Your Opinion on this Video Clip

RiverDad said:

And yet, I see, you list yourself as a Progressive. Have you thought about it?

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What does being a Progressive have to do with it? I'm also pro gun, so think again...

TheLastIndependent said:

The truth is our government doesn't give a **** and especially not about human rights or some fabled democracy

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You think we have people at the helm who are smart enough to not care about human rights and exporting democracy? No, there is a vast industry of enablers pushing the HR and Democracy missions, backed up by a cabal of intellectuals who've been hatched from an incestuous intellectual environment which buys into this bilge. Sure, sure, they believe a better connected world will increase corporate profits and such, but those are downstream effects - these guys really believe that they're missionaries out there in the deep dark jungles bringing enlightenment to the savages, while conveniently lining their own pockets as contractors doing the "leftist lord's work."

Juanita said:

What does being a Progressive have to do with it? I'm also pro gun, so think again...

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To which agent do you look to to solve society's problems?

RiverDad said:

You think we have people at the helm who are smart enough to not care about human rights and exporting democracy? No, there is a vast industry of enablers pushing the HR and Democracy missions, backed up by a cabal of intellectuals who've been hatched from an incestuous intellectual environment which buys into this bilge. Sure, sure, they believe a better connected world will increase corporate profits and such, but those are downstream effects - these guys really believe that they're missionaries out there in the deep dark jungles bringing enlightenment to the savages, while conveniently lining their own pockets as contractors doing the "leftist lord's work."

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Not even speaking on the times we actually get close to bringing some form of democracy. Most of the democracy missions end with the US putting up puppet dictators who magically win outstanding numbers of votes. As for human rights... that's not even defensible factually speaking.

RiverDad said:

To which agent do you look to to solve society's problems?

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Juanita said:

What does being a Progressive have to do with it? I'm also pro gun, so think again...

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RiverDad said:

And yet, I see, you list yourself as a Progressive. Have you thought about it?

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Juanita said:

I think that Carlin was talking about so much more than just achieving success in life.... Government at all levels and corporations get whatever they want by any means necessary... Corruption at every plateau.....If they want your house for a parking lot, they get it and you get the boot....Licenses, inspections, permits--all in the hands of the government.. Just don't piss them off.... They are part of every facet of your life...They know everything about you... They have control.... There has always been corruption in government, but the last 50 years Big Brother has taken over.....Think about it....

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Perhaps your idea of progressivism takes the classical definition and not the socialist hijacked one used in politics today?

TheLastIndependent said:

Not even speaking on the times we actually get close to bringing some form of democracy. Most of the democracy missions end with the US putting up puppet dictators who magically win outstanding numbers of votes. As for human rights... that's not even defensible factually speaking.

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You seem to be looking for successful outcomes, I'm pointing to legions of fanatical true believers out there pushing this stuff like heroin. They're not going to stop just because they don't meet with success.

RiverDad said:

You seem to be looking for successful outcomes, I'm pointing to legions of fanatical true believers out there pushing this stuff like heroin. They're not going to stop just because they don't meet with success.

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Do you think that they actually believe in it?

That's an honest question with no point. I got one think they know full well they are not being productive and are being willful slave to the state and whoever is paying them

TheLastIndependent said:

Do you think that they actually believe in it?

That's an honest question with no point. I got one think they know full well they are not being productive and are being willful slave to the state and whoever is paying them

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I absolutely think that they believe it. Maybe not so much anymore, but back during the run-up to Iraq, I have no doubt that the top movers and shakers thought that they could really bring democracy and human rights to both Iraq and Afghanistan. They were smart enough to know that Afghanistan would be a more difficult challenge, but with Iraq they were harping about how modern it was and how it would be a easy job of making Iraq a bastion of Democracy in the Middle East from which a democratic wave would spread and engulf the entire region. They were orgasmic about the prospect. I know that region of the world and its cultures. I knew our guys were naive beyond hope.

RiverDad said:

I absolutely think that they believe it. Maybe not so much anymore, but back during the run-up to Iraq, I have no doubt that the top movers and shakers thought that they could really bring democracy and human rights to both Iraq and Afghanistan. They were smart enough to know that Afghanistan would be a more difficult challenge, but with Iraq they were harping about how modern it was and how it would be a easy job of making Iraq a bastion of Democracy in the Middle East from which a democratic wave would spread and engulf the entire region. They were orgasmic about the prospect. I know that region of the world and its cultures. I knew our guys were naive beyond hope.

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Fair enough. On humans rights though, we were in many cases the bearer of violation. We funded and supplied much of Saddam Hussein's violations and then continued more post invasion.

And I agree on the naivety of anybody who honestly thought we could bring a western idea to the middle east. Five minutes of reading on the culture and history of the middle east will die that they have and will continue to reject the west which they are not at all wrong for doing. The west has greatly screwed the middle east more than once

Most people suck at critical thinking. Carlin was a genius.

Juanita said:

I think that Carlin was talking about so much more than just achieving success in life.... Government at all levels and corporations get whatever they want by any means necessary... Corruption at every plateau.....If they want your house for a parking lot, they get it and you get the boot....Licenses, inspections, permits--all in the hands of the government.. Just don't piss them off.... They are part of every facet of your life...They know everything about you... They have control.... There has always been corruption in government, but the last 50 years Big Brother has taken over.....Think about it....

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This "big brother" has only taken over because we have allowed it to.

Once upon a time a rag tag group of colonists that were severely outnumbered fought and beat the most powerful nation in the world.

Think about this. If instead of worrying about boogeyman in the shadow government we as people United, they couldn't take our houses.

They have convinced you they are more powerful than you.

Look up Martin Niemöller

He said that when they [Nazis] came for the socialists he did not speak up because he wasn't a socialist, on and on and on until they came for him and nobody came to speak for him because nobody was left.

Think about it this way, take Houston, [school districts are notorious for this in Houston] a school district wants a block with fifty houses on it and goes to confirm them. If a hundredth of our city shows up to that block and stands there (keep in mind Houston is 6.5mil pop so that would be 65000 people and hpd only has 5000 officers) and says over our dead bodies. They lose.



In this picture one man stood against abattalion of tanks. Chinese government once killed infants for being born female

And one man unarmed stopped a battalion of tanks.

If one man can do this in China, a country that has no rights, imagine what a thousand, a hundred thousand people can do in our nation.

So taking Carlin's message to heart robbs you of your power, it makes a government powerful.

In this country it is a republic, the people are the government. Big brother does whatever the hell we tell him to.

Don't be so easily convinced to give up.

When I see that one man standing up against that tank in Tianjin square, I tear up, he could have been a father, a school teacher, or if it were to occur to day a debate politics poster.

If there is no cause that you would fight to the death for, you have nothing to live for.

I pity those that just give up and say the government. is to powerful.

There were black women men and children at one time that were slaves in our country. They had nothing, they weren't even people to the slave owners they were beaten into slavery by a much more powerful force. Yet some of those brave men women and children bled out their life blood in a fight to the death literally during slave rebellions they weren't always successful rebellions, many people were slaughtered. This was in the 1800s up until the mid 20th century they were still slaughtering babies some father's beloved son and they didn't give up. They fought and died lost fathers, mothers daughters and sons kicking against a massive wall. When the ground was drenched in blood they raged forward just for the possibility of something better. The price they payed was massive and the loss was greater than anything seem today. But they triumphed. They pushed back and the aggressors fell down.

So don't tell me some limp wristed government lack can take my house. I will fight to the death over it.

If folks would put aside their petty differences and unite the government. would obey us. It's assclowns like Carlin that have told you that wouldn't work. I didn't have as much animosity toward that dirt bag before this as I do now. That piece of human **** was taking money from abunch of hopeless losers affirming their hopelessness while picketing millions and laughing at them

After this **** George Carlin, that piece of ****.

TheLastIndependent said:

The west has greatly screwed the middle east more than once

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The problems of the ME are problems mostly of their own making, problems stemming from culture and religion. Western dealings are small potatoes.

Some food for thought:

1950 GDP/cap (UNStat est. 2005)

Jordan = $960
Taiwan = $901
Iran = $888
South Korea = $881
Iraq = $567
Syria = $487
Vietnam = $126


2014 GDP/cap (UNStat est. 2005)

Jordan = $2,998
Taiwan = $19,419
Iran = $3,321
South Korea = $23,965
Iraq = $1,449
Syria = $1,888
Vietnam = $1,032

I take it back, it wasn't one Damn bit funny, it was sad.

How defeated the once proud American people that have their lives for what they believed in, can fall for this.


I see ten people that believe this crap inn some way or another and only two that don't.

I know I am one. So one other person. I think I know exactly what is wrong with our country.

This world is moving toward despair I wondered why I was so saddened to see depressed children as young as 6 years old taking drugs. It is because their dreams and hopes are crushed before they could even dream them or hope for them. How sad.

Meanwhile prophets of doom are taking your money to affirm hopelessness. And hopeless among us can't give it away fast enough. All to alleviate their pain of the blackened world they live in.

People like Carlin have convinced you there is no hope. There are others. And it serves the nastiest purpose of all. People with no hope are easy to control. And whoever has control has the power.

A world that becomes obedient by it's own choice is truly a sad one.

I can't swim in sea of hopelessness. So I won't join those that choose to drown.

RiverDad said:

The problems of the ME are problems mostly of their own making, problems stemming from culture and religion. Western dealings are small potatoes.

Some food for thought:

1950 GDP/cap (UNStat est. 2005)

Jordan = $960
Taiwan = $901
Iran = $888
South Korea = $881
Iraq = $567
Syria = $487
Vietnam = $126


2014 GDP/cap (UNStat est. 2005)

Jordan = $2,998
Taiwan = $19,419
Iran = $3,321
South Korea = $23,965
Iraq = $1,449
Syria = $1,888
Vietnam = $1,032

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I completely agree that the culture of the middle east plays a great part in the way they are. However, it ignores modern history to exclude western interaction with the middle east. Many of the leaders and movements of modern middle east have seemed directly from anti-western thoughts and ideas

TheLastIndependent said:

I completely agree that the culture of the middle east plays a great part in the way they are. However, it ignores modern history to exclude western interaction with the middle east. Many of the leaders and movements of modern middle east have seemed directly from anti-western thoughts and ideas

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What happened to South Korea, Vietnam and Taiwan since 1950? All smooth sailing for them?

RiverDad said:

What happened to South Korea, Vietnam and Taiwan since 1950? All smooth sailing for them?

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For the most part no. Similar to much of the world, their economies were rather stagnant until the early 90's where they grew with much of the world. I would say much of the economic growth would be due to them being open to the idea of globalization whereas the middle east prefers to remain isolated outside of oil business. Likewise, much of the economies of the middle east are internally and-sustaining. Thus, they have no motive to build wealth outside of the oil industry

VanceMack said:

:lamo

"We aint in that club..."

George Carlin was earning 2.5 million a year at the time of his death. George was no different than the Hollywood elitist assclowns that line up at the multimillion dollar award shows, receiving free swag bags worth hundreds of thousands of dollars each who then go on speaking evil of bankers and talking about just how much they really really really really really care about the plight of the common folk.

No...no one is going to gift you a golden pathway to wealth and success. At the same time...they arent impeding you from success either.

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I wish you would have answered the poll and shared your opinion of whether or not our politicians are bought, rather than go on your own rant about the Hollywood types and how you see as them big hypocrites. So let me ask you this... Do you think it's impossible for the Hollywood elites to have empathy? Do you think if someone is rich, they should be void of opinion and social causes? And more directly, do you think George Carlin, having been a successful American dreamer, is just bull****ting in the rant that I posted?

I think that the degree to which the "rant" is right or wrong depends on how much interaction and influence there is between: politics, economics, education, culture, media, military, etc. The comedian holds a polar position that the influence is high and goes from economics (i.e., "corporates") downwards to politics, military, education, culture, media, etc. Other people may hold a polar attitude against that.

I for one do not believe that corporates rule the world. They have money and can use it to influence. But the risks are always there and they should initially secure that they may not be charged for corruption with that.

DDD said:

I for one do not believe that corporates rule the world. They have money and can use it to influence. But the risks are always there and they should initially secure that they may not be charged for corruption with that.

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Can you elaborate on this? Do you have any real world examples?

Middleground said:

I wish you would have answered the poll and shared your opinion of whether or not our politicians are bought, rather than go on your own rant about the Hollywood types and how you see as them big hypocrites. So let me ask you this... Do you think it's impossible for the Hollywood elites to have empathy? Do you think if someone is rich, they should be void of opinion and social causes? And more directly, do you think George Carlin, having been a successful American dreamer, is just bull****ting in the rant that I posted?

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I think it is easy for ANYONE to feign empathy. I quite honestly believe most of them couldnt give half a **** about others even you gave them two spare ****s you happened to have lying around in a closet somewhere. There actions speak far more clearly than their words.

Are politicians bought and sold? OF COURSE! Thats some new revelation? Hell...we have video of Barney Frank going down and talking the OWS protestors and verbalizing his support and then IMMEDIATELY leaving to go to a fund raiser with bankers and brokers. People spend millions to win a job that pays thousands. There is no secret about parties beholden to special interest. Thats why its so ludicrous that people from both sides spend so much of their time expressing angst against those that dare to leave the 2 party system.

On Carlin...I LOVE George Carlin's material...but was he a self serving hypocrite? OF COURSE he was. Does it ring hollow that a guy makes 2.5 million a year mostly from ticket, book, and recording sales, delivers a message of woe and oppression to the downtrodden masses? Well...hell yes.

RiverDad said:

Who is the They that Carlin keeps referring to? Was Steve Jobs a They? What happened when Steve Jobs went against David Geffen? Both guys can't get what they want. Was Jobs a They when he began his life? Was Bill Gates a They when he was born? I thought They only wanted bookkeepers who were smart enough to do the job and no one smarter. Why didn't They stop Gates and Jobs from making so much money?

How is it possible that They can coordinate all of their interests so that only They benefit? If the They who own solar companies benefit then that hurts the They who own coal powered power plants.

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Its like a game of global Monopoly.

The only difference is that those who are never going to win can't just quit and go do something else.

We have to keep going around and around the board under penalty of homelessness or death.

What if...? said:

Its like a game of global Monopoly.

The only difference is that those who are never going to win can't just quit and go do something else.

We have to keep going around and around the board under penalty of homelessness or death.

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What exactly do you see as the 'alternative'? Seriously...what is it people are looking for? Yes...you play the game and if you do it with hard work and forethought, the game becomes pretty easy. There are people that started with less than zero (through no fault of the 'system' or 'da man') and have managed to build comfortable happy lives. They won properties, businesses, boats, they go on vacations...they dont just exist, they do WELL. That opportunity exists as much today as it ever has. Hell it might be even easier today since there is so much available startup wealth. Multi gazillionaires like Gates and Jobs werent gifted successful corporations...they built them with hard work and innovation.Nothing has changed.

Middleground said:

Can you elaborate on this? Do you have any real world examples?

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Theoretically I was getting at clashes between powers while they influence. A corporate may bribe (positive power) a political leader but the leader can technically turn the offer down as well as counter the bribe with corruption laws (negative power). The process of bribing as well as influence is not automatic nor guaranteed. There are risks there involved also.

Middleground said:

Please watch this video and give me your opinion on this George Carlin rant. Please do not vote without watching the full 3 minutes.

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One of my favorite writers is a woman named Lois McMaster Bujold. In her short story "Borders of Infinity", there is this quote:

Now, there's this about cynicism, Sergeant. It's the universe's most supine moral position. Real comfortable. If nothing can be done, then you're not some kind of **** for not doing it, and you can lie there and stink to yourself in perfect peace.

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That is what Carlin's rant made me think of. It is their fault, and you can't do anything about it. And as usual when something like that is said, it is complete bull****. Do businesses lobby for beneficial laws? of course they do, it is their job, and it benefits to an extent any one who owns stock in that company, which is basically any one with a 401K, among others. In fact, those companies have an obligation to their stockholders, which includes most Americans, to do just that. That is how capitalism works, and it is still the best economic system around. We have a responsibility to elect those people who have the ability to discern when those laws the businesses are advocating for are best for America, and when they are not, and the willingness to stand up for what is best. If we elect those who don't, it is our own fault.

Pointing fingers gets us nowhere. Cynicism is an admission of defeat. To throw in one more quote, from Lindsey Graham, who I am not much of a fan of, but I thought so much of this statement it was in my sig for a long time:

But we became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers.

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It is time to become a great nation again.

VanceMack said:

:lamo

"We aint in that club..."

George Carlin was earning 2.5 million a year at the time of his death. George was no different than the Hollywood elitist assclowns that line up at the multimillion dollar award shows, receiving free swag bags worth hundreds of thousands of dollars each who then go on speaking evil of bankers and talking about just how much they really really really really really care about the plight of the common folk.

No...no one is going to gift you a golden pathway to wealth and success. At the same time...they arent impeding you from success either.

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Reminds me of Lennon writing Imagine no possessions from his NYC penthouse suite.