• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Our civilisation is pathetic. [W:459]

Is our civilisation pathetic?


  • Total voters
    51
It is not up to me to measure success for others, that would be presumptive and wrong.

As for the least successful person, I think back to an old Proverb: "The nail that sticks out gets hammered down."


How often do you think about the least successfull people in this world?

Why is that?

I presume you know that they starve, thirst and suffer deeply, every minute we discuss this.

What do you really think about that?

How successfull are we?
 
How often do you think about the least successfull people in this world?

Why is that?

I presume you know that they starve, thirst and suffer deeply, every minute we discuss this.

What do you really think about that?

Over the long run? "That the superior power of population is repressed, and the actual population kept equal to the means of subsistence, by misery and vice." - Thomas Malthus
 
How often do you think about the least successfull people in this world?

Why is that?

I presume you know that they starve, thirst and suffer deeply, every minute we discuss this.

What do you really think about that?

How successfull are we?

I'll have you know that there is no greater engine for prosperity and civilization than western civilization.

So while this single idea that has liberated mankind, gave us knowledge and understanding, technology and a society of plenty and opportunity isn't good enough for you... then by all means, go for it. Make something better. I'll be waiting. Create a better model for society than western civilization.
 
I would have voted "In some respects" if that were an option. Because it's not, I stuck with 'No.'

Aspects I find pathetic include:
- The pervasive attitudes that autonomous legal adults are entitled to their needs being met by the external, as though they're still children.
- Economic policies based on a gambler's fallacy "if I blow it all now, things will be better later and THEN I'll be able to pay my bills."
- Unrestrained population growth and the visceral/emotional refusal to discuss slowing down.
- Staunch bargain shoppers who get angry that companies pursue economies of scale and cost-minimize.
- Party loyalists​

Some things I find absolutely amazing, when I sit back and reflect on it, which I think we would not have invented were it not for our pathetic but advanced civilization:
- Wireless broadband internet. Do you guys realize how freaking amazing this is? It is unbelievably amazing. Revolutionary. The most profound advancement since the printing press.
- Self-fusing silicon tape. My god this stuff works amazingly well. A million times better than duct tape.
- Filson
- Chain saws

Every time I use these things I feel a sense of awe and appreciation for human intelligence and innovation.


Hmm. I find your post quite interesting. But on the other side I think most technology is pathetic as well.

I either find it disappointing and quite primitive. I find it damaging or negative. And I find that it's there only to make a profit, which is an ideology I completely disagree with.

...and why would we cut down trees if we do not absolutely have to? Is this world not ugly enough with our huge, damaging and ugly fingerprint on it?


Some technologies are really useful though. But often the quality is really, really bad. And most often, technologies are just things that we really don't need.
 
Over the long run? "That the superior power of population is repressed, and the actual population kept equal to the means of subsistence, by misery and vice." - Thomas Malthus

Our population is out of control. This planet is hugely overpopulated. It would better be managed with common sense, good organisation and quaity management, rather than suffering, misery and death.
 
Hmm. I find your post quite interesting. But on the other side I think most technology is pathetic as well.

I either find it disappointing and quite primitive.

Well you sound like a spoiled brat who has never studied history then, frankly. What sorts of science fiction technology do you think SHOULD magically exist?

And I find that it's there only to make a profit, which is an ideology I completely disagree with.

Are you a monk? The only reason a living thing exerts effort on its environment is to make itself better off in the near future than it is in the current moment. That is essentially the same drive as the profit-motive. Living things tend to "work" to "make a profit."

Just like thinking magic technology should exist, you also think people should not be compelled to do anything in order to meet their own needs. That is unquestionably utopian.

...and why would we cut down trees if we do not absolutely have to?

I absolutely have to.

Is this world not ugly enough with our huge, damaging and ugly fingerprint on it?

Umm, now is about the time I would advise scheduling a meeting with a psychiatrist. I have a soft spot for cynicism and pessimism, but not to this wild extreme. Your bitterness at the world for not being perfect for you is not going to translate over to having coherent political, economic or social ideas.
 
Our population is out of control. This planet is hugely overpopulated. It would better be managed with common sense, good organisation and quaity management, rather than suffering, misery and death.
Unfortunately our attempts at central control have often led to even more suffering, misery and death.
The overall lifestyle of almost everyone on the planet has improved in the last century.
If you cannot see this, you are ether not old enough, or do not read enough history.
We cannot regulate lower population, at best we may be able to educate to a better lifestyle.
 
I'll have you know that there is no greater engine for prosperity and civilization than western civilization.

You think so do you?
How is is a great engine to build something that cannot last, by overexploiting natural resources, building an economic model which is grossly unfair and leads to further povery, while we exploit people, rob their countries of their resources, do a very poor job at distributing this wealth and give them nothing in return for our prosperity.

It doesn't help to drop bags of rice on them you know.

So while this single idea that has liberated mankind, gave us knowledge and understanding, technology and a society of plenty and opportunity isn't good enough for you... then by all means, go for it. Make something better. I'll be waiting. Create a better model for society than western civilization.

You know that is not possible do you? Our democracy is so flawed that it is impossible for most people to get there, and if you ever do, you have to sell yourself. Usually it is the best liars and manipulators who make it into a position where they can do what you say in the end of your statement.


Besides, this is not about me, its about everyone. Everyone should make a better world, not some corrupt people who manage to become dictator for a day.


Our knowledge is extremely poor in general, only a fool will think we have great knowledge and understanding. If we had understanding our world would not be such an utter failure, if we have knowledge, we would do something about it. Technologies are mostly extremely primitive, useless or just plain garbage quality.
 
HEY! ME TOO!
Man, I miss those Velvet Elvis'es.
I should also mention that I did have an original "Dogs Playing Poker" on display in my basement. Don't know what could've happened to it, but it's gone, and civilization is a little worse off for it's loss.
 

Hey man, if you want to hate on corporations, governments, and (arguably) the most comfortable living conditions in all of recorded human history, that is ultimately your prerogative. I won't quibble with you over it.

I would, however; point out that there plenty of deserts, jungles, and taigas out there for a man to lose himself in if he is so inclined.

Go live like all of our ancestors before the modern era were forced to for a few years, and then come back and tell me how you think modern civilization stacks up.

Just an idea, of course. ;)
 
Well you sound like a spoiled brat who has never studied history then, frankly. What sorts of science fiction technology do you think SHOULD magically exist?

Useful technologies rather than profitable ones.


Are you a monk? The only reason a living thing exerts effort on its environment is to make itself better off in the near future than it is in the current moment. That is essentially the same drive as the profit-motive. Living things tend to "work" to "make a profit."


Really? I don't agree. Living things tend to work because food doesnt drop from the skies and because the model of society they live in leaves them no option.

I am no monk, but I admire them.


Just like thinking magic technology should exist, you also think people should not be compelled to do anything in order to meet their own needs. That is unquestionably utopian.

Ahh, I love it when person B tells person A what the opinion of person A is.


I absolutely have to.

Then I don't see anything wrong with that. Unless you are lying.


Umm, now is about the time I would advise scheduling a meeting with a psychiatrist. I have a soft spot for cynicism and pessimism, but not to this wild extreme. Your bitterness at the world for not being perfect for you is not going to translate over to having coherent political, economic or social ideas.

Why would I not want a perfect world?
 
Any civilization that has succeeded in putting men on the moon is far from pathetic.
 
Hey man, if you want to hate on corporations, governments, and (arguably) the most comfortable living conditions in all of recorded human history, that is ultimately your prerogative. I won't quibble with you over it.

There are very few thing that I hate, if any. Probably none.

There are also very few things I admire. There are some though.


I would, however; point out that there plenty of deserts, jungles, and taigas out there for a man to lose himself in if he is so inclined.

I am unfit for the purpose, like most men who received an education in the west. Besides, its also being cut down, ruined or otherwise spoiled, not exactly a safe choice of lifestyle.

Go live like all of our ancestors before the modern era were forced to for a few years, and then come back and tell me how you think modern civilization stacks up.

We should live more like our ancerstors, shouldn't we. But then again, we learn nothing from the past.

Just an idea, of course. ;)

Ideas, another positive thing about this world. Too bad so few can be expressed in a truly public forum. That is reserved for the political elite.
 
Don't you think the problem may be that some people think they know what EVERYONE else thinks, wants and needs?





I think that way too many people who don't even know what all of the problems are think that they have the answers to all of them.

And a lot of those people are in Washington, D.C. wasting money.
 
Hmmm, if the planet is indeed overpopulated with humans that suggests we are a most successful species (in the natural milieu). Considering the US is one of those large population centers, it also makes us a prominent part of that success. So, naturally speaking, hardly pathetic at all.
 
Any civilization that has succeeded in putting men on the moon is far from pathetic.

Thats a bit of a narrow view in my opinion. I don't think thats much of an accomplishment at all.

What would be a success is if we had peace and harmony in this world and could bring that to space one day, instead of war, missery, suffering, greed, selfishness. Then we could perhaps be more like a civilisation gone to space rather than a parasite.
 
How often do you think about the least successfull people in this world?

Why is that?

I presume you know that they starve, thirst and suffer deeply, every minute we discuss this.

What do you really think about that?

How successfull are we?

How arrogant would I have to be to consider others to be unsuccessful? What measure would I use, mine?

I could look at a group of barefoot tribesman in some hovel in Africa and buy them all shoes. Maybe they are all happy without shoes.

I prefer to be a productive member of my society, a society which is the most charitable in the world and who seek out people who are unfortunate and do want help.

I think that success is a strategy, not pathos.
 
Hmmm, if the planet is indeed overpopulated with humans that suggests we are a most successful species (in the natural milieu). Considering the US is one of those large population centers, it also makes us a prominent part of that success. So, naturally speaking, hardly pathetic at all.

The same is also true for bacteria, viruses and parasites. Hardly admirable and desireable.
 
Hmmm, if the planet is indeed overpopulated with humans that suggests we are a most successful species (in the natural milieu). Considering the US is one of those large population centers, it also makes us a prominent part of that success. So, naturally speaking, hardly pathetic at all.

Yup. The only "pathetic" thing about it is that we haven't managed to figure out how to start effectively exporting people off of this dirty ball of rock yet.

Time's a wastin' here and we've got places to explore and worlds to conquer. Get to it science! Chop, chop! :lol:
 
[/COLOR][/B]

I think that way too many people who don't even know what all of the problems are think that they have the answers to all of them.

And a lot of those people are in Washington, D.C. wasting money.

Thats a nice post, I like that one.
 
Yup. The only "pathetic" thing about it is that we haven't managed to figure out how to start effectively exporting people off of this dirty ball of rock yet.

Time's a wastin' here and we've got places to explore and worlds to conquer. Get to it science! Chop, chop! :lol:

Feel free to export me first.
 
Do you agree with the statement (above)?

What a ridiculous world, full of ridiculous countries, and their naive peoples.


Every single person on this planet is ready to embrace a world society that makes sense. A society where we all get along and cooperate, a society where no one starves, where no one suffers. Everyone is ready to live in and contribute to a society where people do not live under horrific conditions. Everyone is ready to embrace a society where we all cooperate for a better world. Everyone is ready to embrace a society which is well organised and stable with a model that doesn't look like its made by monkeys. Everyone is ready for a society without all the lies, the deceit, manipulation and corruption. Everyone is ready to embrace a free society rather than be jailed and restricted by their governments. Everyone is ready to be free and open their mind instead of being narrow minded and controlled. Everyone is ready to embrace a society where everyone else is good and kind. Everyone is ready to live on a clean and wonderful planet. Everyone is ready to embrace useful change. Everyone wants quality. Everyone is ready for a fair economic system that make sense.
Everyone wants everyone else to smile.
Everyone wants a world of joy. Everyone wants to be safe. Everyone wants to experience fantastic and great things. Everyone wants to breathe clean air, everyone wants to drink pure water, everyone wants to eat delicious food. We all want to be happy. Everyone wants to live on a planet where everyone else is happy. Everyone wants a planet where everyone have all these things. Everyone wants to have a just society.


But no. We have a society full of corruption, our planet is turning into a horrible hole, we are ruining the only place we have. We fight wars AGAINST OURSELVES. We lie, we manipulate, we are cruel to each others. We live on deception. Everyone is trapped in a society with massive brainwashing, where they have no ability to think for themselves any longer. We let the governments take all power and leave only an illusion to the people. Our society look like its organised by monkeys and savages. People starve, die of thirst and suffer every single minute. Our society is completely unstable so we choose not to cooperate and rather work against each others. For anyone who is awake and not an idiot, our society doesnt make sense at all. We poison our own food, we pollute our drinking water and soil, we empty the oceans, we live in really ugly cities. The government is hugging us so hard that they are suffocating us. Our rights are taken away day by day. We only care about profit. Everything we buy is low quality junk. Most people either steal from others as a criminal act or as a legal job, most people think only of them self. Most people say cruel things to others and try to create disharmony since they have no harmony themselves. We all feel bad.

So f*** the US, they are now the worst.
...and Europe, we are on the same slippery slope.

We step on the shoulders of the poor and suffering, we abuse other nations, we wage wars against them and kill their families, we poison their minds with unsound logic, we pretend we have democracy and stand and step on freedom and choice. We do most of the above things. We suck actually. We are immoral bastards.

So, aside from the crooks in the US and Europe, how is the rest of the world? A damn slave labour camp, and those who don't do that, they suffer and die every day, from starvation or thirst or just horrid general conditions.


This is ONE planet. We are ALL responsible to look at ourselves as ONE people. If someone from outside looked at this place, YOU would be considered one of those idiots on a planet with such a pathetic civilisation.

Personally I am deeply ashamed to be a human being, being part of such a pathetic civilisation among people who do such horrendous things. I feel deeply ashamed that we let the people suffer, starve and die when we can EASILY do something about it. I feel sorry for all the dumb-asses who believe we live in good and free societies. Its probably because you only have trash to compare with.


Take your head out of the sand and vote.




Maybe you want to see everyone smiling

When I see everyone smiling I know for sure that some weird **** is going on.
 
The same is also true for bacteria, viruses and parasites. Hardly admirable and desireable.

No, incorrect. All named are not near as successful when put up against mankind. And since when is species survival not "desireable" to the species?
 
Back
Top Bottom