Abolish Traffic Enforcement Cameras

CaptainCourtesy said:

Easy way to avoid tickets given because of traffic cameras. Don't break the law.

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Most of these accidents involve people who aren't braking the law.

The timer for yellow is reduced, you can't stop in time safly, so you hit the brakes hard to avoid the camera and get rear ended.

That's the problem.

year2late said:

Isn't it just easier to pay attention and not run the red light?

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It takes more than 3 seconds of yellow to come to a stop in a 35-45mph zone. You have to hit your brakes hard, and that's when the accident happens.

It has nothing to do with paying attention. It has to do with safe stopping distances.

How long a yellow light is on should be determined by the stopping distance of the heaviest vehical that road is rated for traveling at the legal speed limit.

year2late said:

So what you want is a court trial for every episode?

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Due process of law.

See the Fifth, Sixth, and Seventh Amendments to the Constitution.

Bob Blaylock said:

Due process of law.

See the Fifth, Sixth, and Seventh Amendments to the Constitution.

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So you want a court trial for every ticket.

year2late said:

So you want a court trial for every ticket.

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Have you read the Fifth through Seventh Amendments? Do you understand them? Do you understand the burden that they intend to put on government's power to deprive a citizen of life, liberty, or property on the basis of having been accused of breaking the law?

The Constitution is the highest law of the land. Should government have the authority to violate this law under the pretext of upholding the law?

Bob Blaylock said:

Have you read the Fifth through Seventh Amendments? Do you understand them? Do you understand that they intend to put on government's power to deprive a citizen of life, liberty, or property on the basis of having been accused of breaking the law?

The Constitution is the highest law of the land. Should government have the authority to violate this law under the pretext of upholding the law?

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You can go to court. You can contest. Many do. I saw the video, saw what I had done. Paid my fine and learned from my mistake. If I did not agree with the ticket, I would have gone to court. I was not deprived .

joko104 said:

Why not show how that is certainly possible with redlight camera systems rather than just continuously cite a slogan about what is now for some their computer-gods?

Slamming on the brakes is how to "comply with the law." Of course, all vehicles do not stop at the same rate.

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If the time of a yellow to red and then picture does not allow for a safe stopping distance, then they are in violation. Problem is with people texting and not paying attention in other ways...

I have never seen too short of yellows. Will you document one for us please.

radcen said:

I don't have a link handy, but I have read that in some jurisdictions that some people have gotten red-light tickets for making a right turn on red... and which is legal in those jurisdictions... but still couldn't get the ticket dismissed because the driver's word alone wasn't good enough.

So much for "why don't you just comply with the law".

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My understanding is that these are cases where they didn't come to a full stop first, as required by law.

Or, was there a sign that said "Right turn permitted without stopping?"

Lord of Planar said:

My understanding is that these are cases where they didn't come to a full stop first, as required by law.

Or, was there a sign that said "Right turn permitted without stopping?"

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Please explain how a still camera would know and show the difference between a full stop and a "rolling stop".

Speed Cameras To Begin Issuing First Tickets Today.
October 16, 2013 7:28 AM

...Starting at 6 a.m. Wednesday, drivers will get only one warning if one of the cameras catches them speeding. After that, it’s a ticket.The first tickets, however, will be sent only to those driving 10 mph over the limit, or faster. The city will gradually lower the ticket threshold, and eventually ticket anyone going 6 mph over the limit, or faster. Fines for going 6 to 10 mph over the limit would be $35. Fines for going 11 mph over the limit or faster would be $100.....

Speed Cameras To Begin Issuing First Tickets Today « CBS Chicago

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How Do Automated Speed Cameras Work?

As they approach a automated speed enforcement (ASE) camera detection zone, drivers will see photo enforcement signs indicating the posted speed limit, the safety zone type, the hours of camera operation.

The camera system uses a 3D tracking radar, high-resolution digital camera and high-definition video camera. The 3D radar identifies any vehicle traveling faster than the posted speed limit and triggers both the camera and the video, which caputure the event.

The first image shows the vehicle driving in excess of the speed limt. The second image shows the distance and time the vehicle has traveled. The license plate is taken from a close-up of one of the images. Addiitonal data collected includes the time, date, posted speed limit, vehicle speed, location, lane and direction of travel. A high-definition video clip of the event is provided as evidence.

City of Chicago :: How Do Automated Speed Cameras Work?

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Whatever happened to common sense and personal responsibility.

It takes 8,460 bolts to assemble an automobile, and one nut to scatter it all over the road. ~Author Unknown

Bob Blaylock said:

Due process of law.

See the Fifth, Sixth, and Seventh Amendments to the Constitution.

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No one said you can not get a trial, why do you think you can not?? If you want a jury trial for a non jailable offense, you may be out of luck (state specific), in Ohio, no, but you can always have a bench trial.

radcen said:

Please explain how a still camera would know and show the difference between a full stop and a "rolling stop".

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It all depends on how the sensor system works, and programming.

Camera technology and programming have been capable of doing such things for almost 2 decades.

Lord of Planar said:

If the time of a yellow to red and then picture does not allow for a safe stopping distance, then they are in violation. Problem is with people texting and not paying attention in other ways...

I have never seen too short of yellows. Will you document one for us please.

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I understand their are, but I have not encountered them as well.

But if there are short yellows, take video, and tell it too the judge.

Realistically though, people should not be following so closely that a quick stop will cause a crash. I do agree the distracted issue is huge, combining that with tailgating is the bigger issue - rather than widespread short yellows.

year2late said:

I understand their are, but I have not encountered them as well.

But if there are short yellows, take video, and tell it too the judge.

Realistically though, people should not be following so closely that a quick stop will cause a crash. I do agree the distracted issue is huge, combining that with tailgating is the bigger issue - rather than widespread short yellows.

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And I'm all for scaring people strait, since they seem to have sense knocked into them somehow.

Bodhisattva said:

Once I was gonna run a late yellow as I was following the car ahead of me. Well, the guy decides to try and stop even though that was impossible, and then he guns it and takes off. I was left slamming on the breaks and stopping in the middle of the intersection. I had to get it in gear quick and go. There was a cop going the other way who stopped and I assumed he was gonna get me. He just looked at me and watched me drive off.

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A redlight camera would have ticketed you.

year2late said:

I understand their are, but I have not encountered them as well.

But if there are short yellows, take video, and tell it too the judge.

Realistically though, people should not be following so closely that a quick stop will cause a crash. I do agree the distracted issue is huge, combining that with tailgating is the bigger issue - rather than widespread short yellows.

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Yes, every person should go to a court every week to prove they are innocent of any violations of law. Really, people should quit their jobs, go on welfare and spend their days at courthouses. Especially courthouses 1000 miles away from where they live. I'm sure the government will pay the airline tickets and motel if the ticket is dismissed:roll:

lawboy said:

No one said you can not get a trial, why do you think you can not?? If you want a jury trial for a non jailable offense, you may be out of luck (state specific), in Ohio, no, but you can always have a bench trial.

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Oklahoma is at least honest enough to call them "police courts." You don't win a court where the city is paying the salary and doing the hiring of both the police and the judge.

year2late said:

You can go to court. You can contest. Many do. I saw the video, saw what I had done. Paid my fine and learned from my mistake. If I did not agree with the ticket, I would have gone to court. I was not deprived .

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How much do you think it costs most people to take a day off from work?

Cite ANY law that says an employer has to allow an employee to even miss work to fight a traffic ticket?

joko104 said:

A redlight camera would have ticketed you.

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I didn't run the red though. It was still yellow. I was almost stopped when it was red. Would it still have ticketed me, I wonder?

Bodhisattva said:

I didn't run the red though. It was still yellow. I was almost stopped when it was red. Would it still have ticketed me, I wonder?

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Then I don't know really.

The FACT is that a person doing 170 in a 200 mph designed car on a flat open highway without a car in sight endangers no one but possibly the driver - who is still safer than a lot of urban driving circumstances.

It is amazing and perplexing to me how MANY on this forum (and in society) seem to live in constant fear that ANYTHING might possibly, even in theory, harm them for which for such terrible fear they rage in hatred and want endless lists of punishments against anyone whose different activities or views may possibly in some theory poise a danger. Nearly all hate is based in fear, not rationality. Fear rationalizes hate.

I did not grow up in typical American culture. My youth would have justified constant great fear and hate, but I learned very young those are worthless and only counter-productive. Nothing good comes of it, only handicap and diversion.

I can not really grasp so many people having such terrible fear, such furious hates because of those fears, and how almost endlessly long the list of those fears and hates are, often about the most petty and ordinary things for which they want anyone and everyone of such differences punished and ruined.

For this, I'm not optimistic of this country's future, though it can probably continue a steady but controlled downward spiral continuing to benefit from the country's past successes and triumphs. I just don't think a society can prosper or be free for long when ever increasing numbers of people cry out in constant terror and fury: "I'm afraid! Protect me! Take care of me! Life is unfair! Everyone owes me! Save me!" as their perspective and increasingly their lifestyle and values. It amazes me that anyone thinks that panic self-pity parties help themselves other than politicians will throw them crumbs for their votes.

Maybe THAT is the reason for the growing economic gap between the haves and have nots. Maybe it is because there is a growing number of self pity angry and afraid people who make themselves have nots, won't do what it takes to have, and more enjoy being victims - of themselves (but they have endless excuses).

A guy driving a fast car alone in the middle of nowhere? Give him a ticket or just chew him out and leave it at that. No big deal.

joko104 said:

Oklahoma is at least honest enough to call them "police courts." You don't win a court where the city is paying the salary and doing the hiring of both the police and the judge.

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I've been pulled over for speeding (10-15 over the limit) here in Oklahoma a couple times and they just gave me a warning each time.

Fun Fact: I was armed both times I was pulled over. Both times I told the officer. Both times the officer didn't care and had me sit in the cruser with him while armed.

Oklahoma cops are cool ****. Nice mustang crusers, too, right out of Transformers.

Bodhisattva said:

I didn't run the red though. It was still yellow. I was almost stopped when it was red. Would it still have ticketed me, I wonder?

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So I've been looking into Buddhism recently, and now I know what your name means.

Lord of Planar said:

If the time of a yellow to red and then picture does not allow for a safe stopping distance, then they are in violation. Problem is with people texting and not paying attention in other ways...

I have never seen too short of yellows. Will you document one for us please.

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Regardless of how long, it is too short for a redlight camera if a vehicle stops in front of you or a pedestrian steps out.

joko104 said:

Regardless of how long, it is too short for a redlight camera if a vehicle stops in front of you or a pedestrian steps out.

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If a vehicle stops in front of you, and that scares you, you must have been following too close!

Have you ever paid attention to the whole picture of traffic signals?

First off, there is usually a pause between the red of one direction, to the green and walk of the other. Even when there isn't, it still takes time for a pedestrian or car to accelerate.

I haven't heard a single argument that doesn't sound like any better of an excuse than "my dog ate my homework."

I am infuriated by drivers who think they are the only ones that matter on the roadways. There are other methods of "traffic quelling" that bother me, but not red light cameras.