• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

When the issue is gay marriage who are the intolerant ones?

When the issue is gay marriage who are the intolerant one?

  • Total voters
    45
hallam said:
My argument is the the GRM movement have to talk about "rights" because talking about taxes makes this less sexy. And because they talk about "rights" instead of taxes they are dishonest. Again, I would be for the gay marriage if the people I see on TV actually talked about why they they want marriage instead of talking about "rights." Like in most things, this is about money.
Click to expand...

So the fact that you think the SSM issue is all about money and the question of "rights" just a deflection is the sole reason you don't support something you would otherwise be for ? ......................
 
AmericanWoman76 said:
Everyone you disagree with means "money" when they say "love" , huh. Or maybe money is all you can hear because money is all you can love.
Click to expand...

The government isn't necessary to sanction love though. If a relationship is just for love, then marriage sanctioned by the government isn't a necessity and there for your argument for marriage if flawed and inappropriate. You can be in a committed loving relationship for years, even decades, as some people who are homosexual have shown without having the government sanction the relationship.
 
Bonzai said:
So the fact that you think the SSM issue is all about money and the question of "rights" just a deflection is the sole reason you don't support something you would otherwise be for ? ......................
Click to expand...

Yep....I am generally against dishonest people as a rule. I don't support arguments which are dishonest. it is the reason I don't support the Tea Party...same type of dishonesty just inverted.

Mind you, I am aware that my support is tiny compared to the movement as a whole.
 
hallam said:
The government isn't necessary to sanction love though. If a relationship is just for love, then marriage sanctioned by the government isn't a necessity and there for your argument for marriage if flawed and inappropriate. You can be in a committed loving relationship for years, even decades, as some people who are homosexual have shown without having the government sanction the relationship.
Click to expand...

Oh well then how about we just outlaw all the marriages since nobody needs marriage. Funny how nobody who's anti-gay marriage wants to outlaw all marriages. They all want to hang on to the institution of marriage because they know it's necessary, they just don't want everyone to be treated equally.
 
AmericanWoman76 said:
Oh well then how about we just outlaw all the marriages since nobody needs marriage. Funny how nobody who's anti-gay marriage wants to outlaw all marriages. They all want to hang on to the institution of marriage because they know it's necessary, they just don't want everyone to be treated equally.
Click to expand...

I am actually for this. Married filing jointly and estate tax exemptions should apply to all or they should be removed. Further, if the governmental reasons for the tax incentives are for promotion of stable families and kids, then those things should be applied to the kids themselves or stable families and they shouldn't apply to all families.

I am totally against just extending this to homosexuals though. All the arguments for gay marriage apply to poly marriages (for consenting adults) as well so if we are going to extend it then we should really destroy the discrimination and apply it to all family types. Or we should remove governmental marriage completely.
 
Last edited:
hallam said:
Yep....I am generally against dishonest people as a rule. I don't support arguments which are dishonest. it is the reason I don't support the Tea Party...same type of dishonesty just inverted.

Mind you, I am aware that my support is tiny compared to the movement as a whole.
Click to expand...

So, by extension, all gay people who want to get married are just lying moneygrubbers ? Why would you even consider supporting a group whom you have tested and found to be nothing but a bunch of lying moneygrubbers ? Help me understand this crucial divide between lying moneygrubbers and open moneygrubbers, since you have ascertained that all are just "moneygrubbers" anyway..................
 
AmericanWoman76 said:
Oh well then how about we just outlaw all the marriages since nobody needs marriage. Funny how nobody who's anti-gay marriage wants to outlaw all marriages. They all want to hang on to the institution of marriage because they know it's necessary, they just don't want everyone to be treated equally.
Click to expand...

Isn't it liberals who support gay marriage who push inequality in the end though?

I think if you were to poll modern Republicans they would say unanimously that tax rates, inheritance laws, etc. should all be applied equally regardless of income, occupation, gender, race, etc. It seems to me that it's mostly the people who fall into the pro-gay marriage camp who want different standards for different people but want to make sure they're in the group getting the better standard.
 
Last edited:
Bonzai said:
So, by extension, all gay people who want to get married are just lying moneygrubbers ? Why would you even consider supporting a group whom you have tested and found to be nothing but a bunch of lying moneygrubbers ? Help me understand this crucial divide between lying moneygrubbers and open moneygrubbers, since you have ascertained that all are just "moneygrubbers" anyway..................
Click to expand...

If you want to call the people talking about this dishonest movement "lying moneygrubbers" fine. It seems like an unnecessary inflamitory term (I would guess you plan to use for some type of indignation about my arguments) but those are your words and you are free to use them. I have no malice here either way. I am only saying that this movement is about taxes. The cases are about taxes. They are not about love; they are not about child adoption; and they are not about hospital visitation. Because they are about taxes, the movement should use that word. Until they do, they are dishonest.

So I guess it would be obvious that the crucial divide/distinction I am making is about the lying and dishonesty.
 
hallam said:
If you want to call the people talking about this dishonest movement "lying moneygrubbers" fine. It seems like an unnecessary inflamitory term (I would guess you plan to use for some type of indignation about my arguments) but those are your words and you are free to use them. I have no malice here either way. I am only saying that this movement is about taxes. The cases are about taxes. They are not about love; they are not about child adoption; and they are not about hospital visitation. Because they are about taxes, the movement should use that word. Until they do, they are dishonest.

So I guess it would be obvious that the crucial divide/distinction I am making is about the lying and dishonesty.
Click to expand...



One could argue that all conservatives are lying about caring about abortion and family values and the whole thing is about having power over people............................
 
This poll sucks.
Its the people that are against gay marriage that are the intolerant ones.
 
Navy Pride said:
Here is what I believe when it comes to gay rights........I believe in equal rights for all Americans that includes gays.....I don't care what gays do when it comes to marriage but I believe the definition of marriage should be a union between a man and a woman and that should not change...Gays can call their union anything else they want to. They already stole the definition of the word gay...That is my opinion but gays and flaming liberals think I have no right to that opinion...They think because I believe as I do that I am a bigot or homophobe. I am not allowed to have my own opinion if it disagrees with theirs...Now I ask you who are the intolerant ones?
Click to expand...

You still are.
 
Bonzai said:
One could argue that all conservatives are lying about caring about abortion and family values and the whole thing is about having power over people............................
Click to expand...

One could especially since anti-abortion groups rarely talk about child care after birth. The abortion debates are generally dishonest on both sides, imho. But what I try not to do is compare gay rights to abortion as this can conflate issues quickly that are inappropriate.
 
hallam said:
One could especially since anti-abortion groups rarely talk about child care after birth. The abortion debates are generally dishonest on both sides, imho. But what I try not to do is compare gay rights to abortion as this can conflate issues quickly that are inappropriate.
Click to expand...

I am presently working on a will with my partner because I personally feel "marriage" is a substandard form of relationship.............
 
Bonzai said:
One could argue that all conservatives are lying about caring about abortion and family values and the whole thing is about having power over people............................
Click to expand...

And that would be one dumb argument. You are the perfect example of intolerance.


Now back you go on ignore.
 
Navy Pride said:
Here is what I believe when it comes to gay rights........I believe in equal rights for all Americans that includes gays.....I don't care what gays do when it comes to marriage but I believe the definition of marriage should be a union between a man and a woman and that should not change...Gays can call their union anything else they want to. They already stole the definition of the word gay...That is my opinion but gays and flaming liberals think I have no right to that opinion...They think because I believe as I do that I am a bigot or homophobe. I am not allowed to have my own opinion if it disagrees with theirs...Now I ask you who are the intolerant ones?
Click to expand...

I do not think one is intolerant for expressing his views on gay marriage, either for or against. Intolerance would be trying to shut up one side or the other. Intolerance would be trying to force ones own view on someone else. As it stands now, in 9 states gay marriage is legal, I would wager in 5 years that number will have doubled. In 10 years the number of states recognizing gay marriages will have doubled again. Let this play out state by state, gay marriages is winning.
 
Viktyr Gehrig said:
The people who are opposed to equal rights for gays-- and yes, that includes marriage-- are the intolerant ones. Period, full stop. It's stupid this is even a question.
Click to expand...

Yep, this. Nothing else is the right answer.
 
Perotista said:
I do not think one is intolerant for expressing his views on gay marriage, either for or against. Intolerance would be trying to shut up one side or the other. Intolerance would be trying to force ones own view on someone else. As it stands now, in 9 states gay marriage is legal, I would wager in 5 years that number will have doubled. In 10 years the number of states recognizing gay marriages will have doubled again. Let this play out state by state, gay marriages is winning.
Click to expand...



How many red states support SSM? Its easy to get the blue ones.
 
Your Star said:
Yep, this. Nothing else is the right answer.
Click to expand...

Its amazing that you on the left are so intolerant that you won't even let anyone who disagrees with you have and opinion. I let you havr one why don't you pay me the same courtesy?
 
Navy Pride said:
OK sports fans what do you think, Please explain your choice. Thanks for participating.
Click to expand...

When ssm supporters try to deny heterosexuals the right to marry their opposite sex partners, they are the intolerant ones.

When ssm opponents try to deny homosexuals the right to marry their same sex partners, they are the intolerant ones.

So far, I would say the ssm opponents are winning the "who is the most intolerant" race by a mind boggling margin. Huge.
 
Level of tolerance is an individual achievement, not necessarily one of ideology (yet). I think those who attempt to delegitimize opposition rather than disagreeing with it are demonstrating intolerance.
 
Dezaad said:
When ssm supporters try to deny heterosexuals the right to marry their opposite sex partners, they are the intolerant ones.

When ssm opponents try to deny homosexuals the right to marry their same sex partners, they are the intolerant ones.

So far, I would say the ssm opponents are winning the "who is the most intolerant" race by a mind boggling margin. Huge.
Click to expand...

I don't want to deny you gays anything...I just don't want to change the definition of marriage.
 
Navy Pride said:
I don't want to deny you gays anything...I just don't want to change the definition of marriage.
Click to expand...

Changing the state's definition of marriage isn't intolerant, unless you are trying to deny people the right to marry by the way you are defining it.

You can maintain your own intolerant definition of marriage, but the state's definition is changing to be more tolerant. The state choosing one definition among the infinite number of definitions possible isn't intolerant to those who merely disagree with that definition.

You are trying to claim the mantle of victim because you honestly think its a game, like capture the flag or something, and whoever is called victim wins the argument. But, being victimized by the denial of rights has real consequences, often detrimental, in the lives of people who are truly victimized. It isn't a game, Navy, these are real people with real lives and who are really harmed by people like you. Give it up.
 
Navy Pride said:

Its amazing that you on the left are so intolerant that you won't even let anyone who disagrees with you have and opinion. I let you havr one why don't you pay me the same courtesy?
Click to expand...

You are entitled to your opinion Navy. What you are NOT entitled to is forcing others to live within your bigoted world. Your right to your opinion ceases when it DIRECTLY impinges on the rights of another person. In other words, you have every right to live in your own bigoted world. However, you do not have the right to impose that on others.
 
Navy Pride said:
Here is what I believe when it comes to gay rights........I believe in equal rights for all Americans that includes gays.....I don't care what gays do when it comes to marriage but I believe the definition of marriage should be a union between a man and a woman and that should not change...Gays can call their union anything else they want to. They already stole the definition of the word gay...That is my opinion but gays and flaming liberals think I have no right to that opinion...They think because I believe as I do that I am a bigot or homophobe. I am not allowed to have my own opinion if it disagrees with theirs...Now I ask you who are the intolerant ones?
Click to expand...

So you are just concerned about the word "marriage"....


I had a debate/conversation with someone about this...I feel it should be all or nothing with marriage. Either you give the rights and privileges to all married couples or none of them...straight or gay.

Personally, I think the government should have nothing to do with marriage
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom