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Do you believe brain death is death?

Do you accept a patient pronounced "brain dead" as dead (legally and otherwise)


  • Total voters
    62
  • Poll closed .
This is true, but you have added to the definition of brain dead. All of that can still be true and the patient turns out to not actually be brain dead.

Brain dead==>no breathing==> no oxygen==> no heart beat==> over and out
 
Brain dead==>no breathing==> no oxygen==> no heart beat==> over and out

If they are actually brain dead, yes. The question asks about people who are "pronounced" brain dead, not about people who "are" brain dead.
 
Look at some of the politician we have, of course you can be brain dead and still earn a living! And don't get me started on lawyers.

Q: Doctor, before you performed the autopsy, did you check for a pulse?
A: No.
Q: Did you check for blood pressure?
A: No.
Q: Did you check for breathing?
A: No.
Q: So it was possible that the patient was alive when you began the autopsy?
A: No.
Q: How can you be so sure, Doctor?
A: Because his brains was sitting on my desk in a jar.
Q: But could the patient have still been alive nevertheless?
A: It is possible that he could have been alive and practicing law somewhere.
 
A patient on a mechanical ventilator has a beating heart, but has been proclaimed "brain death" according to accepted US standards.

Do you accept the patient as dead?

If the brain is indeed dead then the person is dead, and that is the law in the US although it differs a bit from state to state in terms of what the standards are.

Once brain death has been pronounced the family's wishes vis a vis life support are immaterial in most states. The plug is pulled and the body is sent to the morgue. Period.

In New Jersey and New York the family can step in on religious grounds and insist that death be established by cardiopulmonary criteria rather than brain death criteria.

(I think that case in California is probably the result of involvement of an incompetent judge.)

This assumes that the doctors pronouncing brain death are competent to do so.
 
If a brain-dead person revives, if the person later is attacked and killed would it "murder" or abuse of a corpse? If the revived person when on a killing spree, could the person still be prosecuted being that he is legally dead?
If someone is actually brain dead, they cannot be revived with today's medical tech.
 
Brain dead people do not revive if they were diagnosed by appropriate standards.


And who decides what those are? At what point should a person believe what they are told, since it is known people have been falsely told someone is "brain dead" in the past?
 
If they are actually brain dead, yes. The question asks about people who are "pronounced" brain dead, not about people who "are" brain dead.

I challenge you to find a case that was pronounced in accordance with nationally accepted standards that has come back to "life'. I do not doubt there is malpractice out there.

I saw someone here post about a case of a brain dead patient that "woke up". Well the patient was in a medically induced coma. You cannot even begin the process of declaration of brain death until those drugs have cleared sufficiently from their system. On top of that they did not seem to do the whole battery of tests that were required.
 
This is true, but you have added to the definition of brain dead. All of that can still be true and the patient turns out to not actually be brain dead.

Oh, sorry, I missed your link to the claim above...mind reposting it?
 
And who decides what those are? At what point should a person believe what they are told, since it is known people have been falsely told someone is "brain dead" in the past?

Joko, while I do see your point, and I'm not expert enough to have all of the answers, but what is the known percentage of people who have been diagnosed as brain dead and been the opposite as you know them to be?

If we've gone no further in medical science to be able to determine when a brain stem no longer functions...then we are very much living in an antiquated medical / science error that has probably killed untold thousands without knowing such.

I did read a post where you know someone who was declared brain dead, but actually wasn't. I'm sure anything is possible. But do you believe that type of incident is the rule, rather than the exception?
 
If they are actually brain dead, yes. The question asks about people who are "pronounced" brain dead, not about people who "are" brain dead.

Is your claim a documented "common event or the rule" rather than the exception? Are most people still...not just alive...but functionally whole...after being diagnosed as brain dead?
 
And who decides what those are? At what point should a person believe what they are told, since it is known people have been falsely told someone is "brain dead" in the past?

There are nationally accepted standards that are very well known.

Frankly, there is an entire criteria to meet before you can even consider testing for brain death.

American Academy of Neurology Guidelines for Brain Death Determination | Welcome to Clinical Operations | Life Alliance Organ Recovery Agency at Miller School of Medicine
 
I challenge you to find a case that was pronounced in accordance with nationally accepted standards that has come back to "life'. I do not doubt there is malpractice out there.

Again, the question was "pronounced" you have essentially asked me to provide evidence for an argument I never made.
 
Again, the question was "pronounced" you have essentially asked me to provide evidence for an argument I never made.

Pronounced brain dead vs are brain dead? Is that what you are getting at?

Can you explain?
 
Oh, sorry, I missed your link to the claim above...mind reposting it?

My point is that misdiagnosis of brain death isn't unheard while the heart stopping is rather definitive.
 
My point is that misdiagnosis of brain death isn't unheard while the heart stopping is rather definitive.

Gotchya.

But actually cardiovascular death is misdiagnosed as well.
 
My point is that misdiagnosis of brain death isn't unheard while the heart stopping is rather definitive.

So we stop every hospital in the known universe from declaring a person brain dead, when they have made diligent tests to determine such...because its not unheard of that it is possible that a person isn't?

If you can prove that its more than "unheard of"...that's it's common place. Then I think you have an argument worth considering. Otherwise... :shrug:
 
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