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U.S. - Russia, who wins?

Will the Ukraine lead to further Regional Conflicts?


  • Total voters
    47
Russia seems to have Crimea, locked up, as a part of their country
.

How far will the US and EU pursue this issue, after the Crimea province and Ukraine leadership is settled and stable?

Is this about energy only, or are we really concerned about the people?




Makes a lot of sense, most of the people in Crimea are Russians.




"If you give a man a fish, he eats for a day.

If you teach a man how to fish, he wastes all of his time fishing and you can take care of his woman."
 
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So just let Russia walk all over us? The Kremlin is making a land/power grab and Obama is sitting around like a flaccid wet noodle. What an absolute sissy.

Nobody said anything about us going to war, but we need to assist the Ukrainians.




If you want to assist the Ukrainians, get on over there and assist them, but don't try to drag the USA into a mess that doesn't concern it.
 
This may all be true to some degree but the main reason they're struggling for control over the Ukraine is gas and border security. Russia needs the money and backed Assad in Syria to block the southern gas line from Qatar from coming thru. The more old provinces Russia loses dominance over, the less resources they have for financial returns and global influence.





Russia definitely wants Crimea because of its peoples alliance and naval bases, but they didn't support Yakanovich just to annex Crimea. Currently, about two-thirds of Russia’s gas exports to Europe travel through Ukraine. Though, I think they could settle for Crimea and build alternative pipelines to the EU, gaining the offshore deposits.

The Ukrainians will definitely not want to loose that province, but I'm not sure Russia will allow much of a resistance. That's why the poll, and wondering how far will the West resist Putin's advances?

True, I agree that there is significant gas and oil concerns in this. However, this just proves even more how much of a rash overreaction he has made. For the foreseeable future, his gas still needs to flow through Ukraine to Europe. The only difference now is that he has turned the Ukrainian government against him to a point where I don't see how they can reestablish good relations in the near future, and the EU will start to phase out their dependence on Russian oil if possible. When it comes to to Crimea. He will have to pour in money in the billions to create infrastructure, pay for pensions, route utilities, and like you said, establish an oil route through it if that is one of their end goals. He would have still had his black sea fleet HQ there, the only difference now is that he has to figure out how to get the Ukrainian military out, which I think will get messy. He can only hope the Tartars remain passive in all of this too. Lastly, he now has to deal with cool relations with the West and a few of his nationalist buddies will have sanctions placed on them.

In other words, had he not overreacted then he would have retained everything and lost nothing.
 
That may lead to war. If the US is arming/training/aiding the Ukrainians in large enough numbers to fight off Russian invasion that's a lot of aide. The Ukraine is plains not rocky mountainous terrain with sparsely populated countrysides.

We did it in Afghanistan. The afghans then kicked the russian's butts. The difference is that Reagan had a set, Obama is afraid of the Russians.
 
We did it in Afghanistan. The afghans then kicked the russian's butts.
The difference is that Reagan had a set,
Obama is afraid of the Russians.




Reagan also had Alzheimers.

Maybe the GOP should dig him up, zombify him and run him in 2016.
 
Sen. Murphy from Connecticut gave a good interview with C. Hayes, but not a great one.
For him to say this is not another cold war is foolish.
This is absolutely a Cold War 2.0 and a new arms race will ensue.
As for Sen. McCain, a rewording of today's slams on Obama and hawkish remarks would be nice .
 
Which suggests is happening. If Russia wanted a clean vote, it would extract its troops, return to pre-occupation levels at its base and let them vote on their own.

Instead, he's massing forces on Eastern Ukraine's border, moving armor near the ferry station across from Kretch and running daily reinforcement drops into Crimea.

Is a contract where you sign over all your assets to me legitimate if I put a gun to your head and tell you to sign or die?

Out of curiosity, was the vote by secret ballot, or was a soldier standing next to each voter watching him/her cast their vote? If it was a secret ballot, then why would anyone be intimidated as no one would know what the person voted. If it wasn't, then, of course, the result cannot be taken seriously.
 




Correct.

Anyone who thinks, (Wishes, hopes, dreams.), that the GOP will control the White House for any period of time, anytime soon is living in a dream world.





"Better days are coming." ~ But not for today's out of touch, running out of time. GOP.
 
Correct.

Anyone who thinks, (Wishes, hopes, dreams.), that the GOP will control the White House for any period of time, anytime soon is living in a dream world.




"Better days are coming." ~ But not for today's out of touch, running out of time. GOP.

I'm not the least bit interested in your amateur political predictions. You have anything you'd like to debate regarding Russia and the current crisis, or should we wrap this little exchange?
 
I'm not the least bit interested in your amateur political predictions.
You have anything you'd like to debate regarding Russia and the current crisis, or should we wrap this little exchange?




If you don't like what has happened in the Ukraine, You need to get over there and change it.

I predict that the Ukraine will not control Crimea anytime soon.

Don't take my word for this, just wait and see.
 
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If you don't like what has happened in the Ukraine, You need to get over there and change it.

Case closed.

What a gas. You apparently don't understand the purpose of a political debate forum, friend. That's where we discuss things like foreign policy and geopolitics.
 
What a gas.
You apparently don't understand the purpose of a political debate forum, friend.
That's where we discuss things like foreign policy and geopolitics.




#1- I'm not your friend, I don't even know you.

#2- if you don't like what has happened in the Ukraine you're going to be unhappy for a long time.
 
#1- I'm not your friend, I don't even know you.

#2- if you don't like what has happened in the Ukraine you're going to be unhappy for a long time.

Aww come on buddy ole pal. Don't be mad.

There's nothing to get worked up about. We're here discussing politics because, supposedly, that's fun. In this case, I think Obama is doing a terrible job and he needs to grow a set and deal with the Russians from a position if strength, rather than a bent over position with his cheeks spread wide. I take it you disagree?
 
Aww come on buddy ole pal. Don't be mad.

There's nothing to get worked up about. We're here discussing politics because, supposedly, that's fun. In this case, I think Obama is doing a terrible job and he needs to grow a set and deal with the Russians from a position if strength, rather than a bent over position with his cheeks spread wide.
I take it you disagree?




You are so full of it that it's coming out of your nose.

Use your handkerchief.
 
You are so full of it that it's coming out of your nose.

Come on shrub nose, don't be rude. Nothing is coming out of my nose except air every couple of seconds. But I hardly see what that has to do with the Ukrainian crisis...
 
Russia seems to have Crimea, locked up, as a part of their country.

How far will the US and EU pursue this issue, after the Crimea province and Ukraine leadership is settled and stable?

Is this about energy only, or are we really concerned about the people?

Sounds like McCain, and/or some of his pay masters are losing a pretty penny over this...

Damn shame too. Imagine, going through all that trouble to over throw a government and set up a puppet regime and Putin goes and pulls this?!?!?!?

The gall, the nerve, the, the, ........the, balls on some people...


Follow the timeline...
 
It depends on what you count as winning.

Watching this unfold and the lack of action by the USA and NATO, plus other events around the world, it seems clear this was a done deal ahead of time.

Stalin did not totally eradicate Muslims in Crimea. Mostly, but not entirely. And Crimea has huge resources that the Ukraine is dependent upon for true independent status.

The USA has its interest containment campaigns of Muslims in Afghanistan and Iraq - although we cut a deal with China over Iraqi oil. We still have Kuwait's oil.

Muslim radicalism is a common concern of the USA, Western Europe and Russia. Russia now has it's foot on the throat of not only Crimean Muslims, but also now on Ukraine itself and the Muslims there - plus all of Crimea's resources (preventing Ukraine from having it thus perpetually subservient to Russia.)

We have the resources of Afghanistan and somewhat our foot on the throats of Muslims in that region.

We have a pretty good hold on Kazakhstan, the huge resources rich country on Russia's Southern border and we've paid of their leadership pretty well, but Russia probably wants more of a cut there and probably more involvement to insure the Muslims there are under control.

With worldwide Muslim/Islamic faith population predicted to soon reach 1/4th of the entire world's population and significantly outnumbering white people, grabbing as much resources in Muslim countries and a stranglehold on Muslim governments is the common goal of the USA, Western Europe and Russia.

All the worlds about Crimea are all just diversions, with it understood next month no one will care any since the attention span of the public/mob is about the same as that of a fruit fly.
 
Sounds like McCain, and/or some of his pay masters are losing a pretty penny over this...

Damn shame too. Imagine, going through all that trouble to over throw a government and set up a puppet regime and Putin goes and pulls this?!?!?!?

The gall, the nerve, the, the, ........the, balls on some people...


Follow the timeline...

Everything is going exactly according to plan. Between the USA and Russia the Muslim population of the Ukraine is now entirely under control.

White people still control the world and aren't planning on giving that up. Not to a bunch of dirty poor Muslims anyway. Deals can be cut with Asians giving them their cut of the Muslim world, like giving China Iraq's oil. The USA gets Afghanistan's oil, plus we get Kuwait's oil - a country we carved out of nothing. Russia gets the resources of Crimea and a permanent stranglehold on Ukraine.

What's not to like if you are Western and white about this? White people once again prove they rule the world!
 
#1- I'm not your friend, I don't even know you.

#2- if you don't like what has happened in the Ukraine you're going to be unhappy for a long time.

You explained prior your view that people should each be to their own ethnicity.

Yes, you white people will continue to rule all but Asian for some time to come and will continue to keep your foot on the throats of Muslims. You seem old, so you probably won't live to see the payback when it comes and it will likely be nuclear. Nuclear proliferation throughout the Muslim world is a predictable future now. They really have no option but to do so.
 
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