• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Can you call yourself Christian and be Pro Abortion/Choice?

Can you call yourself Christian and be Pro Abortion/Choice?

  • Yes

    Votes: 38 79.2%

  • No

    Votes: 10 20.8%
  • Total voters
    48
Southern Belle said:
Now I have to very much agree with this, so... I don't know if those who really accepted Christ as their savior - and only God and that person would know for certain - would actually WANT to abort babies at the drop of a hat (actually when I first answered, I was thinking extreme circumstances where the mother was sure to die) but yhe people who did abortions could always come to Christ when they were ready, and I at least hope they would quit using it as birth control...
Click to expand...

I think very few people would argue where if a woman does not have and abortion her life is endangered..........But I would expect of the 40,000,000 abortions performed since 1972 maybe a couple of million were performed because the mothers life was endangered........
 
Navy Pride said:
But you were responding to a post where I said I got my beliefs from my Catholic religion..........

Try again........
Click to expand...

And, not saying anything against the church, but against YOU. I stated that you (OR ANYBODY) should believe everything they are told (BY ANYONE).

Why is that so hard to understand?
Do I need to make a Navy marching cadence out of it for ya?
 
Navy Pride said:
You know although I am a practicing Catholic I am not a good one and am not really comfortable arguing religion.
Click to expand...

Then why did you create this thread?

Navy Pride said:
I am a person of faith though and believe the precepts of Jesus Christ as taught to me by the Roman Catholic Church can never be wrong.
Click to expand...

Interesting, because most Christians believe that *Jesus* is infallible, not their church. You don't accept the possibility that the Catholic Church could ever get it wrong? If you acknowledge that the Church once supported those atrocities I listed before, what makes you think that the CURRENT incarnation of the Catholic Church has finally attained perfect knowledge of Jesus' beliefs?
 
Navy Pride said:
You know although I am a practicing Catholic I am not a good one and am not really comfortable arguing religion.
Click to expand...
Why then, did you start a thread discussing religion?

I am a person of faith though and believe the precepts of Jesus Christ as taught to me by the Roman Catholic Church can never be wrong..........
Click to expand...
So, the Church can never be wrong, thats what you are saying. I ask you to refer again to the earlier mentioned list of slights by the Catholic Church and ask your self if the church was in the right position on those issues.

Now I have a question for you......Why do you insist on identyfying yourself as slightly Conservative when you are one of the biggest Liberals in this forum..........:confused: Just curious.......
Click to expand...
Although not addressed to me this would be what is considered an ad hominem. Very poor debate tactics.
 
Navy Pride said:
Attack me again huh.........Nope your wrong Abortions are much more prevelent such Roe V Wade was enacted in 1972........Hopefully we can get rid of that murderous law shortly........
Click to expand...

So, your trying to say that in the thousands of years (just of documented hisotry), that when there was never any laws forbiding or allowing abortions, abortions didn't happen. But suddenly when a court decision comes out stating that the states can't pass a law forbiding such an act, suddenly everyone runs out and decides that abortions are necessary.

Do you think that suddenly in the 1970s something triggered in the brain of every woman that if they don't want thier baby they will just stop it from growing furthur? Do you think that women (or men) NEVER thought of that before 1972?

Is this really so hard to understand? :roll:
 
Kandahar said:
Then why did you create this thread?



Interesting, because most Christians believe that *Jesus* is infallible, not their church. You don't accept the possibility that the Catholic Church could ever get it wrong? If you acknowledge that the Church once supported those atrocities I listed before, what makes you think that the CURRENT incarnation of the Catholic Church has finally attained perfect knowledge of Jesus' beliefs?
Click to expand...

1. Because I wanted to get others opinions on the subject...........

2. The Catholic Church follows the teachings of Jesus Christ and believes all life is sacred

3. I don't believe any true Christian supports attrocities or abortions performed for convenience or as a means of birth control........
 
2. The Catholic Church follows the teachings of Jesus Christ and believes all life is sacred
Click to expand...

Are you pro-death penalty? :lol:

3. I don't believe any true Christian supports attrocities or abortions performed for convenience or as a means of birth control........
Click to expand...

I have a question. If your wife gets raped and she is impregnated with the bastard seed of some rapist. Would you allow her to have an abortion? And if by some redneck mistake the man who raped her was later sentenced to death would you support it?
 
Hatuey said:
Are you pro-death penalty? :lol:



I have a question. If your wife gets raped and she is impregnated with the bastard seed of some rapist. Would you allow her to have an abortion? And if by some redneck mistake the man who raped her was later sentenced to death would you support it?
Click to expand...

1. Yeah I am............A person that is sentenced to death has committed a horrible crime against another human being.......The innocent defenseless baby in the womb has committed no crime..........It just wants the same chance at life you got............

2. I would hope my wife would carry the baby to term but I would understand and support her if she chose to abort.........I consider that a case where a womans life could be endangered and she might commit suicide.....Again the baby conceived is innocent....

What amazes me about you liberals is you have all the compassion in the world for murderers and rapists who commit horrific crimes and none for the innocent defenseless baby in the womb...........

Shame on you.........
 
Navy Pride said:
1. Yeah I am............A person that is sentenced to death has committed a horrible crime against another human being.......The innocent defenseless baby in the womb has committed no crime..........It just wants the same chance at life you got............
Click to expand...

Let's see here...

You claim that the Catholic Church is never wrong, and perfectly reflects the views of Jesus. The Catholic Church is opposed to the death penalty. Therefore, according to your own belief system, you are defying your god. Right?

Navy Pride said:
2. I would hope my wife would carry the baby to term but I would understand and support her if she chose to abort.........I consider that a case where a womans life could be endangered and she might commit suicide.....Again the baby conceived is innocent....
Click to expand...

Ah, I see. So you believe abortion is murder, but you would understand your wife murdering an innocent person. But if anyone else did it, they've committed a horrible crime against another human being and should be put to death. You're funny. :lol:

Navy Pride said:
What amazes me about you liberals is you have all the compassion in the world for murderers and rapists who commit horrific crimes and none for the innocent defenseless baby in the womb...........

Shame on you.........
Click to expand...

What amazes me about you self-righteous moralists is that you have all the compassion in the world for a two-celled organism that happens to have human DNA, and none for actual sentient human beings.

Shame on you.
 
You claim that the Catholic Church is never wrong, and perfectly reflects the views of Jesus. The Catholic Church is opposed to the death penalty. Therefore, according to your own belief system, you are defying your god. Right?
Click to expand...

Yeah I am...........I told you when it comes to my religion I have my shortcomings.........

Ah, I see. So you believe abortion is murder, but you would understand your wife murdering an innocent person. But if anyone else did it, they've committed a horrible crime against another human being and should be put to death. You're funny
Click to expand...

Again you have to read the whole statement.......If I thought carrying the baby to term might affect her mentally then I would consider that the mothers life being endangered........

What amazes me about you self-righteous moralists is that you have all the compassion in the world for a two-celled organism that happens to have human DNA, and none for actual sentient human beings.
Click to expand...

Wrong again/still/always............Most Christians believe that life begins at conception and that clump of cells as you call it to satisfy your guilt for okaying butcering in the womb and so you can sleep better at night.....

I don't know if you a man/woman of faith or not but if you are some day you will have to stand in front of your maker and explain your outrageous beliefs about the unborn.....
 
Navy Pride said:
I don't know if you a man/woman of faith or not but if you are some day you will have to stand in front of your maker and explain your outrageous beliefs about the unborn.....
Click to expand...


As will you....for Capital Punishment

Personally, I'm glad God understands me.....she has no problem with me accepting both.
 
tecoyah said:
As will you....for Capital Punishment

Personally, I'm glad God understands me.....she has no problem with me accepting both.
Click to expand...

For once your right.............

I think if a member of your family was viciously raped or murdered you might have a different apinion on the death penalty..............Especially if the perk had committed that crime in the past and been let out of prison by some liberal judge to do it to a member of your family..........

You holier then thou attitude might do a 180.......
 
Navy Pride said:
For once your right.............

I think if a member of your family was viciously raped or murdered you might have a different apinion on the death penalty..............Especially if the perk had committed that crime in the past and been let out of prison by some liberal judge to do it to a member of your family..........

You holier then thou attitude might do a 180.......
Click to expand...


Dude....can you even Freakin' READ.

Surely even you cannot be this dense....Try looking again.
 
Navy Pride said:
I don't know if you a man/woman of faith or not but if you are some day you will have to stand in front of your maker and explain your outrageous beliefs about the unborn.....
And if they're not 'of faith'?
For someone that calls themself a 'christian', you are extremely judgemental about others.
Navy Pride said:
If I thought carrying the baby to term might affect her mentally then I would consider that the mothers life being endangered
Click to expand...
Then I would have to make the assumption that YOU know that everyone else never has a mental affect from their predictament. Only your wife would have one, therefore making her decision to abort absolutely ok with you. Seems a tad hypocritical....
Navy Pride said:
You holier then thou attitude might do a 180.......
Click to expand...
The only 'holier than thou' attitude here, sir, has been yours, as to be so presumptuous as to think you know not only what's best for everyone, but what everyone else thinks as well.
Click to expand...
 
tecoyah said:
Dude....can you even Freakin' READ.

Surely even you cannot be this dense....Try looking again.
Click to expand...


You read again.............Name is navy Pride not Dude...Got it..........
 
OK, Navypride....if you would please, re-read my comment and you will see it clearly states I have no issue with the death penalty, whereas you seem to state I do. Perhaps you simply misunderstood the post, and might gain insight from a second glance Old Chap.
 
tecoyah said:
OK, Navypride....if you would please, re-read my comment and you will see it clearly states I have no issue with the death penalty, whereas you seem to state I do. Perhaps you simply misunderstood the post, and might gain insight from a second glance Old Chap.
Click to expand...

OK I apologize........It wasn't you that made the horrific comparison between murder in the womb and the death penalty............

You have to understand I am fighting the good fight against Liberalism in about 4 threads at one time.........
 
Navy Pride said:
You have to understand I am fighting the good fight against Liberalism in about 4 threads at one time.........
Click to expand...

You sure do a lot of fighting.
http://www.debatepolitics.com/search.php?searchid=140011

You can call yourself Christian and believe anything you want. However, you must believe in two things:
1. Jesus died for your sins and rised three days later.
2. Believe in God.

That's all you need to be Christian, though certain denominations have more requirements.
 
Navy Pride said:
[/B]

Bingo!!!!!
Click to expand...

So the end result is you can call yourself Christian and be Pro-choice only if you don't consider yourself a certain denomination of Christian that happens to be against abortions.

Is that right?
 
Gibberish said:
So the end result is you can call yourself Christian and be Pro-choice only if you don't consider yourself a certain denomination of Christian that happens to be against abortions.

Is that right?
Click to expand...


Bingo!!!!.......heh
 
Navy Pride said:
Yeah I am...........I told you when it comes to my religion I have my shortcomings.........
Click to expand...

So why can you disagree with the Catholic Church on the death penalty and still be Christian, but others can't disagree with the Catholic Church on abortion and still be Christian?

If you had bothered to read the Bible before self-righteously condemning others, you might note Jesus said that you should remove the log from your own eye before trying to remove the speck from your neighbor's. In other words, don't start condemning others for beliefs that you perceive to be "un-Christian" unless your OWN beliefs are totally pure.

Navy Pride said:
Again you have to read the whole statement.......If I thought carrying the baby to term might affect her mentally then I would consider that the mothers life being endangered........
Click to expand...

But regardless of whether it would affect her mentally, you would "understand" her murdering what you consider to be an innocent human being.

Navy Pride said:
Wrong again/still/always............Most Christians believe that life begins at conception and that clump of cells as you call it to satisfy your guilt for okaying butcering in the womb and so you can sleep better at night.....
Click to expand...

What most Christians believe has little bearing on what Jesus would have believed, or on what you can believe and still be a Christian.
 
Mary set out with hate to a Judean town in the hill country where she entered the house of Zechariah and greeted Elizabeth. When Elizabeth heard Mary’s greeting, the child leapt in her womb. And Elizabeth was filled with the Holy spirit and exclaimed with a loud cry, “Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb. And why has this happened to me, that the mother of my Lord comes to me? For as soon as I heard the sound of your greeting, the child in my womb leapt for joy. And blessed is she who believed that there would be a fulfilment of what was spoken to her by the Lord.”



Assuming one IS Christian one cannot deny the "Spirit" hence one cannot call themselves Christians and be Pro Abortion/Choice! The destruction of the Spirit filled child would therefore be a self defeating hypocrisy.
 
Spencer Collins said:
Mary set out with hate to a Judean town in the hill country where she entered the house of Zechariah and greeted Elizabeth. When Elizabeth heard Mary’s greeting, the child leapt in her womb. And Elizabeth was filled with the Holy spirit and exclaimed with a loud cry, “Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb. And why has this happened to me, that the mother of my Lord comes to me? For as soon as I heard the sound of your greeting, the child in my womb leapt for joy. And blessed is she who believed that there would be a fulfilment of what was spoken to her by the Lord.”



Assuming one IS Christian one cannot deny the "Spirit" hence one cannot call themselves Christians and be Pro Abortion/Choice! The destruction of the Spirit filled child would therefore be a self defeating hypocrisy.
Click to expand...

"Child" in the context above essentially means "offspring." The Aramatheans didn't have another word for it, and the translations are not perfect as it is. The part about "leaping for joy" is obviously a metaphor, since fetuses don't react emotionally to external events.

The only Bible passage that even comes close to addressing abortion is this primitive law:

"If men strive, and hurt a woman with child, so that her fruit depart from her, and yet no mischief follow: he shall be surely punished according as the woman's husband will lay upon him; and he shall pay as the judges determine. And if any mischief follow, then thou shalt give life for life, Eye for eye, tooth for tooth."--Ex. 21:22-25

In other words, in ancient Israel, if a man hurts a pregnant woman and causes a miscarriage, he is only fined. But if he kills the woman, he is killed. In other words, a fetus clearly was NOT the equivalent to a human being in this society.

I realize that not all Christians accept the laws of the Old Testament, which is fine. But that's the only thing that even relates to abortion in the Bible. The New Testament is even less sympathetic to the anti-choice crowd. Abortion is not mentioned or implied a single time.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom