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Does the US owe otherwise law abiding Latin Americans sancuary from druglords?

Does US drug problem warrant offering refugee status to people from cartel areas?

  • Yes.

    Votes: 6 17.6%

  • No.

    Votes: 28 82.4%
  • Total voters
    34
Smeagol

Smeagol

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I was watching a report this morning on the influx of illegal immigrants. They interviewed one lady who said the reason she and her children entered America was to escape the danger of living in her own country that is now controlled by drug cartels. It dawned on me, the drug cartels exist because of the American market and demand for illegal drugs. A huge often unspoken cause of the illegal immigration problem is possibly American-made; our demand for illegal drugs that have made their country uninhabitable due to the organized crime culture that now exists in their country. If American vices have inadvertently created a drug cartel controlled war zone in their country, do we have a moral obligation to offer the otherwise law abiding citizens of those affected countries sanctuary as refugees?
 
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No, the United States does not have a moral obligation to offer sanctuary to refugees on account of any American market for illegal drugs.
 
Smeagol said:
I was watching a report this morning on the influx of illegal immigrants. They interviewed one lady who said the reason she and her children entered America was to escape the danger of living in her own country that is now controlled by drug cartels. It dawned on me, the drug cartels exist because of the American market and demand for illegal drugs. A huge often unspoken cause of the illegal immigration problem is possibly American-made; our demand for illegal drugs that have made their country uninhabitable due to the organized crime culture that now exists in their country. If American vices have inadvertently created a drug cartel controlled war zone in their country, do we have a moral obligation to offer the otherwise law abiding citizens of those affected countries sanctuary as refugees?
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The US and almost all organized areas around the world have really messed up with drugs. We should not have forbidden them but sold them in a monitored way. We have wasted enormous resources and fed criminal organizations so much moneys that the have grown to the size of states.

We certainly have to change our ways. But that does not mean, that we need allow sanctuary unless we want to. I do not really see the obligation. If we don't let people in that are starving, why let these people in?
 
The Cartels are also big into human trafficking so...hell no.

BTW: These people have been given a list of excuses for entering the US illegally. They're going to say whatever they need to.
 
Neither yes nor no .
We need a new approach here, NOT the old tired conservative failed one ..
Why are so many using drugs ?
Where are they getting all the money from ?
I have never received any good answers , nothing that makes sense.
And, these Central American nations also have their responsibilities, which apparently have been ignored..
 
Now, I am voting "yes" , , a complex yes ..We must also have a ton of change/reform, improvement..NO more meddling ! .. in the affairs of Iraq, Afghanistan , Syria, etc. But, pay attention to home ..and our people .. including those who find it necessary to use drugs..
A yes vote to counter those from the conservative-extremists.. or libertarians
 
joG said:
The US and almost all organized areas around the world have really messed up with drugs. We should not have forbidden them but sold them in a monitored way. We have wasted enormous resources and fed criminal organizations so much moneys that the have grown to the size of states.

We certainly have to change our ways. But that does not mean, that we need allow sanctuary unless we want to. I do not really see the obligation. If we don't let people in that are starving, why let these people in?
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Is it better to leave these people at home to be murdered ? IF we are truly and exceptional nation, then we will accept responsibility .. that is IF ..and do we have the people for this ??
 
earthworm said:
Is it better to leave these people at home to be murdered ? IF we are truly and exceptional nation, then we will accept responsibility .. that is IF ..and do we have the people for this ??
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If you say so, that corresponds to your set of what it means to be "exceptional". But I ask you, is it better to leave the people home to starve to death or to take the risk of the gangs that they have? Do you propose bringing everyone in the world home or just the ones you have pictures of? And are you personally going to pay for them?
 
Smeagol said:
I was watching a report this morning on the influx of illegal immigrants. They interviewed one lady who said the reason she and her children entered America was to escape the danger of living in her own country that is now controlled by drug cartels. It dawned on me, the drug cartels exist because of the American market and demand for illegal drugs. A huge often unspoken cause of the illegal immigration problem is possibly American-made; our demand for illegal drugs that have made their country uninhabitable due to the organized crime culture that now exists in their country. If American vices have inadvertently created a drug cartel controlled war zone in their country, do we have a moral obligation to offer the otherwise law abiding citizens of those affected countries sanctuary as refugees?
Click to expand...
I empathize with them, but no.

It should also be noted that people everywhere have vices, the same vices even. People get high/intoxicated all over the world. It's not just America. The difference being that we have the wherewithal to pay higher prices. Excuse us for having built a better standard of living.
 
radcen said:
I empathize with them, but no.

It should also be noted that people everywhere have vices, the same vices even. People get high/intoxicated all over the world. It's not just America. The difference being that we have the wherewithal to pay higher prices. Excuse us for having built a better standard of living.
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Yes, I agree However, the Latin American cartels aren't supplying Germany with illegal drugs.
 
Our war on drugs gave the cartels the power and wealth they're running from, so yes IMO.
 
earthworm said:
Is it better to leave these people at home to be murdered ? IF we are truly and exceptional nation, then we will accept responsibility .. that is IF ..and do we have the people for this ??
Click to expand...


so I guess in your mind America should take on N. Korea because they deny people their rights, and murder them.
 
We do not owe them anything.

As for the whole "war on drugs" bit making the cartels....you do realize that we do not control the laws in those countries right? Those cartels are murdering people because those countries governments are going after them because those countries made laws against drugs. To blame the US solely because of our personal drug policy is putting the blame in the wrong place.
 
I don't see that the US owes foreign residents asylum for the country of origin's complicity in what amounts to criminal enterprise in either nation. Were it state sanctioned, it might be otherwise.
 
Blame belongs solely with the United States whose ridiculous drug policy begun by Nixon and Reagan has created the World as we now know it.

I often wonder what game posters are playing when they use the word "You"
but hide behind the fact thay they used the "reply" function versus the "reply with quote" .
 
The United States controls the drug laws in all countries in this Hemisphere.
As soon as we legalize, they will legalize .
 
Kal'Stang said:
Really? Prove that we vote for other countries laws.
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Why don't you prove that we don't vote for other countrie's laws, since you finally quoted someone Kal.
I'm getting tired of your lame "no amnesty" response to everything immigration without any solutions, just strawmen.
You don't even know what law was passed last year by the Senate that the House won't look at--you've got work to do to get caught up Sir .
 
These are the same ugly anti-immigration attitudes led by the KKK in the 1920's.
The same KKK that is now firmly entrenched in the Republican party.

The same anti-immigration attitudes against southern Europeans in the late 1800's.
And yes, it was the same discriminating Republican party then also.

Not to mention how these Republicans treate Native Americans in the 2nd half of the 19th Century .
 
NIMBY said:
Blame belongs solely with the United States whose ridiculous drug policy begun by Nixon and Reagan has created the World as we now know it.

I often wonder what game posters are playing when they use the word "You"
but hide behind the fact thay they used the "reply" function versus the "reply with quote" .
Click to expand...


how is this possible, since congress is the one who makes all laws, ..including drug enforcement.

from 1954 to 1994 the democrats controlled the congress, ...except for 6 yrs, the republicans controlled the senate 81 to 86.

those laws you state would have to have been made by democrats.
 
Smeagol said:
I was watching a report this morning on the influx of illegal immigrants. They interviewed one lady who said the reason she and her children entered America was to escape the danger of living in her own country that is now controlled by drug cartels. It dawned on me, the drug cartels exist because of the American market and demand for illegal drugs. A huge often unspoken cause of the illegal immigration problem is possibly American-made; our demand for illegal drugs that have made their country uninhabitable due to the organized crime culture that now exists in their country. If American vices have inadvertently created a drug cartel controlled war zone in their country, do we have a moral obligation to offer the otherwise law abiding citizens of those affected countries sanctuary as refugees?
Click to expand...


Link?
 
NIMBY said:
Why don't you prove that we don't vote for other countrie's laws, since you finally quoted someone Kal.
Click to expand...

Can't prove a negative. Didn't you know that? Besides, you made a claim, it's your responsibility to back up your claim.

NIMBY said:
I'm getting tired of your lame "no amnesty" response to everything immigration without any solutions, just strawmen.
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You obviously have not read all my posts on the subject...or you just ignore them. I've come up with lots of solutions. And guess what? Not one of them mention deportation.

NIMBY said:
You don't even know what law was passed last year by the Senate that the House won't look at--you've got work to do to get caught up Sir .
Click to expand...

Sorry for having a life outside of politics. I don't get newsletters from all those politicians in the Senate/Congress about each and every single bill. :shrug: And by the by...if it hasn't even passed the senate, what good is it?
 
NIMBY said:
These are the same ugly anti-immigration attitudes led by the KKK in the 1920's.
The same KKK that is now firmly entrenched in the Republican party.

The same anti-immigration attitudes against southern Europeans in the late 1800's.
And yes, it was the same discriminating Republican party then also.

Not to mention how these Republicans treate Native Americans in the 2nd half of the 19th Century .
Click to expand...

Hyperbole much? Most people that are against illegal aliens have absolutely no problem with LEGAL immigration.

And by the way...nice godwin!
 
Kal'Stang said:
Hyperbole much?
Click to expand...
NO...
Most people that are against illegal aliens have absolutely no problem with LEGAL immigration.
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Complete and total strawman.

And by the way...nice godwin!
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B.I.L.--
Godwin would be like noting a person lives in the middle of the Aryan Nation as you do and saying you're just like them on Amnesty .
 
Kal'Stang said:
Sorry for having a life outside of politics.
Click to expand...
Drama queen much!
I don't get newsletters from all those politicians in the Senate/Congress about each and every single bill.
Click to expand...
Yet you continue to be obtuse on the existence of a Senate bill on immigration passed last year.
Why is that Kal?
And by the by...if it hasn't even passed the senate, what good is it?
Click to expand...
Yet it has passed the Senate and you're saying it hasn't while admitting you don't know anything about it.
We call that lying where I come from .
 
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