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Should we abolish Columbus Day?

Abolish Columbus Day, replace it with Bartolomé Day?


  • Total voters
    73
We celebrate Columbus Day because of the idea it represents not the man. It's almost cliche at this point to point out that Columbus was a fairly indecent man. There is nothing new in pointing out that he exploited the Indians he captured, was dictatorial to the colonists he ruled, and was generally an all around malcontent. That isn't the point. The point is that Columbus Day is a way of celebrating the arrival of Western civilization in the Americas and the 'completing' of the globe that it signified. Everyone in America knows this holiday as Columbus Day and Columbus Day it should remain.

Edit: Also on a complete side note I'm sick of hearing these sad yearnings for indigenous cultures and tribes gone by. Its not as though the tribes and civilizations encountered by Western settlers, whether Aztecs or the Powhatan's, were all that progressive and kind. In almost all cases their removal was an improvement. What remains a sad, sad mark on history is how the conquered were treated and the unstoppable impact and toll that disease took.
 
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Yes, Columbus day should be eliminated.

No, it should not be replaced with some political correctness of an obscure unknown.

National Casino Day?
 
Maybe they should rename it Native American Day...



Yea... No. The last thing any country needs is holiday devoted more or less exclusively to wallowing in pitiful self-loathing over crimes that no one alive today played any role in whatsoever.

Europeans are here, and they're here to stay. While I might suggest not centering it around someone like Columbus, I don't see anything wrong with the idea of a holiday commemorating the event which lead to this state of affairs.

History is often a messy business. There isn't a culture in existence without at least a few skeletons in its closet.

What's the point in crying over split milk? :shrug:
 
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Didn't you read the posts concerning what a scumbag Columbus was and how this is a driving force for this thread??

For my whole life, Columbus day has been wrapped with an in-service day at school the previous Friday, a nice 4-day vacation for families after the 1st quarter..

This is Harvest days, for ChrisL's sake, the change to Autumn..
These Libertarians won't be happy until they destroy all we have enjoyed growing up.

Oh, so you're concerned about your vacation time? So then call it National Massacre of Native People's Day.
 
Disgusting. And the lies our "educators" tell us in school are also awful. Reminds me of the Thanksgiving Day lies.

Much of it is ignorance or oversimplification of one point of view to make it more palatable for a younger audience while not angering parents. Then again, at the elementary education level, I never accused my teacher candidate colleagues of being that intellectually curious of history. They all seemed to be more interested in chick shows, parties, and cute child stories.
 


Yea... No. The last thing any country needs is holiday devoted more or less exclusively to wallowing in pitiful self-loathing over crimes that no one alive today played any role in whatsoever.

Europeans are here, and they're here to stay. I don't see anything wrong with a holiday commemorating the event which lead to this state of affairs.

History is often a messy business. There isn't a culture in existence without at least a few skeletons in its closet.

What's the point in crying over split milk? :shrug:


The point is that a lot of people don't feel right honoring a person like that with a national holiday. How about Christopher Columbus Sucks Day? :)
 
Much of it is ignorance or oversimplification of one point of view to make it more palatable for a younger audience while not angering parents. Then again, at the elementary education level, I never accused my teacher candidate colleagues of being that intellectually curious of history. They all seemed to be more interested in chick shows, parties, and cute child stories.

You would hope history teachers might actually know real history.
 
Boy you just don't get it..
A guy tries to reinforce what YOU said and bow-wow..
Try the whole thread after a good night's sleep and a stiff cup of coffee.
Oh, so you're concerned about your vacation time? So then call it National Massacre of Native People's Day.
 
The point is that a lot of people don't feel right honoring a person like that with a national holiday. How about Christopher Columbus Sucks Day? :)

I agree that centering the concept around Columbus probably isn't the best idea in the world. However, I'm not entirely opposed to the idea of a holiday celebrating the arrival of Western Civilization in the Americas either.

Even with all the bad that happened, a lot of good came out of the discovery of the New World as well. It's a part of our history; the good, the bad, and the ugly. We should acknowledge it as such.

Learn from the mistakes of the past, and move forward. Don't wallow in them just so other people can feel better about themselves. :twocents:
 
Boy you just don't get it..
A guy tries to reinforce what YOU said and bow-wow..
Try the whole thread after a good night's sleep and a stiff cup of coffee.

Sorry but your posts are not easy to interpret. A lot of times they just don't make any sense. It's not my fault, and obviously I'm not the only one who has a difficult time deciphering your posts, and honestly if you're going to get a tude about it, then it's just not worth my time to even try.
 
I agree that centering the concept around Columbus probably isn't the best idea in the world. However, I'm not entirely opposed to the idea of a holiday celebrating the arrival of Western Civilization in the Americas either.

Even with all the bad that happened, a lot of good came out of the discovery of the New World as well. It's a part of our history; the good, the bad, and the ugly. We should acknowledge it as such.

Learn from the mistakes of the past, and move forward. Don't wallow in them. :2cents:

I agree with that, but I still wouldn't object to calling the holiday something else. Cowabunga Day?
 
You would hope history teachers might actually know real history.

Eh, if you ask me that honestly, my reply would be to move toward to saying that it's difficult to claim to know what real history is, because it's based on constant arguing of scholars and re-imagining the problem. :p

To an extent they do. They know more than the average citizen, but that's not always saying much. Most teachers do not have time to read several monographs in a summer. If you're lucky they get to read one, and even then it's likely to be for mass consumption.
 
Replace with St. Patricks day, so we can all sleep off our hangovers.
 
Since he was an explorer, try teaching about explorers..
That is called a 'Common Core' technique..
After Magellen, Exploring morphed into studying stars with Tycho Brahe, whose nightly work over decades was used by 'Kepler' for his Laws of Planetary motion..
Also, during the 1500's, the Vatican started clamping down on the 'Earth is not the center of the Universe' crowd..
Copernicus and Roemer were not popular for proving that moons went around Jupiter..
House arrest for Galileo in the 1600's is well chronicled..
So yes, this is a teachable moment..
We call that Vatican the Paul Broun TEAts today..
You would hope history teachers might actually know real history.
 
We celebrate Columbus Day because of the idea it represents not the man. It's almost cliche at this point to point out that Columbus was a fairly indecent man. There is nothing new in pointing out that he exploited the Indians he captured, was dictatorial to the colonists he ruled, and was generally an all around malcontent. That isn't the point. The point is that Columbus Day is a way of celebrating the arrival of Western civilization in the Americas and the 'completing' of the globe that it signified. Everyone in America knows this holiday as Columbus Day and Columbus day it should remain......

Edit: Also on a complete side note I'm sick of hearing these sad yearnings for indigenous cultures and tribes gone by. Its not as though the tribes and civilizations encountered by Western settlers, whether Aztecs or the Powhatan's, were all that progressive and kind. In almost all cases their removal was an improvement. What remains a sad, sad mark on history is how the conquered were treated and the unstoppable impact and toll that disease took.




"Their removal was an improvement."? That is a sick perception of history.... "Celebrating the arrival of Western 'civilization'.". That's a laugh... Old Chris was Italion--Italions consider this their own personal holiday...It should be abolished....
 


Yea... No. The last thing any country needs is holiday devoted more or less exclusively to wallowing in pitiful self-loathing over crimes that no one alive today played any role in whatsoever.

Europeans are here, and they're here to stay. While I might suggest not centering it around someone like Columbus, I don't see anything wrong with the idea of a holiday commemorating the event which lead to this state of affairs.

History is often a messy business. There isn't a culture in existence without at least a few skeletons in its closet.

What's the point in crying over split milk? :shrug:




So we don't spill it again?
 
Eh, if you ask me that honestly, my reply would be to move toward to saying that it's difficult to claim to know what real history is, because it's based on constant arguing of scholars and re-imagining the problem. :p
The only real history we're sure of has Math and Science as its foundation..
Science as we know it began with these Explorers and their inventions..
Late last night, H2 cable had the top 101 inventions, just awesome stuff, with the 'wheel' as #1.
 
"Their removal was an improvement."? That is a sick perception of history.... "Celebrating the arrival of Western 'civilization'.". That's a laugh... Old Chris was Italion--Italions consider this their own personal holiday...It should be abolished....

I thought he was Spanish, but regardless what the hell is an Italion?
 
So we don't spill it again?

Where exactly? :roll:

For that matter, it's not like the natives were entirely innocent in all of this either. Europeans may have committed more than their share of atrocities, but most of the native cultures weren't much better.

Honestly, we should probably count it as blessing that the Aztecs and their ilk were done away with.

Would you want to live in a world where they were still around?
 
Speaking of days in Illinois, we have both Lincoln and President's day and schools are inconsistent..
When MLK day came in, Polish folks demanded their day also..
Hence, Casimir Pulaski day, the Polish-American hero who saved Washington's butt at Valley Forge..
Once again, a teachable moment..
Btw, our schools are allowed to opt out of missing these days, but must have a 'program'.
This TEAt attitude is abating.
"Their removal was an improvement."? That is a sick perception of history.... "Celebrating the arrival of Western 'civilization'.". That's a laugh... Old Chris was Italion--Italions consider this their own personal holiday...It should be abolished....
 
Where exactly? :roll:

For that matter, it's not like the natives were entirely innocent in all of this either. Europeans may have committed more than their share of atrocities, but most of the native cultures weren't much better.

Honestly, we should probably count it as blessing that the Aztecs and their ilk were done away with.

Would you want to live in a world where they were still around?

Gotta say, you make a heck of a point! :lol:
 
Gotta say, you make a heck of a point! :lol:

I mean... Damn. You think modern Africa and the Middle East are bad?

I don't even want to think about the kind of shenanigans we might be looking at if the Aztecs had hung around long enough to get ahold of machine guns and rocket propelled grenades. :lol:
 
The only real history we're sure of has Math and Science as its foundation..
Science as we know it began with these Explorers and their inventions..
Late last night, H2 cable had the top 101 inventions, just awesome stuff, with the 'wheel' as #1.

How is that "real history"? We call that history of science or history of technology, and that's just as contentious of a field as any.
 
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