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Did Obama lie about closing Gitmo?

Did Obama lie about closing Gitmo if he became president?

  • Yes

    Votes: 18 62.1%

  • No

    Votes: 5 17.2%

  • IDK/Other

    Votes: 6 20.7%
  • Total voters
    29
DA60 said:
I don't care what your issue is - or Obama's.

And he rarely mentions them - so don't tell me he is so worried about them getting due process.

He clearly could care less.


The military has had over ten years to determine their innocence or guilt.

If that is not enough time - tough.

Either start military trials on them now.

Or let them go - now.


Maybe you and Obama are fine with innocent people being held for years without trial.

I am not.


I am done talking with you on this - clearly your mind is closed (and dead wrong) on this issue.
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Oh wow, all I did was share my opinion on the subject, and you went off the handle. There are a whole host of flaws in your logic, but you seem to be uninterested in discusion, only aggressive argument and condemnation of counter perspective. I didn't mean to offend or upset you and I apologize for apparently doing so. My mind is actually quite open to new perspective, but I can't follow a strand of logic that centers around this idea of, damn the ideals, I'm going to do what I want to do. We live in the real world, and that's not how things work.

Again, sorry to have upset you, I will be sure to avoid your posts from here on out. Have a great day!
 
joko104 said:
Yes he can. He can do anything he wants with "enemy combatants." He's Commander-In-Chief.

Congress not approving of something doesn't stop him as Commander-In-Chief. He engaged in war against the government of Libya ordering many thousands of airstrikes - none with Congressional approval. Congress can pass all the resolutions it wants to, but as Commander-In-Chief he has the final and total say of what to do with military prisoners on military bases.
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The only reason he, Obama was able to wage war against Libya without the approval of congress is that congress let him do it. The constitution says only congress can declare war and once that is done, the president as CINC wages it. But the Democrats in congress let him wage an unconstitutional war in Libya because he was a member of their party, they had become part of the administration instead of a co-equal branch of government. But Congress funded his operations there. So regardless of all the rhetoric, congress gave the president the money to continue on with the war.

As to the prisoners of GITMO, it is my understanding that the bill congress passed and Obama signed stated no funds could be used for the transfer of the prisoners from GITMO to the U.S. So unless the president wants to pay for the transfer out of his own pocket or have one of his huge money donors pay for it, the prisoners stay put. No government funds are available.
 
joko104 said:
In 2008, Obama repeatedly vowed to close Gitmo if he became Commander In Chief and that Gitmo shamed America to the entire world. When elected president, since Gitmo is part of a military base and operation, he could have closed it merely by signing an Executive Order without any need for approval by Congress.

He did not close it. Amazingly, closing Gitmo was again part of his campaign in the 2012 election.

Personally, I can think of no more clear example (of so many) in which Obama is an outright calculated - if not pathological - liar.

However, the poll question is simple:

Did Obama lie during the 2008 election when he vowed to close Gitmo if he became president?
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I don't believe he outright lied. I believe he honestly wanted to. However, I also believe he was naive regarding other people and the power they held and seriously miscalculated the (lack of) strength of the office of President. 2008, I should specify.

Please note that I do not consider naivete to be any better than outright lying for that high of an office, btw. At that level, one should know better.
 
WWGWD said:
Oh wow, all I did was share my opinion on the subject, and you went off the handle. There are a whole host of flaws in your logic, but you seem to be uninterested in discusion, only aggressive argument and condemnation of counter perspective. I didn't mean to offend or upset you and I apologize for apparently doing so. My mind is actually quite open to new perspective, but I can't follow a strand of logic that centers around this idea of, damn the ideals, I'm going to do what I want to do. We live in the real world, and that's not how things work.

Again, sorry to have upset you, I will be sure to avoid your posts from here on out. Have a great day!
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You have not 'upset' me. But I have no tolerance for mistreating innocent human beings. Nor will I debate it as it is an absolute.


And discuss what?

To hold people without trial for over a decade is wrong.

Period.

Obama could end their suffering if he wanted to.

Clearly he does not and hides behind some sort of legal mumbo jumbo to do it.

He is wrong on this and his actions are pathetic.

Just as Bush's before him were wrong and pathetic.


You disagree?

You are wrong (on this).

End of discussion.


Have a great day yourself.
 
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DA60 said:
You have not 'upset' me. But I have no tolerance for mistreating innocent human beings.


And discuss what?

To hold people without trial for over a decade is wrong.

Period.

Obama could end their suffering if he wanted to.

Clearly he does not and hides behind some sort of legal mumbo jumbo to do it.

He is wrong on this and his actions are pathetic.


You disagree?

You are wrong.

End of discussion.


Have a great day yourself.
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You are interpreting events, and refusing to even consider that their might actually be legitimate, legal, roadblocks in the way of closing it. You simply want dismiss and deligitimize anything and everything that doesn't support your assertions.

I 100% agree with you that this is a human rights issue, and it's appalling that it's been allowed to continue in this capacity for as long as it has. But you can't just open the doors and let every one out, without doing the work to ensure we are prosecuting the right people, for any and all crimes they committed and releasing the innocent ones. Thats difficult to do when files are missing, evidence is compromised and you don't have the tools neccissary to accomplish that. Your explanation of what you would do, is broad, uneducated and dangerous if you don't do the judicial work required. That was my point, and either I didn't make it accurately, or you have chosen not to ackowledge it.

It doesn't matter what I say to you, I know that none of it will make it through, because you appear to have no desire to listen to anyone's point of view but your own. That's fine, you can decide I'm wrong, it doesn't effect me, it only delegitimizes your perspective. It does however, make you the close minded one. I would never tell someone they are wrong based solely on the fact that they don't agree with me, especially when neither of us have all the information required to make a conclusive judgment on the situation.
 
joko104 said:
No one could prevent Obama from closing Gitmo because it is a military base and he is Commander-In-Chief.
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So you are saying that he did have the authority to bring the prisoners of the US military into the US where ever he liked enabling him to continue the ligitimate functions that were ongoing at Gitmo? (Taking them to another foriegn base where he didn't have authority was not possible for many reasons.) (BTW closing Gitmo means keeping a skelitan staff to maintain our rights there.)
 
OhIsee.Then said:

So you are saying that he did have the authority to bring the prisoners of the US military into the US where ever he liked enabling him to continue the ligitimate functions that were ongoing at Gitmo? (Taking them to another foriegn base where he didn't have authority was not possible for many reasons.) (BTW closing Gitmo means keeping a skelitan staff to maintain our rights there.)
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Do you understand that all this "Gitmo" talk is only about the prison, and not about the base itself? No one has ever talked about closing the base.
 
American said:
Do you understand that all this "Gitmo" talk is only about the prison, and not about the base itself? No one has ever talked about closing the base.
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It is the original obfuscation that begs me to do it. Let me see. How about: Since Obama is commander in chief all he had to do was move the prisoners to a stateside prison. Do you understand that all this "Gitmo" talk is only about how Obama was prevented from closing the prison? Who did that?
 
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