 2009.

So we'll spend billions, lose more American lives (oh yes, it'll happen), and it still wont actually solve anything....it just puts off the inevitable.

anatta · Jul 9, 2014

shrubnose said:
I think that the USA needs to stay far away from that place and let those losers fight their own civil war.

No matter who wins they'll never be real friends of the USA.

seems to be the common idea. I did notice Russia has sent pilots & planes and also the same from Iran.

I do believe we have a legitimate interest in going after ISIL, without getting into the Shia/Sunni war

Pentagon leaders: Iraq probably needs outside help to retake seized territory

should the US use air power in Iraq on ISIS?

No airstrikes, No way, No how

airstrikes only if Iraq shows political progress

airstrikes on ISIS irregardless of Iraqi political progress - they are terrorists

It's not our problem, i don't care what happens

More options

anatta

MMC

MMC

anatta

Ryan5

iliveonramen

Pontificator

MMC

jamesrage

polgara

anatta

anatta

MMC

anatta

anatta

anatta

MMC

MMC

anatta

iliveonramen

Pontificator

shrubnose

MMC

Lursa

Tenacious

anatta