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Your opinion on Coke's version of America The Beautiful? [W:1014]

Do You like this version of "America The Beautiful?"

  • Total voters
    104
Arcana XV said:
I haven't heard anything about changing green card laws. The only thing I've heard is that they want to simplify the path to citizenship, not residency.
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Marco Rubio suggested making it a provision that immigrants must speak at least some English before being able to work in the country, and I agree. That would be the smart idea.
 
ChrisL said:
Well since you seem to be such an expert . . . is there a limit on the number of green cards issued? If so, how many? If a person can just keep renewing their green card, what is the point of even having a citizenship test? I didn't see in your link mentioned anywhere about special provisions, or do they just give them to anyone who wants one?
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I'm no expert LOL. I don't know how many green cards are given every year and I also don't know how the selection process goes. I do know it's costly and there is a HUGE waiting list which is one of the reasons people give up and just jump the fence.
 
Dr. Chuckles said:
right, we just don't give anyone a green card. But that isn't the same as having a requirement for being proficient in English
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I never said any immigrants had to be proficient. As a matter of fact I have repeated stated that they should have a COMPULSORY understanding of written and spoken English. Now, you say we don't just give them to anyone, so what are the requirements?

Well, they have been posted here multiple times, by you and in posts you responded to ....
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No, specific qualifications are not mentioned. It just mentions the reasons WHY you could apply for a green card, employment, family and asylum.


work visa=/=green card
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I've never had to use a visa or a green card, so I know a minimal amount about them. Do you have to be vaccinated first, do you have to have a medical examination, are there any requirements at all? If so what are they?
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Arcana XV said:
I think there is a medical exam, yes. And no they don't just give them to anyone. Even the yearly green card lottery is not really a lottery at all and there's definitely some deliberate selection going on.
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Well, do they normally select non-English speakers? Or do they have preferences on the types of people and perhaps their education level and such other things before issuing them a card? And what about criminal background checks?
 
ChrisL said:
Marco Rubio suggested making it a provision that immigrants must speak at least some English before being able to work in the country, and I agree. That would be the smart idea.
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One (of many) problems I have with Marco Rubio is his folks didn't need a pathway nor was there any requirement for citizenship past one dry foot. They were not required to speak English. being cuban all they needed to do was get to dry land.

I'm curious what Rubio considers 'some' English. I'll wager a shiny TP button 99.9% of all immigrants speak 'some' English.
 
ChrisL said:
Well, do they normally select non-English speakers? Or do they have preferences on the types of people and perhaps their education level and such other things before issuing them a card? And what about criminal background checks?
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Like I said my friends in Spain didn't know much English and they corresponded with the US gov in Spanish. The guy is a banker and was offered a job in NY. There were background checks, yes. This other couple I knew back in Zurich actually won the green card lottery for them and their two kids. Again, he was a banker, spoke decent English. She was a homemaker, atrocious English. He was Swiss and she was Russian. They spent a year in the US and decided to go back to Switzerland.
 
notquiteright said:
One (of many) problems I have with Marco Rubio is his folks didn't need a pathway nor was there any requirement for citizenship past one dry foot. They were not required to speak English. being cuban all they needed to do was get to dry land.

I'm curious what Rubio considers 'some' English. I'll wager a shiny TP button 99.9% of all immigrants speak 'some' English.
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actually refugee status is treated differently in a number of ways to general immigration, and I really fail to see why such a distinction shouldn't be made. Secondly, I fail to see why the conditions Rubio's parents came over under should disqualify an idea that seems to pass the smell test on it's own merits.
 
Arcana XV said:
Like I said my friends in Spain didn't know much English and they corresponded with the US gov in Spanish. The guy is a banker and was offered a job in NY. There were background checks, yes. This other couple I knew back in Zurich actually won the green card lottery for them and their two kids. Again, he was a banker, spoke decent English. She was a homemaker, atrocious English. He was Swiss and she was Russian. They spent a year in the US and decided to go back to Switzerland.
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Was she a swiss citizen at the time? Seems like Russians immigrate in enough numbers already that they wouldn't qualify for the lottery.
 
Arcana XV said:
Like I said my friends in Spain didn't know much English and they corresponded with the US gov in Spanish. The guy is a banker and was offered a job in NY. There were background checks, yes. This other couple I knew back in Zurich actually won the green card lottery for them and their two kids. Again, he was a banker, spoke decent English. She was a homemaker, atrocious English. He was Swiss and she was Russian. They spent a year in the US and decided to go back to Switzerland.
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How can he work as a banker in the US without knowing English? How would he communicate with his customers?
 
ChrisL said:
How can he work as a banker in the US without knowing English? How would he communicate with his customers?
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Private banker. Most of his customers are Latin American. His fluent Spanish and Portuguese came in very handy. There are a lot of private bankers here in Switzerland who don't speak any of the local languages. My ex was one of them. :shrug:
 
Arcana XV said:
Private banker. Most of his customers are Latin American. His fluent Spanish and Portuguese came in very handy. There are a lot of private bankers here in Switzerland who don't speak any of the local languages. My ex was one of them. :shrug:
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How does he get along in the United States without being able to speak English? What about when he orders things at a restaurant. What about when the cashier rings him up and tells him how much? How does he know people aren't ripping him off or taking advantage of him?
 
Dr. Chuckles said:
actually refugee status is treated differently in a number of ways to general immigration, and I really fail to see why such a distinction shouldn't be made. Secondly, I fail to see why the conditions Rubio's parents came over under should disqualify an idea that seems to pass the smell test on it's own merits.
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Then again one could make the argument 'fleeing' cuba isn't even close to a true refugee and more like any other immigrant to this country... looking for a brighter future than can be found in the 'mother' country.

As far as his idea goes, it doesn't pass the practical test as like I said what does 'some English' mean? A meaningless and standardless phrase designed to get those who don't stop and think about for a new york minute to nod along....:peace
 
ChrisL said:
How does he get along in the United States without being able to speak English? What about when he orders things at a restaurant. What about when the cashier rings him up and tells him how much? How does he know people aren't ripping him off or taking advantage of him?
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Same way my ex got along in Switzerland before he started learning some German and then some French, I guess. How should I know. Haven't seen the guy since he moved to NYC.
 
notquiteright said:
Then again one could make the argument 'fleeing' cuba isn't even close to a true refugee and more like any other immigrant to this country... looking for a brighter future than can be found in the 'mother' country.
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Yes, if Cuba didn't have a long legacy of political prisoners and persecution, one could make that argument. But seeing as how Cuba has a long established association with such things it isn't really an argument worth making


As far as his idea goes, it doesn't pass the practical test as like I said what does 'some English' mean?
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Wait, so your rejection is based on the fact that you are unaware, or he hasn't proposed, a specific definition of what he means by "some English"? All that take to address is defining what "some english means" and isn't a real burden to any such policy proposal.

A meaningless and standardless phrase designed to get those who don't stop and think about for a new york minute to nod along....:peace
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lol, you can't be serious?
 
sangha said:
The non-hispanic portion of the US population is not the topic. But it's very revealing that your concern is focused so intently on white people becoming a minority
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No, the primary concern here is the failure of many Latino immigrants to assimilate into American society.

That problem is only going to get worse as the native US population continues to decline in relation to the immigrant population.


They are culturally american and they do assimilate.
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If they do not speak our language, obey our laws, adopt the fundamental aspects of our culture, or value their American identity over the national identity they possessed before immigration, they are NOT "American." They are foreigners.

It is as simple as that.
 
Dr. Chuckles said:
Yes, if Cuba didn't have a long legacy of political prisoners and persecution, one could make that argument. But seeing as how Cuba has a long established association with such things it isn't really an argument worth making. Wait, so your rejection is based on the fact that you are unaware, or he hasn't proposed, a specific definition of what he means by "some English"? All that take to address is defining what "some english means" and isn't a real burden to any such policy proposal. lol, you can't be serious?
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Ahhh yes, the long established persecution of political prisoners in Cuba. EVERYONE who flees Cuba comes here claims that, everyone imprisoned claims it was political and not economic. Our country, in it's rather bizarre treatment of Cuba, how many times have we tried to kill Fidel?, seems intent on leaving logic at the wayside when it comes to Cuba as many immigrants from other 'long established persecution' countries are routinely denied entrance.

Seems to me Rubio has had more than enough time to define a 'some English' standard, he has no real interest in doing such because the line was just to feed the koolaid sippers.
 
notquiteright said:
Ahhh yes, the long established persecution of political prisoners in Cuba. EVERYONE who flees Cuba comes here claims that, everyone imprisoned claims it was political and not economic. Our country, in it's rather bizarre treatment of Cuba, how many times have we tried to kill Fidel?, seems intent on leaving logic at the wayside when it comes to Cuba as many immigrants from other 'long established persecution' countries are routinely denied entrance.
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do the realities of foreign affairs and political interests confuse you?

Seems to me Rubio has had more than enough time to define a 'some English' standard, he has no real interest in doing such because the line was just to feed the koolaid sippers.
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It may be a policy he has no real interest in persuing, but such would not 1) make it a bad idea and 2) make defining "some english" onerous.
 
I am for citizenship for illegal aliens.
I am for equal rights for all.
I believe every human being to be of equal value.
I view the USA as a nation of immigrants.
I view this land as stolen from the American Indian.

With all of that being said... In the USA we speak English. If you do not agree with that then you are a tourist. Nothing more.
 
Painter said:
I am for citizenship for illegal aliens.
I am for equal rights for all.
I believe every human being to be of equal value.
I view the USA as a nation of immigrants.
I view this land as stolen from the American Indian.

With all of that being said... In the USA we speak English. If you do not agree with that then you are a tourist. Nothing more.
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Well, I guess the thread is done then, right? :roll:
 
Painter said:
I am for citizenship for illegal aliens.
I am for equal rights for all.
I believe every human being to be of equal value.
I view the USA as a nation of immigrants.
I view this land as stolen from the American Indian.

With all of that being said... In the USA we speak English. If you do not agree with that then you are a tourist. Nothing more.
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So much for that pesky first amendment then right? :roll::roll:
 
Dragonfly said:
So much for that pesky first amendment then right? :roll::roll:
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I'm not sure the intent of the first amendment was to maintain itself as a bulwark against establishing an official language, and it would seem clear the utilitarian aspects of it would far out way any real concerns about free speech, which are rather stretching the concepts to it's limits to begin with.
 
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