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Is minimum wage a lot?

Assuming a 40 hour work week, is minimum wage a lot?

  • Yes, give your general geographic location

    Votes: 5 11.9%

  • No, give your general geographic location

    Votes: 37 88.1%
  • Total voters
    42
  • Poll closed .
SFCRED said:
You present a good sob story but life is tough and people have to live with the choices that they make. If someone works 70 hours a week and can't make it that is their fault. Sorry bout their luck but people who are impoverished are there by choice. All I can say for them is make better choices and work harder to get ahead. Pursuit of happiness doesn't mean that you'll get it. Sometimes life sucks and then ya die.
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It is not a sob story, it is a statistical fact. And no, that is not always down to the choices people make. Some people do not catch that break, did not have a proper education because they are not that smart or indeed made a stupid choice once and never were able to get back on their feed. And these people sometimes work 10 times as hard as any CEO or company director but do not get paid accordingly (a proper wage for a proper job).
 
vasuderatorrent said:
Which one?



Would you really be kind enough to say that? You are a saint. :allhail
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Never before have I seen a smiley face icon thingy that so accurately depicts my greatness. And yes my friend, my great kindness and wisdom extends to the far reaches of the earth. Even poor people make recieve these gifts of knowledge and amazingness.

But I guess I should rephrase my statement and say that people who stay impoverished stay there by choice. You are indeed a wise man. Blessings be upon you.
 
Peter King said:
It is not a sob story, it is a statistical fact. And no, that is not always down to the choices people make. Some people do not catch that break, did not have a proper education because they are not that smart or indeed made a stupid choice once and never were able to get back on their feed. And these people sometimes work 10 times as hard as any CEO or company director but do not get paid accordingly (a proper wage for a proper job).
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What is your definition of hard work? And I'm sorry but if it was so easy to become a CEO, on the account that a CEO doesn't work hard, why don't the "hard workers" just do what the CEOs did? Some are born with a silver spoon yes but it's quite ignorant to think that just because someone is rich means they don't wark hard. It's actually quite the opposite. The people who succeed in this life most often times make things happen for themselves and are resilient enough to bounce back from the crap life throws at them.

And it's not a statistical fact dude bro. Your confirmation bias is just preventing you from seeing the truth.
 
SFCRED said:
What is your definition of hard work? And I'm sorry but if it was so easy to become a CEO, on the account that a CEO doesn't work hard, why don't the "hard workers" just do what the CEOs did? Some are born with a silver spoon yes but it's quite ignorant to think that just because someone is rich means they don't wark hard. It's actually quite the opposite. The people who succeed in this life most often times make things happen for themselves and are resilient enough to bounce back from the crap life throws at them.

And it's not a statistical fact dude bro. Your confirmation bias is just preventing you from seeing the truth.
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I did not say that a CEO does not work hard, but the disparity in monetary reward for his work and someone who is not receiving a liveable wage is too great. There are enough companies who pay their employees so poorly that they need second jobs or government aid to even survive.

Most CEO's have ivy league educations, someone who does not have the opportunity to go to a school like that or who is not very good at school will most likely never have the luck to make it to CEO. Some have that luck (mostly through hard work, I do not deny that) but the odds are most will not reach high positions in companies.

I am also not saying that people have the right to "the American dream" but a liveable wage for a normal work week should be the norm IMHO.
 
SFCRED said:
The people who succeed in this life most often times make things happen for themselves and are resilient enough to bounce back from the crap life throws at them.

And it's not a statistical fact dude bro. Your confirmation bias is just preventing you from seeing the truth.
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If every single person was rich, wouldn't the lesser rich by default be poor? There will always be somebody to look down on with disdain. Just enjoy it while it lasts.
 
Empirica said:
You don't have to be a rocket surgeon to know this, Kevo__In fact it's the easiest question I was ever asked_

Capitalist Candidates that support the Constitution, promote small government, and believe in The American Dream that once made the United States the greatest, wealthiest, freest, most powerful nation in the history of the human race, that people from every corner of the world wanted to be a part of_

Fill our capital with these candidates and there will be a chicken in every pot in America_

Guaranteed!
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They don't exist in politics.
 
The current American federal minimum wage is 7.25$ per hour, while an adult cleaner in Norway can't legally be paid less than 161,17nok per hour, which equals 26,09$, or 3,6 times the American federal minimum wage.
 
Empirica said:
You don't have to be a rocket surgeon to know this, Kevo__In fact it's the easiest question I was ever asked_

Capitalist Candidates that support the Constitution, promote small government, and believe in The American Dream that once made the United States the greatest, wealthiest, freest, most powerful nation in the history of the human race, that people from every corner of the world wanted to be a part of_

Fill our capital with these candidates and there will be a chicken in every pot in America_

Guaranteed!
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What time period are you referring to exactly? Reagan or pre-world wars? Anyways, I think you should reconsider before advocating a reincarnation of policies in any point of American history, as social mobility, equality and fairness have been a bit lacking throughout. If you are looking for a brighter tomorrow, don't look into America's past for reference.
 
Some work hard, others inherit fortunes Midas could only dream of without having to break a sweat.
You seem to forget that how hard you work does not correlate to your chance of achieving wealth and success. Some Laborers are far more industrious than any investor. Scientists have benefited the world more than any banker. What seems to determine a person's income is his ability to advantageously manipulate capital, if he did not simply inherit.
 
TheGruvu said:
Some work hard, others inherit fortunes Midas could only dream of without having to break a sweat.
You seem to forget that how hard you work does not correlate to your chance of achieving wealth and success. Some Laborers are far more industrious than any investor. Scientists have benefited the world more than any banker. What seems to determine a person's income is his ability to advantageously manipulate capital, if he did not simply inherit.
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Working hard doesn't guarantee success. Inheriting a fortune doesn't either. Neither does investing. Some make it; some don't. Such is life. Such is what life has always been. Such is what life will always be. And there's nothing government can do about it except to make matters worse, to ensure the political class, like the C-class in the corporate world, remain above the fray - regardless what they do.

Inequity is a fact of life. There is no amount of compassion, no amount of emotion that will ever change that.

Give a hundred people a million dollars each and in but a brief amount of time every person will have something other than a million dollars; some will probably have zero; others maybe half; others maybe double, triple, or quadruple the original amount. There is no government program, no government scheme, no strategy that will ever change that - inequity will be the inevitable outcome - every time.

And no amount of envy; no amount of humility, or pride, or greed, or avarice can change it either.
 
TheGruvu said:
You seem to forget that how hard you work does not correlate to your chance of achieving wealth and success.
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Well that's true, you have to not only work hard, but work hard doing something the society around you values, and you also have to save some of what you earn, i.e. to consume less than what you earn. Hard work is just one required element of building wealth.
 
vasuderatorrent said:
Assuming a 40 hour work week, is minimum wage a lot of money?
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Well, it is a minimum wage after all. Enough for adequate living for a single person. Obviously you shouldn't be getting married to a stay at home spouse and/or having children until you get beyond a minimum wage.
 
TheGruvu said:
The current American federal minimum wage is 7.25$ per hour, while an adult cleaner in Norway can't legally be paid less than 161,17nok per hour, which equals 26,09$, or 3,6 times the American federal minimum wage.
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Hard to compare numbers. The average US household in the lowest quintile, which would include some minimum wage earners, gets $22,700 in net government assistance on top of their earned income while even low paid Norwegians pay a 28% tax rate (after subtracting 36% deductible plus 42,210 NOK (about $7,000). So a person making $15,000 would pay c. $700 in taxes.
 
EdwinWillers said:
Working hard doesn't guarantee success. Inheriting a fortune doesn't either. Neither does investing. Some make it; some don't. Such is life. Such is what life has always been. Such is what life will always be. And there's nothing government can do about it except to make matters worse, to ensure the political class, like the C-class in the corporate world, remain above the fray - regardless what they do.

Inequity is a fact of life. There is no amount of compassion, no amount of emotion that will ever change that.

Give a hundred people a million dollars each and in but a brief amount of time every person will have something other than a million dollars; some will probably have zero; others maybe half; others maybe double, triple, or quadruple the original amount. There is no government program, no government scheme, no strategy that will ever change that - inequity will be the inevitable outcome - every time.

And no amount of envy; no amount of humility, or pride, or greed, or avarice can change it either.
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You are correct. No matter how just or equal the society is, it will never be perfect, but many people have realized that the struggle has been worth the effort nonetheless. Many countries in the world have become considerably more fair, equal and richer than the US because their governments actually did a good job. I would like to know why you think the government is by necessity, completely inept at improving any situation, as We have had the exact opposite experience here in Scandinavia.
 
Neomalthusian said:
Well that's true, you have to not only work hard, but work hard doing something the society around you values, and you also have to save some of what you earn, i.e. to consume less than what you earn. Hard work is just one required element of building wealth.
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Absolutely, though I'm confident that some people that currently earn outrageous amounts of money (professional football or soccer players, etch) should be paid an average wage, I'm not so sure about artists and jobs that do not produce quantifiable products, what would be a fair wage for them? In my country, we subsidize artists to a large degree but it has become a widely debated issue as of late.
 
Eric7216 said:
Hard to compare numbers. The average US household in the lowest quintile, which would include some minimum wage earners, gets $22,700 in net government assistance on top of their earned income while even low paid Norwegians pay a 28% tax rate (after subtracting 36% deductible plus 42,210 NOK (about $7,000). So a person making $15,000 would pay c. $700 in taxes.
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Cost of living is much higher in Norway too.
 
TheGruvu said:
Absolutely, though I'm confident that some people that currently earn outrageous amounts of money (professional football or soccer players, etch) should be paid an average wage,
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You can't control that. Take the best soccer player in the world and require he be paid no more than 5 figures per year. Big deal. He won't care. Because how do you forbid companies across the globe from giving the guy money in return for agreeing to wear or endorse their products? You can't control this without creating an totalitarian one-world government.
 
TheGruvu said:
You are correct. No matter how just or equal the society is, it will never be perfect, but many people have realized that the struggle has been worth the effort nonetheless. Many countries in the world have become considerably more fair, equal and richer than the US because their governments actually did a good job. I would like to know why you think the government is by necessity, completely inept at improving any situation, as We have had the exact opposite experience here in Scandinavia.
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Define "fair."

Define "equal."

Define "rich."
 
We have quite efficiently forbidden murder and other acts deemed criminal on the grounds that we consider them wrong. One day public consciousness will hopefully developed to the point that we can criminalize any immoral behavior without having to resort to totalitarianism.
Though, when the Norwegian labor party decided to out-conservative the conservative party, I started wondering if we can ever achieve a socialist state democratically.
 
TheGruvu said:
The current American federal minimum wage is 7.25$ per hour, while an adult cleaner in Norway can't legally be paid less than 161,17nok per hour, which equals 26,09$, or 3,6 times the American federal minimum wage.
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Well the cost of living in Norway is also exponentially more. Norway also has large amount of cash to spend on welfare and subsides.
 
In this context, it would probably be:
fair; that a person gets either punitively or beneficially, what he deserves based on his actions, intentions, efforts, etc.
equal; there is less difference between social classes in terms of wealth and how they are treated by the law and society in general.
richer; possess more money, or have a better standard of living.
 
TheGruvu said:
One day public consciousness will hopefully developed to the point that we can criminalize any immoral behavior without having to resort to totalitarianism.
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Making "immoral"=illegal opens up a bag of cats.
Law becomes arbitrary, not about protecting people, but making people do what is "right".
The interpretation would vary based on city, county, state. Things like getting the most you can back from tax time could be looked at differently by different state judges because the federal returns are often used to calculate state returns, and state politics.
 
I am sorry, I really shouldn't have used the word "Immoral", but rather "behavior regarded as malicious and harmful to society to the point of being criminal". The point I was trying to get across was; there is no reason to resort to totalitarianism, as law enforcement seems to be functioning perfectly fine.
 
TheGruvu said:
I am sorry, I really shouldn't have used the word "Immoral", but rather "behavior regarded as malicious and harmful to society to the point of being criminal". The point I was trying to get across was; there is no reason to resort to totalitarianism, as law enforcement seems to be functioning perfectly fine.
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behavior regarded as malicious and harmful to society to the point of being criminal=illegal. We are already there. Rereading indicates you agree.
 
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