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Bullying...

How are we doing at addressing bullying?

  • We're not doing enough.

    Votes: 26 43.3%
  • We're right on track and taking appropriate measures.

    Votes: 7 11.7%
  • We're blowing it way out of proportion.

    Votes: 20 33.3%
  • Other.

    Votes: 7 11.7%

  • Total voters
    60
Bullying is human nature. There's nothing exclusively American about it.

It's not even human nature. Bulling is organic nature.

Bullying is just a form of competition. Plants do this to each other. Interestingly, researchers found that plants will expand slower when their own species is in the near vicinity and will expand faster when there are other species they're competing with.
 
True, but it has evolved. It's more brutal and ruthless than when I was a kid and my dad told me to go face the bully.

I don't buy that. If you're white or asian, American schools are unbelievably safe. The same rules that applied to you as a kid apply to your kids today.

If your child attends an overwhealmingly black or latino school in the inner city, then you're living in a totally different world. But that's always been the case. The only difference is, when you were a kid, nobody in white america reported on what went on in all black neighborhoods.

I guess ignorance can be bliss, sometimes.
 
I'm not sure that would do much more than piss the average bully off. Next time instead of facing the kid at school it might be on the way home where no one can see.

Well, I don't think a bully kid can outsmart a grown up inspector (the investigation) and get away with it. If a bully is expelled and sent to a special school because he's beat some kid, his friends will think twice before stepping in the same direction.
Anyway, the school task is to teach grown-ups that life has some responsibilities along with freedoms. And if you step over certain borders (the rules) that will be bad for you. You can beat the **** out of somebody but next time someone greater than you can beat the **** out of you, that's how it works.
 
Bullying... the new trendy social issue. How are we doing at addressing it?

I don't think any reasonable person would deny that bullying exists, but... are we properly addressing the issue or are we blowing it out of proportion?

I think it is the other way around, it is a social issue that is made worse by new trendy things of today. Especially internet, facebook and social media make it impossible for a child to hide from bullying. Usually kids were bullied at school but had a safe home place/family but in this day and age the people who bully can reach into that safe place and make a child bullied electronically as well.
 
I don't buy that. If you're white or asian, American schools are unbelievably safe. The same rules that applied to you as a kid apply to your kids today.

If your child attends an overwhealmingly black or latino school in the inner city, then you're living in a totally different world. But that's always been the case. The only difference is, when you were a kid, nobody in white america reported on what went on in all black neighborhoods.

I guess ignorance can be bliss, sometimes.

I grew up in Harlem, NYC. I also spent time with family living in Watts, LA just a couple of blocks from the Towers. No one had to report anything to me...I lived it. Don't pull that crap with me. I know whereof I speak.
 
I just think there is a big different between something that are serious and others that are relatively trivial.

"Gangs" of kids attacking the son you mentioned previously and severely hurting him is very serious but the daughter who had her feelings hurt is relatively trivial. I don't doubt being unpopular is no picnic but that's life.

OMG I couldn't disagree more. You can recover from a fist-fight. Girls are killing themselves in record numbers because of cyber-bullying. Looking at it from your point of view, the numbers don't surprise me, because if it's not physical, it's not bullying, so go pull up your big girl panties, girlie, and get to school. If someone isn't hitting you, they aren't hurting you. :roll: Sheeesh.
 
To answer the OP, not nearly enough is being done to curb bullying. Schools now put up cutesy little posters, saying, "This is a BULLY FREE ZONE!1!!1" and "REPORT ALL BULLYING!" but they don't really want to do anything about it - at least none of the schools my girls have gone to. They want to brush the problems under the rug until some teenager jumps out a window, and then it's too late.
 
Yeah, what we probably need to be doing, as we did when I was young and in school, is let someone kick the bully's ass, rather than teaching children to be passive, and punishing them for fighting back against an aggressor.

I reinforce this act myself. The bully is usually someone in greater age picking on a victim of a smaller age. So I approach them and remind them the fact that "There is always and always someone who is bigger!"
 
It seems like there are some different views of what bullying is. It's often not just physical. In fact, physical bullying is likely rare compared with psychological and social bullying. Kids don't face a bully who wants to hit them, but rather bullies who single them out for derision and ostracizing. And as a kid faces that, every day, for years, they may become depressed, more likely to turn to drugs, or lose all confidence. They become damaged before they become adults. These kids can't fight back, they can't have the movie moment where they win a fistfight with the bully. They'll get in trouble for starting the physical fight.

It's a cliche, but a true one that bullies are often troubled themselves. Counseling, dealing with their problems at home, and making sure that their attacks on others aren't ignored are key to stopping the cycle. A lot of bullying likely comes from bad parenting, especially authoritarian parenting.

Yeah, certainly had my share of detentions for fighting back. It boils down to giving local districts complete power over some kid's life. Then if the kid is not well liked, the teachers and admin become complicit and protect the bullies. The only effective way to counter this is a lawsuit. But if you're 15 and afraid that will only make things worse, or you have no guidance, what can you do? Drop out? Transfer? /wrist?

It's difficult to blow this problem out of proportion when it comes to those who are wrecked psychologically or no longer alive because of bullying. However, I'm not sure what can be done about it other than an enforced zero tolerance policy. Most bullies will be in jail by age 25 anyway, and at least this policy can save the victims. HS seems to do little more than give harbor to criminals. Imagine they got in those fights in a Meijer parking lot. Arrested for sure. Rather than expel them though, put them in a "bullies only classroom." Then they can taunt and beat on each other all day.
 
Discounting the "toughen up" aspect, and teaching kids to be hyper-sensitive, only serves to perpetuate the problem and it becomes self-sustaining in that it becomes always expanding.

Really, so if half a dozen kids are throwing rocks at one victim in the parking lot, or he finds a knife in his locker, he is being 'hyper sensitive' and should just 'toughen up'? Are you that unaware of how bad it can get?

Of course people will defend themselves if able to, but i doubt it's often a fair fight.
 
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I think the school system needs to make up its mind already. Either crack down on bullying so hard that children are not given the opportunity to do it anymore, or enable victims to fight back by not suspending them.

When I was a kid there was one bully who teased me daily for months until finally I snapped and punched him square in the face and screamed bloody murder at him. He never bothered me again, and was not permanently harmed.

Our culture is becoming so wussy. You can't hit anyone without being charged with a crime, when sometimes physical confrontation is highly useful. Not only that, sometimes it is completely justified. Other parts of the world seem to understand this. Humans respond to intrusions placed upon their physical boundaries.

Letting young people experience the full backlash against their bullying quickly sorts them out. But all this hand holding and half-measures are so annoying to witness.
 
I think the school system needs to make up its mind already. Either crack down on bullying so hard that children are not given the opportunity to do it anymore, or enable victims to fight back by not suspending them.

When I was a kid there was one bully who teased me daily for months until finally I snapped and punched him square in the face and screamed bloody murder at him. He never bothered me again, and was not permanently harmed.

Our culture is becoming so wussy. You can't hit anyone without being charged with a crime, when sometimes physical confrontation is highly useful. Not only that, sometimes it is completely justified. Other parts of the world seem to understand this. Humans respond to intrusions placed upon their physical boundaries.

Letting young people experience the full backlash against their bullying quickly sorts them out. But all this hand holding and half-measures are so annoying to witness.

Yeah too many school admins are cowardly and send messages like "Wow only 30 minute detention or a 3 day vacation for wailing on that homo right in class. I should do this more often!"
 
Bullying... the new trendy social issue. How are we doing at addressing it?

I don't think any reasonable person would deny that bullying exists, but... are we properly addressing the issue or are we blowing it out of proportion?

Which type of bulling do you mean?
 
Bullying is human nature. There's nothing exclusively American about it.

Every culture I have met bullies in a different way and on different occasions.
 
Yeah too many school admins are cowardly and send messages like "Wow only 30 minute detention or a 3 day vacation for wailing on that homo right in class. I should do this more often!"

Well, for particularly vicious attacks, expulsion should always be an option. The stories I have been reading in the past 5-10 years about what kids are being expelled for it simply ridiculous. Horrible assaults continue to happen yet children are sent home for wearing certain t-shirts or accidentally bringing a butter knife to school.

I don't think education should be a right for children who are too violent or dysfunctional to avoid inflicting trauma on other students, especially when their parents are not doing their job at home. If parents want to slack off on raising their kids then they can enjoy having their child at home permanently when they attack other students. School is supposed to be a learning environment, not a battle ground. I'm all in favor of giving bullies whatever counselling they need to get over their issues, but quarantining them from harming people is just sane policy.

There's a difference between skirmishes and light physical conflicts that end up getting resolved and people move on with their lives. But some of these bullies are psycho, and the large class sizes combined with poor parenting means that the issue is being ignored.
 
Well, for particularly vicious attacks, expulsion should always be an option. The stories I have been reading in the past 5-10 years about what kids are being expelled for it simply ridiculous. Horrible assaults continue to happen yet children are sent home for wearing certain t-shirts or accidentally bringing a butter knife to school.

I don't think education should be a right for children who are too violent or dysfunctional to avoid inflicting trauma on other students, especially when their parents are not doing their job at home. If parents want to slack off on raising their kids then they can enjoy having their child at home permanently when they attack other students. School is supposed to be a learning environment, not a battle ground. I'm all in favor of giving bullies whatever counselling they need to get over their issues, but quarantining them from harming people is just sane policy.

There's a difference between skirmishes and light physical conflicts that end up getting resolved and people move on with their lives. But some of these bullies are psycho, and the large class sizes combined with poor parenting means that the issue is being ignored.

Yeah, i definitely agree that there's hysteria over things like 1st grader's 'gun shaped chicken tender' and 'political' t shirts that only reinforces my view of the adults' collective incompetence. Serious bullying is pretty simple to me. If the school can't provide a safe learning environment for all students, then don't bother pretending it's a school. Just shut it down.
 
I think kicking a bully's ass is about the most satisfying experience of ones life. I do understand that is not always possible. I would not want my kids to go to school in fear, and my boys were never in that situation. I think the idea this is a gay movement is silly.
 
To answer the OP, not nearly enough is being done to curb bullying. Schools now put up cutesy little posters, saying, "This is a BULLY FREE ZONE!1!!1" and "REPORT ALL BULLYING!" but they don't really want to do anything about it - at least none of the schools my girls have gone to. They want to brush the problems under the rug until some teenager jumps out a window, and then it's too late.
I can't speak about the schools you send your girls to, but the fact is schools are very limited in what they can do in response to bullying. Very little actual bullying is physical, the majority of it is mental. It's a mental situation perpetuated by the physical differences, but there is very little physical bullying which occus.

So, if you're a school, you're very limited in how you can handle it. If I see it, I handle it. But if I don't see it, what can I do? If a child reports it, we can talk to the other child but if they deny it, you can't discipline for that. And if they just say something to another kid, without really doing much else, the school is simply limited in their responses to that situation.

I'm not going to speak on whether it's right or not, I'm simply stating a fact. You cannot suspend a kid because he or she might have said something mean to another kid.
 
The Wolke et al (2013) study is among such studies to state that enough has not been made against bullying. They call for a total pull out from the thinking that "Bullying is a way of life" because it causes it does most damage to the players: Bully (i.e., psychopath), victims, and the more common bully-victims (i.e., former victims "taught" to be bullies from bullies). Damage continues to the adult life with risks more 6 times to be diagnosed with a serious illness, smoke regularly, maintain a job, or develop a psychiatric disorder.

The research assessed 1,420 participants four to six times between the ages of 9 and 16 years and adult outcomes between 24-26 years of age.

It may also be a cultural problem. I usually approach the bully with a simple question "What is a big fella like you doing around younger kids? What is your business here?" Really though, what is an older guys business with children? They should be with their peers!

References:

Wolke, D., Copeland, W. E., Angold, A., & Costello, E. J. (2013). Impact of bullying in childhood on adult health, wealth, crime, and social outcomes. Psychological Science, DOI: 10.1177/0956797613481608; Retrieved from: Far from being harmless, the effects of bullying last long into adulthood .
 
Quite often the parents themselves are adult bullies.

I remember a family in particular when my kids were growing up. They moved to town when my youngest was in 5th grade. We were friends with the school principal and he told me that when their kids would get in trouble... for some type of bullying, usually... the parents would stomp in and threaten lawsuits and the such if the school did any kind of disciplinary action.

Then the principle should have manned up and handed him a business card of the lawyer the school board uses.
Then say "seeing as you have brougth lawyers into this conversation, here is the name of ours. All communication between you and the school will be handled through them. Now leave my office".
 
I don't know how girls work these things, since female bullying is different, but I always found that, when I was bullied, a straight left to the eye was particularly effective. They beat the **** out of you, but they still had to go round with a 'shiner' administered by someone much smaller and weaker, so they tended to avoid you from then on, out of shame.
 
Though the means and methods of 'bullying' may have changed, the teaching of children to stand up for themselves shouldn't have.

Not everybody is nice in this world, or going to respect your feelings and make sure to not offend you. It seems a lot of kids have lost the ability to understand that, and have become overly sensitive to anything critical. Parents have become so overly protective that kids don't seem to know how to respond to bad names, being picked on for a physical flaw (in someone else's eyes) or ugly clothing.

Physical response should be the last option. But if necessary, it IS an option. And unfortunately, it is probably one of the most effective.

Voice of experience, and all that.
 
Bullying... the new trendy social issue. How are we doing at addressing it?

I don't think any reasonable person would deny that bullying exists, but... are we properly addressing the issue or are we blowing it out of proportion?

I voted "Other" since I don't know.

I'd love to see bullying addressed by peer groups in school. I remember reading about a high school football team who took a "different boy" under their wings to protect him from bullying. There are oh-so-valuable lessons to be learned by addressing real, live bullying. I would hope schools address it vigorously when they find it.

More importantly, if it's not specifically addressed by a school system, I would hope parents have the brain cells to carry it all the way to the school board when it effects their child. Teachers/administrators/janitors/office staff within every school should be mandatory reporters of bullying. Those who bully should be disciplined swiftly and firmly.

Public service films should be produced and shown in every school in the United States to teach youngsters one thing too many of them aren't born with: empathy. You can always spot a bullied child. They don't make eye contact, hug their books close to their chest and just try to get by. Sad.
 
If a bully is suspended for 15 days or fined 300 bucks that will make him(her?) think twice before the next bullying, imho.
Or may be 20 whips will do the job? :cool:

Not really. Getting his ass kicked will do the job. You meet force with greater force- to do otherwise is to concede to the bully's superiority.
 
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