Should these teens be tried as adults

Zyphlin · Aug 28, 2013

ChrisL said:
Therefore I suppose I CAN call it murder since it is illegal killing in MY state.

It's not an error. It's illegal in my state of Massachusetts.

I'd like to see that. :lol: Of course it's relevant since it IS illegal in many states in the US.

No, you couldn't. Not in the context of what started this whole thing.

If capital punishment is illegal in your state, then the killling of someone by the state for his crimes would not be "state sponsored" because the state doesn't allow it. It would be murder, on the part of the individual doing the action, specifically because it's NOT state sponsored by virtue of it being illegal.

Your claim that started this entire chain of conversation was:

When someone is sentenced to the death penalty, they are a victim of state-sponsored murder.

Someone can not be sentenced to "the death penalty" in a state that it's not legal to be sentenced to the death penalty.

If the state is sentencing the person to the death penalty, if the killing is "state sponsored", then it's LEGAL and thus not murder. If the state doesn't sentence people to death, if the state doesn't sponsor the killing, then you can't have an instance of someone being "sentenced to the death penalty" and be a victim to "state sponsored" killing.

That was my whole point. Based on the words YOU ACTUALLY SAID....that they were SENTENCED and it was STATE SPONSORED...the term "murder" is incorrect. It's the same general gripe I have when people continually claim abortion doctors and patients are "murderers".

ChrisL · Aug 28, 2013

lolabird said:
More like logical fallacy on your part. Nothing really to handle as it's like water off a duck's back.

Point out the logical fallacy. I'll be waiting.

ChrisL · Aug 28, 2013

Zyphlin said:
No, you couldn't. Not in the context of what started this whole thing.

If capital punishment is illegal in your state, then the killling of someone by the state for his crimes would not be "state sponsored" because the state doesn't allow it. It would be murder, on the part of the individual doing the action, specifically because it's NOT state sponsored by virtue of it being illegal.

If the state killed a criminal using capital punishment in my state it would be state-sponsored murder BECAUSE it's illegal.

Your claim that started this entire chain of conversation was:

That's right.

Someone can not be sentenced to "the death penalty" in a state that it's not legal to be sentenced to the death penalty.

If the state is sentencing the person to the death penalty, if the killing is "state sponsored", then it's LEGAL and thus not murder. If the state doesn't sentence people to death, if the state doesn't sponsor the killing, then you can't have an instance of someone being "sentenced to the death penalty" and be a victim to "state sponsored" killing.

Okay, whatever, you call it what you want; I'll call it as I see it. The state murdering it's citizens. It's nothing more than that to ME. Okay? So that's my opinion. You can argue the semantics of it all day. Like I said, in my eyes it should not be legal, so that is what I see it as.

That was my whole point. Based on the words YOU ACTUALLY SAID....that they were SENTENCED and it was STATE SPONSORED...the term "murder" is incorrect. It's the same general gripe I have when people continually claim abortion doctors and patients are "murderers".

Alright, but what is the point of this whole discussion? It's really quite pointless because I'm going to keep saying it. If you want to jump all over me every time I say, be my guest. :roll:

lolabird · Aug 28, 2013

ChrisL said:
Right here, you challenged me first. Sorry if you're just not very good at debating the issues and sticking to facts. :mrgreen:

You are a compendium of useless information. What's to debate?

ChrisL · Aug 28, 2013

lolabird said:
You are a compendium of useless information. What's to debate?

So you can't back up your claims. I'm not surprised. You really suck at debating. :lamo

lolabird · Aug 28, 2013

ChrisL said:
So you can't back up your claims. I'm not surprised. You really suck at debating. :lamo

My claims are you are a ridiculous person, and I don't need to prove it. You're doing an excellent job.

ChrisL · Aug 28, 2013

lolabird said:
My claims are you are a ridiculous person, and I don't need to prove it. You're doing an excellent job.

Wow! That could be considered a personal attack I think. Perhaps I should report you?

And maybe you need the definition to "debate" as well. I don't think you really know what that means either.

lolabird · Aug 28, 2013

ChrisL said:
Wow! That could be considered a personal attack I think. Perhaps I should report you?

And maybe you need the definition to "debate" as well. I don't think you really know what that means either.

Give yourself a big "O" and report me. Isn't that you game?

ChrisL · Aug 28, 2013

lolabird said:
Give yourself a big "O" and report me. Isn't that you game?

Isn't what my game?

lolabird · Aug 28, 2013

ChrisL said:
Isn't what my game?

Don't play stupid at this point.

ChrisL · Aug 28, 2013

lolabird said:
Don't play stupid at this point.

No seriously, what game is that?

lolabird · Aug 28, 2013

ChrisL said:
No seriously, what game is that?

Your game is to report those whom you cannot conquer with your child play.
The only way you can elevate your self-esteem is to try and punish them with threats of "I'm going to report you."
Go ahead!

ChrisL · Aug 28, 2013

lolabird said:
Your game is to report those whom you cannot conquer with your child play.
The only way you can elevate your self-esteem is to try and punish them with threats of "I'm going to report you."
Go ahead!

Actually, I've only ever reported one person. I don't have to. Now, are you going to back up your allegations with facts or continue to play this silly game? I'm still waiting. If you don't produce, I'll have to assume you're lying.'

Oh, and by the way, parroting the prosecution side of the story does NOT constitute fact, not until such things are PROVEN in a court of law.

lolabird · Aug 28, 2013

ChrisL said:
Actually, I've only ever reported one person. I don't have to. Now, are you going to back up your allegations with facts or continue to play this silly game? I'm still waiting. If you don't produce, I'll have to assume you're lying.

When you assume, you make an ass out of U.

ChrisL · Aug 28, 2013

lolabird said:
When you assume, you make an ass out of U.

Let me teach you something else while I have your undivided attention. Anything that anyone says about this case as it stands right now are only "allegations." I hope you know what that means. If not just ask me! I'll gladly provide you with a definition, or you could just google it yourself.

Anyway, as I was saying, those are only allegations until they are proven during the trial. You do understand how the justice system works right? Innocent until PROVEN guilty beyond a reasonable doubt in a court of law by a judge or jury of your peers.

lolabird · Aug 28, 2013

ChrisL said:
Let me teach you something else while I have your undivided attention. Anything that anyone says about this case as it stands right now are only "allegations." I hope you know what that means. If not just ask me! I'll gladly provide you with a definition, or you could just google it yourself.

Anyway, as I was saying, those are only allegations until they are proven during the trial. You do understand how the justice system works right? Innocent until PROVEN guilty beyond a reasonable doubt in a court of law by a judge or jury of your peers.

So, James Francis Edwards' confession is only an allegation?

al·le·ga·tion

/ˌaliˈgāSHən/

noun

noun: allegation; plural noun: allegations

1.

a claim or assertion that someone has done something illegal or wrong, typically one made without proof.

ChrisL · Aug 28, 2013

lolabird said:
So, James Francis Edwards' confession is only an allegation?

al·le·ga·tion

/ˌaliˈgāSHən/

noun

noun: allegation; plural noun: allegations

1.

a claim or assertion that someone has done something illegal or wrong, typically one made without proof.

Yes it is. Rarely are convictions made on confessions alone. Just recently in Sweden, an alleged serial killer who was convicted of killing 8 people, to which he confessed, was released or is being released from prison, as he retracted his confession.

You really need to do some research.

The Innocence Project - Understand the Causes: False Confessions / Admissions

False Confessions
In about 25% of DNA exoneration cases, innocent defendants made incriminating statements, delivered outright confessions or pled guilty.

These cases show that confessions are not always prompted by internal knowledge or actual guilt, but are sometimes motivated by external influences.

Children and teenagers are ESPECIALLY susceptible.

lolabird · Aug 28, 2013

ChrisL said:
Yes it is. Rarely are convictions made on confessions alone. Just recently in Sweden, an alleged serial killer who was convicted of killing 8 people, to which he confessed, was released or is being released from prison, as he retracted his confession.

You really need to do some research.

The Innocence Project - Understand the Causes: False Confessions / Admissions

Children and teenagers are ESPECIALLY susceptible.

in·cor·ri·gi·ble

/inˈkôrijəbəl, -ˈkär-/

adjective

adjective: incorrigible

1.

(of a person or their tendencies) not able to be corrected, improved, or reformed
You are incorribible

ChrisL · Aug 28, 2013

lolabird said:
in·cor·ri·gi·ble

/inˈkôrijəbəl, -ˈkär-/

adjective

adjective: incorrigible

1.

(of a person or their tendencies) not able to be corrected, improved, or reformed
You are incorribible

I'm still waiting for you to make a valid argument to back your claims or to admit that you really don't know anything about this other than what you read in an article. You can continue to act foolish if you wish though.

lolabird · Aug 28, 2013

ChrisL said:
I'm still waiting for you to make a valid argument to back your claims or to admit that you really don't know anything about this other than what you read in an article. You can continue to act foolish if you wish though.

Keep your eyes crossed and hold your breath. That's about all someone like can do.

ChrisL · Aug 28, 2013

lolabird said:
Keep your eyes crossed and hold your breath. That's about all someone like can do.

I guess you're done here. :2razz:

lolabird · Aug 29, 2013

ChrisL said:
I guess you're done here. :2razz:

Checkmate!

OscarB63 · Aug 29, 2013

have these turds made a plea bargain with the prosecution yet?

OscarB63 · Aug 30, 2013

for those of you crying that these turds are "children" and shouldn't be tried as adults.... how about these guys? should they be charged as adults or are they also just "children"?

Police: 2 Women Gang Raped By Juveniles In Wilmington Park « CBS Philly

nota bene · Aug 30, 2013

Lotta depraved indifference going around.

Should these teens be tried as adults

Should the 15 and 16 year old also be tried as adults

yes and throw away the key

no, they deserve a second chance

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