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Is Homosexuality A Choice?

Is Homosexuality A Choice?

  • Yes

    Votes: 33 15.9%
  • No

    Votes: 136 65.7%
  • Maybe/Don't Know

    Votes: 38 18.4%

  • Total voters
    207
There is a lot of insistence that homosexuality is not a choice. There is, however, no conclusive evidence that some have no choice but we DO have conclusive evidence that some DO engage in homosexuality by choice. That doesn't give us a firm answer on anything but the preponderance of the evidence points to choice and we know for certain that at least some of the time it is a choice.

What evidence are you talking about?

Yeah, I'd like to know that too. I mean aside from gays forced to chose conformity due to social pressure (like keeping your job, church membership, and family ties), heterosexual experimentation in early pubescence, (both rational-choice behavior patterns)....and bisexuals who are merely acting on their innate orientation, what's your "preponderance of the evidence?"

The vast majority of homosexuals do not engage in hetrosexual conduct. This despite all social pressures and threats of real harm to the contrary. That evinces a pretty clear "preponderance of evidence" against your position.
 
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Yeah, I'd like to know that too. I mean aside from gays forced to chose conformity due to social pressure (like keeping your job, church membership, and family ties), heterosexual experimentation in early pubescence, and bisexuals....all rational behavior patterns (except Bi's who are merely acting on their innate orientation) what's your "preponderance of the evidence?"

The vast majority of homosexuals do not engage in hetrosexual conduct. This despite all social pressures and threats of real harm to the contrary. That evinces a pretty clear "preponderance of evidence" against your position.

What evidence? How about people admitting they made a choice. Hell, bisexuality proves choice. Homosexuality in prisons proves choice. The proof that it CAN be a choice is overwhelming. The proof that it isn't a choice is nonexistent. It's just a theory. Use Occam's razor to figure out the explanation.
 
You could say that they are gay. You can also create a new category called "Gay with X number of heterosexual episodes." Or you can call them bi. Or create a new category : "Bi with majority of lifespan living as gay."

There is no consensus among scientists about the exact reasons that an individual develops a heterosexual, bisexual, gay, or lesbian orientation. Although much research has examined the possible genetic, hormonal, developmental, social, and cultural influences on sexual orientation, no findings have emerged that permit scientists to conclude that sexual orientation is determined by any particular factor or factors. Many think that nature and nurture both play complex roles; most people experience little or no sense of choice about their sexual orientation

Sexual orientation, homosexuality and bisexuality
 
There is no consensus among scientists about the exact reasons that an individual develops a heterosexual, bisexual, gay, or lesbian orientation. Although much research has examined the possible genetic, hormonal, developmental, social, and cultural influences on sexual orientation, no findings have emerged that permit scientists to conclude that sexual orientation is determined by any particular factor or factors. Many think that nature and nurture both play complex roles; most people experience little or no sense of choice about their sexual orientation

Sexual orientation, homosexuality and bisexuality

From APA, I know. The part you put in bold, while factual, is not proof that applies to all cases. I suspect that statement is based on testimonials.

You didn't like the categories I suggested?
 
The examples are few: #1: Bisexuals. #2 Every time we changed a like to a dislike and vice versa. If future research discovers the differences among homo hetero and bi And proves a cause-effect relationship, and if it does so conclusively, I will accept it. Sheesh.
1. That bisexuals exist does not mean any choice is involved. It is just another category of sexual orientation, and they could just as well not be able to choose to only be attracted to one sex.
2. Attraction is not the same as a "like" or a "dislike." A like is something one prefers. An attraction is something that can potentially evoke such likes or dislikes.

Please show me actual evidence that sexual attraction is a choice. Actual studies, actual research, anything other than your own assertions.
 
People who said they did some exploring with same-sex or opposite-sex relationships in college (or whenever ).
Exploring different sexual relationships does not determine one's sexuality. Sexuality is an attraction. A gay man that had sex with women is not and was not straight.
 
What evidence? How about people admitting they made a choice. Hell, bisexuality proves choice. Homosexuality in prisons proves choice. The proof that it CAN be a choice is overwhelming. The proof that it isn't a choice is nonexistent. It's just a theory. Use Occam's razor to figure out the explanation.

Bisexuality does not prove choice. It is a distinct orientation too. Would YOU have sex with other men, consistently? Simply saying "I choose not to" isn't saying YOU are making a "choice" unless YOU also admit that YOU find men attractive, and admit YOU want and would have sex with them. Then maybe you can submit an excuse like you are in a committed marriage or you adhere to the teachings of a religious group to show you choose not to. (Clinton's "lust in my heart" defense).

Prison sex is mostly about POWER. That's how "straight" prisoners with no other outlet justify sex with subordinate males. Most of the time it is outright rape. The remainder of the time it is with open homosexuals who are considered a "convenience." It's still hardly a "choice" when you are facing 20 years to life with no other options.

What examples of "people admitting they made a choice" are you talking about? I can't address that point without clear examples.
 
From APA, I know. The part you put in bold, while factual, is not proof that applies to all cases. I suspect that statement is based on testimonials.

You didn't like the categories I suggested?

I think they are a waste of effort seeing that eing gay or whatever harms no one.
 
I think they are a waste of effort seeing that eing gay or whatever harms no one.
nether does some other different sexual preferences like bestiality and that still is outlawed and considered a mental illness then we have bigamy should that still remain illegal
 
nether does some other different sexual preferences like bestiality and that still is outlawed and considered a mental illness then we have bigamy should that still remain illegal

Ummmm, not quite. In the USA it is legal in AL, AS, DC, GU, HI, KY, MT, NV, NH, NJ, NM, MP, OH, TX, VT, VA, WV, WY. it is only a misdemeanor in AK, CA, CO, CT, FL, IA, KS, LA, ME, MD, MN, MO, NE, NY, ND, OR, PA, UT, VI, and WI.

It is also currently legal in Thailand, Sweden, Russia, Romania, Portugal, Poland, Philippines, Mexico, Italy, Japan, Hugary, Germany(?), Finland, Denmark, Canbodia, Brazil, and seveal states in Australia.

Just pointing this out without advocating it.

(?) about to become illegal in Germany.
 
1. That bisexuals exist does not mean any choice is involved. It is just another category of sexual orientation, and they could just as well not be able to choose to only be attracted to one sex.
2. Attraction is not the same as a "like" or a "dislike." A like is something one prefers. An attraction is something that can potentially evoke such likes or dislikes.

Please show me actual evidence that sexual attraction is a choice. Actual studies, actual research, anything other than your own assertions.

Refer to the first sentence in post #378. (Anything other than my own assertion.)

Regarding #2... likes and dislikes of the same thing can flip flop over the course of a life time.
 
Bisexuality does not prove choice. It is a distinct orientation too.

That's the narrative we're hearing in an effort to deflect attention from the obvious reality that choice is involved. Sure, it's convenient to argue that if someone has sex with the opposite sex for the first 30 years of their life and then decides to switch sides that it's not really a choice, but that's bull****. It's clearly a choice. Someone that engages in sex indiscrimately, male or female isn't just someone that has "their own unique sexual orientation", it's someone that CHOOSES which gender for sexual intercourse and changes their mind multiple times. And I know a woman who told me they became bisexual just because they'd had it with men and their ****. That's a choice. My brother has had sex with women, but he is a militant homosexual activist. He has told me in the past that he decided as a teenager to reject the heterosexual mommy/daddy model of relationships and would never do such a thing. He denies that now because it's convenient, but what's strange is that he supports gay marriage which mimics the very model he rejected. Not that he's actually interested in marriage, of course. It's just that it is a blow for "gay rights" and a way to stick a thumb in the eye of "the evangelicals" for whom he has a raging hatred.

I tend to think that some people are so... well, let's just say that it's reasonable to assume they were always going to end up being flaming homosexuals. I'm inclined to believe for some it may not be a choice. I know for a fact, however, that for some, it WAS a choice. For some it was just sex and going the route of homosexuality just suited the rebel in them. What they screw isn't as important as how often they get laid and how much it might freak out their parents or "polite society".

To say that choice isn't in play is to deny reality - or maybe to just be ignorant of reality.
 
Exploring different sexual relationships does not determine one's sexuality. Sexuality is an attraction. A gay man that had sex with women is not and was not straight.

Btu during that semester that she was exploring with lesbian relationships, if I asked her, why did you hook-up with Mary? She might answer, " I find her attractive."
 
That's the narrative we're hearing in an effort to deflect attention from the obvious reality that choice is involved. Sure, it's convenient to argue that if someone has sex with the opposite sex for the first 30 years of their life and then decides to switch sides that it's not really a choice, but that's bull****. It's clearly a choice.

People will say that the person was gay all along, just repressing the drive. Or that the person is bisexual. I do not believe that bisexual should be a distinct orientation.
 
nether does some other different sexual preferences like bestiality and that still is outlawed and considered a mental illness then we have bigamy should that still remain illegal

We are talking about legally consenting adults
 
Exploring different sexual relationships does not determine one's sexuality. Sexuality is an attraction. A gay man that had sex with women is not and was not straight.

then maybe you explain why is it listed as a mantal disorder according to the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders and not homesexuality
 
We are talking about legally consenting adults

animals especially dogs are very willing partners
I could show you proof but will be in violation of forum rules doing so
 
At this point, who cares? The SC has caved in to the Left, and by this time next year, who knows how far gay activists will have plunged into everyone else's lives?
 
Refer to the first sentence in post #378. (Anything other than my own assertion.)

Regarding #2... likes and dislikes of the same thing can flip flop over the course of a life time.
1. That statement doesn't pertain to choice, it pertains to cause (nature vs. nurture). And clicking on the link suggests that choice is not involved. You are only bolstering my case here.
2. I just argued that attraction is not the same thing as a like or a dislike. Repeating that likes can change isn't relevant to that point.
 
1. That statement doesn't pertain to choice, it pertains to cause (nature vs. nurture). And clicking on the link suggests that choice is not involved. You are only bolstering my case here.
2. I just argued that attraction is not the same thing as a like or a dislike. Repeating that likes can change isn't relevant to that point.

Suggesting that choice is not involved is not evidence. It's an assertion. Choice is a cause.

How is attraction different from a like or dislike?
 
animals especially dogs are very willing partners
I could show you proof but will be in violation of forum rules doing so

Ill pass on that amazing though that you would even be willing to search that **** out
 
Btu during that semester that she was exploring with lesbian relationships, if I asked her, why did you hook-up with Mary? She might answer, " I find her attractive."
So what? Finding someone attractive is different than being attracted to them. And even if that is what she meant, then she may be lesbian or she may be bi, assuming she is being honest.
 
Suggesting that choice is not involved is not evidence. It's an assertion. Choice is a cause.

How is attraction different from a like or dislike?
You're the one who pointed to that post, and the post suggested the opposite of what you claim. Show me the evidence that attraction is a choice. Why is this so hard? Is it perhaps because there is no such evidence?

I already explained how attraction is different than like. If you aren't going to bother reading my posts, then don't bother responding to them.
 
You're the one who pointed to that post, and the post suggested the opposite of what you claim. Show me the evidence that attraction is a choice. Why is this so hard? Is it perhaps because there is no such evidence?

I already explained how attraction is different than like. If you aren't going to bother reading my posts, then don't bother responding to them.

Sorry I've got my hands full here- cooking dinner, feeding the baby, making sure the 6 yr old is busy and carrying out my wife's instructions.

I disagree that there is a difference b/w like and attraction. i think the processes that occur when I decide I like coffee or my mother-in-law are the same as those that occur when i decide I like gay sex.

The first sentence is post 378 should be the answer to both of our assertions.

Obviously you want evidence. This is your trump card. If I can't play a more powerful card, then you win. Right? I have already described how exposure over time can lead to attraction where initially none was present. --in terms of coffee, movies and fat girls. I think it also applies to sexual attraction. If there really and truly was absolutely, positively no stigma Ever! regarding homosexuality, then I think we'd all be close friends.
 
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