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Do you believe in flying saucers?

Do you believe in flying saucers?

  • Total voters
    39
Navy Pride said:
What do you think?
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I think it's possible, but I've only ever seen one incident which led me to believe the alien phenomenon may be real. I do have friends who report otherwise unexplainable events, and it lends credence to the possibility.
 
wolfie said:
zgoldsmith23 said:
Our knowledge may be limited, but that doesn't mean they exist. To date, I've read zero journals regarding flying saucer verificatio

I don't believe in flying saucers..

I was lying on my back in the woods staring at the sky..

A bright light darted across the sky....then stopped...hovered..and took off again at an amazing rate..

was it a flying saucer...naah!!
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What do you think it was?
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specklebang said:
...and you know this to be a fact how? There are an estimated 300 billion stars in our relatively minor galaxy. There are an estimated 17 billion "earth size" planets. Pirate MK and Specklebang claim to be from Mars, which is just a short ride away - are you calling us liars?
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The Oakland Raiders use to have a huge tackle and when asked qhat college he attended he said the University of Mars.:lol:
 
Dr. Chuckles said:
Seems like you're appealing to ignorance. Being that the amount of the universe we have explored is extremely small (the amount of potential evidence we have reviewed doesn't lend itself to a "reasonable" declaration on the matter), especially when we are talking about individual planets and possible eco-systems on those planets.
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Yes, we've explored an infinitesimally small percentage of the universe. That doesn't mean that any claims go as they could be true somewhere else. Scientists do base the way they think on evidence - it's time they put up or shut up. If you had evidence of them, it would probably be gladly accepted as most people want to know whether there is something else looking back at us through the telescope.
 
zgoldsmith23 said:
Yes, we've explored an infinitesimally small percentage of the universe. That doesn't mean that any claims go as they could be true somewhere else. Scientists do base the way they think on evidence - it's time they put up or shut up. If you had evidence of them, it would probably be gladly accepted as most people want to know whether there is something else looking back at us through the telescope.
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But you need to actually have evidence to make a rational assesment of it. You're skipping that important step

Its like some primitive making an assessment about the ocean when he hasn't seen anything beyond it surface

There is nothing scientific or rational about what you are doing here
 
Traveling 186,000 EARTH MILES PER SECOND (speed of light) for 25 THOUSAND EARTH YEARS would get you to the center of our own galaxy.

Space crafts capable of traveling from even just the opposite side of our own galaxy couldn't be at all like the current collective mindset is regarding potential designs of alien crafts.

I say that because even if we could create a craft that travels 100 times faster than the speed of light (18,600,000 earth miles per second), it still take 250 earth years to get to the center of the Milky Way Galaxy.

Traveling at the speed of light is going about 17 trillion miles in one earth year. To put 1 trillion into perspective. 1 trillion earth seconds equals about 32,000 earth years.

Somebody traveling to this planet either needs to pack a hell of a lunch...or simply think where one wants to be....and be there. A craft of any kind would be a drag.
 
winston53660 said:
I don't think we are alone in the universe
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At the risk of sounding like a nut job, I don't think we're alone int he universe either, based on what I've read in the Bible. I happen to think however is just like there are spectrum of light not visible to us, whatever else is out these is usually not perceivable and/or is "other dimensional." Science knows about dark matter, for example. Just because we haven't "discovered" it yet, doesn't mean something does not exist.

In my understanding of the Bible there could be 3 universes referred to as "heavens" in the Bible, where life exists. They are possibly interrelated with some limited movement between them. People on earth seeing them might think of it as extra-terrestrial, flying saucers, whatever.

-2 Kings 6:17. Using the vocabulary of 9 BC advanced mechanical transport vehicles might be described as horses and chariots of fire.
-2 Corinthians 12:2 The Apostle Paul talked about being teleported to the Third Heaven (I personally think means third universe). If there's a third heaven, logic dictates there must be a first and second heaven.
-Daniel 10 discusses a dialog the ancient prophet Daniel had with what many think was a being sent form the Third Heaven or universe to Daniel in our universe. It took weeks for the being to get to Daniel because of active opposition he had to fight through possibly in the second heaven.
 
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Dr. Chuckles said:
But you need to actually have evidence to make a rational assesment of it. You're skipping that important step

Its like some primitive making an assessment about the ocean when he hasn't seen anything beyond it surface

There is nothing scientific or rational about what you are doing here
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It's perfectly rational to declare things of which there is no evidence for, and claims against their existence have been disproven, not to exist. It would be irrational to claim there's absolutely no way in hell they CAN exist. There's a difference.
 
zgoldsmith23 said:
It's perfectly rational to declare things of which there is no evidence for
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yes, after you reviewed a reasonable amount of evidence. Here, there was no reviewing a reasonable amount of evidence. Hence, you are making a declaration from ignorence


and claims against their existence have been disproven, not to exist.
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If someone claims life exists on a pacific island, and is proven wrong, that doesn't establishes that life doesn't exist on other 100 island in the region, especially when they contain completely different characteristics and we have hardly any knowledge of them

It would be irrational to claim there's absolutely no way in hell they CAN exist. There's a difference.
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right, you're saying such life is unlikely to exist. But that statement is still dependent on an extremely shallow pool of knowledge
 
Dr. Chuckles said:
yes, after you reviewed a reasonable amount of evidence. Here, there was no reviewing a reasonable amount of evidence. Hence, you are making a declaration from ignorence
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What is "ignorence?" You mean ignorance? There's reviewing of evidence. Claims have been disproven as airplanes, weather balloons, science projects, or just flat out blatant lies.

If someone claims life exists on a pacific island, and is proven wrong, that doesn't establishes that life doesn't exist on other 100 island in the region, especially when they contain completely different characteristics and we have hardly any knowledge of them
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What is this, Ancient Aliens? I thought we we're talking about the here and now. It would also be safe that there would be evidence of some sort of catastrophic event causing them to disappear as well as their previous existence.

right, you're saying such life is unlikely to exist. But that statement is still dependent on an extremely shallow pool of knowledge
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It's tough. It's an intertwining of non-science (mathematics) and sciences. Statistically, it's highly likely. So far as to scientific evidence, it's negated. Such life is unlikely to exist with our curent knowledge. Is our current knowledge the best ever? Well that requires futuristic insight which I do not possess. Is it the best up to this moment? Yes.
 
zgoldsmith23 said:
What is "ignorence?" You mean ignorance? There's reviewing of evidence. Claims have been disproven as airplanes, weather balloons, science projects, or just flat out blatant lies.
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Why would the fact that claimed visitations to earth were proven false speak to the larger issue of life in the universe? That simply speaks to the issue of supposed visitation. Life could exist that can't visit earth, doesn't want to visit earth, or even completely incapable of visiting earth



What is this, Ancient Aliens? I thought we we're talking about the here and now. It would also be safe that there would be evidence of some sort of catastrophic event causing them to disappear as well as their previous existence.
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I am pointing out you have no basis to claim there is a lack of extraterrestrial life because such a lack of life in our immediate area does not speak to such a lack on the endless number of other planets and solar systems that exist in the universe.

Also, why do you assume such life would have died out when the entire point is that we don't even know enough to declare that life doesn't exist on most of these planets, to begin with?

It's tough. It's an intertwining of non-science (mathematics) and sciences. Statistically, it's highly likely. So far as to scientific evidence, it's negated. Such life is unlikely to exist with our curent knowledge. Is our current knowledge the best ever? Well that requires futuristic insight which I do not possess. Is it the best up to this moment? Yes.
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with our "current knowledge" that is extremely limited to one tiny planet. But you want to make declarations about the entire universe based on that, even though we discover new forms of life here everyday.
 
Dr. Chuckles said:
Why would the fact that claimed visitations to earth were proven false speak to the larger issue of life in the universe? That simply speaks to the issue of supposed visitation. Life could exist that can't visit earth, doesn't want to visit earth, or even completely incapable of visiting earth
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Does it even exist to humans then?

I am pointing out you have no basis to claim there is a lack of extraterrestrial life because such a lack of life in our immediate area does not speak to such a lack on the endless number of other planets and solar systems that exist in the universe.
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Certainly doesn't. I never claimed it was impossible. How dishonest of you.

Also, why do you assume such life would have died out when the entire point is that we don't even know enough to declare that life doesn't exist on most of these planets, to begin with?
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If they didn't die out, then they would be able to be contacted about their existence.

with our "current knowledge" that is extremely limited to one tiny planet. But you want to make declarations about the entire universe based on that, even though we discover new forms of life here everyday.
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Until there's evidence, it would be foolish to scientifically theorize their existence.
 
zgoldsmith23 said:
Does it even exist to humans then?
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what do you mean? If you're claiming it then lacks relevency, I would simply point out your original claim didn't speak to the relevancy of the question



Certainly doesn't. I never claimed it was impossible. How dishonest of you.
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You have been clearly arguing that there is no such thing as ET life in the universe. You certainly stopped short of claiming it as scientific fact, but you have stated we have enough evidence to point to it being extremely unlikely.

My contention has been we don't have enough evidence to make such a claim





If they didn't die out, then they would be able to be contacted about their existence.
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why do you assume they would want to or are even be capable of such? Maybe they exist in the same state as native bacteria (totally unintelligent, with little interest beyond reproduction)



Until there's evidence, it would be foolish to scientifically theorize their existence.
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the same with claiming they don't exist ... Which is my point
 
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Dr. Chuckles said:
what do you mean? If you're claiming it then lacks relevency, I would simply point out your original claim didn't speak to the relevancy of the question
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If it's untestable and we'll never know (and neither will they) does it even exist? Read some Popper. That's like claiming there's a cow that's always 5 feet directly in front of you and, no matter how fast or far you travel, you'll never see him, touch him, or feel him. Indeed it does lack relevancy ("relevency" isn't a word, either).

You have been clearly arguing that there is no such thing as ET life in the universe. You certainly stopped short of claiming it as scientific fact, but you have stated we have enough evidence to point to it being extremely unlikely.

My contention has been we don't have enough evidence to make such a claim
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ET life in the universe isn't impossible. I never claimed as such. I did say that, as of yet - with a lack of evidence for them (and claims made thus far have been shown less than credible) - it's foolish to claim they exist. There's no reason to think they exist and there's a reason to think they don't exist.

why do you assume they would want to or even be capable of such?
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Why wouldn't they? How would they be incapable?

the same with claiming they don't exist ... Which is my point
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I'm claiming as of yet, there's no reason to posit their existence. I'm not saying they're impossible (as you seem to be claiming I claimed).
 
zgoldsmith23 said:
If it's untestable and we'll never know (and neither will they) does it even exist? Read some Popper. That's like claiming there's a cow that's always 5 feet directly in front of you and, no matter how fast or far you travel, you'll never see him, touch him, or feel him. Indeed it does lack relevancy ("relevency" isn't a word, either).
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We can test it by simply gaining more knowledge of alien environments



ET life in the universe isn't impossible. I never claimed as such. I did say that, as of yet - with a lack of evidence for them (and claims made thus far have been shown less than credible) - it's foolish to claim they exist. There's no reason to think they exist and there's a reason to think they don't exist.
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again, claims about earth visitations does not speak to the existence of alien lifeforms. I'm not sure how you can confuse such easily distinguished points, nor continue to ignore that our pool of potential evidence, that would indicate it's existence, or not, is extremely shallow.

Hence, it's just as foolish to assert they don't exist





Why wouldn't they? How would they be incapable?
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Because we simply don't hold the type of interest that makes such a trip worthwhile, they lack the technology, they exist in an unintelligent state, etc



I'm claiming as of yet, there's no reason to posit their existence. I'm not saying they're impossible (as you seem to be claiming I claimed).
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Nope , you claimed they likely didn't exist and cited the debunked claims of visitation, and our inadequate understanding of alien environments to support it.
 
Dr. Chuckles said:
We can test it by simply gaining more knowledge of alien environments
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I'm assuming you mean foreign environments?

again, claims about earth visitations does not speak to the existence of alien lifeforms. I'm not sure how you can confuse such easily distinguished points, nor continue to ignore that our pool of potential evidence, that would indicate it's existence, or not, is extremely shallow.
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Those claims are hypotheses. They have been disproven. The potential evidence for what? Aliens?

Hence, it's just as foolish to assert they don't exist
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Unless there's evidence, it's a default position to assume they don't, no?

Because we simply don't hold the type of interest that makes such a trip worthwhile, they lack the technology, they exist in an unintelligent state, etc
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A trip? What? They may lack technology but investigators (presumably) wouldn't. They may be unintelligent, that doesn't mean they couldn't show evidence they existed elsewhere.

Nope , you claimed they likely didn't exist and cited the debunked claims of visitation, and our inadequate understanding of alien environments to support it.
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As of today, there's no reason to posit their existence (again). Do you have evidence to show they are likely to exist?
 
I believe in ET but not "flying saucers" as I'm sure you mean it. To believe we're alone in the universe is folly at best.
 
Given how big the universe is, its quite reasonable to predict that life exists somewhere other than earth. However, that does nothing to excuse the absurdity of claiming that intelligent aliens are visiting earth in spacecraft as we speak. Every single shred of so called "evidence" regarding UFO's is infinitely more explainable by human stupidity than the actual presence of alien life. There is no practical mechanism that could explain why every single scientific method fails to detect aliens, yet somehow they are discovered by drunk people in rural Kansas. Nowadays there are huge amounts of high quality cameras floating around that could get a very nice picture of a flying saucer with excellent detail, yet someone all we get are vague blurry pictures that could be anything.

Bottom line, there is every indication that humans make crap up and none that aliens are probing anuses and making crop circles. Its not exactly a wonder how easily politicians can BS the public if they are also willing to believe in crap like flying saucers.
 
zgoldsmith23 said:
Seeing as how there's not any scientifically verified evidence of them and, almost all of the claims made about them have been disproven, no.
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You can thank Men In Black for that.
 
I beleuve in aliens more and more each time the yellow Camaro passes me on the Street.
 
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