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How many here belong a union in the public or private sector? Why? or Why not?

How many here belong to a union?

  • Total voters
    67
  • Poll closed .
ChrisL said:
I believe you, and as I stated earlier, there are SOME unions that have gone off the deep end, but this certainly doesn't apply to EVERY union. There are still plenty of good unions out there that do care about their members.
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maybe so...but i haven't seen one in my area
 
OscarB63 said:
the issue is that for many public sector unions, there is no choice about being in the union. either you join the union or you don't get hired. when i was teaching public school i was forced to join not one but 3 unions and pay 3 separate and outrageous dues if i wanted to keep my job.

the local teacher's union for the system where i taught
the alabama education association
the national education association

there was no "opting out" of being in the union unless you wanted to opt out of teaching in the public school system.

before I transferred from the national guard into the army reserves, I was basically forced to join the guard's Officer Association (read union). membership was not mandatory but any officer failing to "voluntarily" join and pay his/her dues received a "needs improvement" rating under "decision making' and "judgement" on their next officer eval.
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In what ways is the Officer Association a union? I have never heard of any US military branch being unionized.
 
mak2 said:
In what ways is the Officer Association a union? I have never heard of any US military branch being unionized.
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they collect dues, elect officers, send lobbyists to DC to push an agenda, etc. they do all the things that the teacher's union does

http://www.ngaus.org/
 
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I was in the NCO assoc and never once thought it was a union.
OscarB63 said:
they collect dues, elect officers, send lobbyists to DC to push an agenda, etc. they do all the things that the teacher's union does
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mak2 said:
I was in the NCO assoc and never once thought it was a union.
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if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck.....

for all intents and purposes it is a union.

question; were you ever pressured to join the NCO association? I had my OER threatened on several occasions over joining the officer's association.

i get called to the CO's office:

CO: CPT B, I see you haven't paid your guard association dues yet.

Me; well sir, money is tight this year and I was thinking about not joining this year.

CO: Well, I can't force you to join, but I would have to question your judgement and decision making skills on your next OER if you don't

Me: roger sir, I'll send them a check today.
 
I am not saying you are wrong, but is seems to me a union would have some effect on working conditions or pay. I am just surprised with the military having a union.
OscarB63 said:
if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck.....

for all intents and purposes it is a union.

question; were you ever pressured to join the NCO association? I had my OER threatened on several occasions over joining the officer's association.

i get called to the CO's office:

CO: CPT B, I see you haven't paid your guard association dues yet.

Me; well sir, money is tight this year and I was thinking about not joining this year.

CO: Well, I can't force you to join, but I would have to question your judgement and decision making skills on your next OER if you don't

Me: roger sir, I'll send them a check today.
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mak2 said:
I am not saying you are wrong, but is seems to me a union would have some effect on working conditions or pay. I am just surprised with the military having a union.
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the guard association sends reps to DC to lobby congress for pay raises and bennies. that's one of the things they always used to tell us to encourage membership: "if it wasn't for the guard association we would never get pay raises" etc.

check out the link


http://www.ngaus.org/


there is a link at the site to 'legislation' that the guard association allegedly got pushed through to benefit its members

Past Successes
Since 1878, the National Guard Association of the United States (NGAUS) has been fighting for the needs of the National Guard on Capitol Hill. Recent legislative successes include:

National Guard Empowerment
NGAUS has worked to ensure that National Guard leaders have an enhanced voice and position in the Department of Defense decision-making process. In 2008, NGAUS worked with Congress to pass Empowerment I, elevating the Chief of the National Guard Bureau (CNGB) from a three-star to a four-star general. NGAUS celebrated the victory, but didn’t stop there. In 2011, NGAUS successfully pushed for Empowerment II, which provided a seat for the CNGB on the Joint Chiefs of Staff and re-established a three-star Vice Chief position, an effort that’s considered the most significant legislative victory since the Militia Act of 1903 created the modern, dual-mission National Guard.

GI Bill 2.0 – Post 9/11 GI Bill for National Guard

Overturning Proposed Air National Guard Cuts

Modernizing the Army National Guard

Other notable legislative successes:
Historic levels of National Guard and Reserve Equipment Account (NGREA) and Military Construction (MILCON) funds
Robust Personnel and Operations and Maintenance (O&M) funding to maintain an operational reserve
Maintained ANG end strength of 106,700 and ARNG end strength of 358,200
Behavior health support for members of the Reserve Component during scheduled unit training assemblies
Reemployment rights for Title 32 National Guard duty
Expansion of state licensure exceptions for certain health care professionals to provide access to healthcare for National Guard soldiers in rural and remote areas
Halted Air Force attempt to reassign Air National Guard C-130s into an active-component unit in Little Rock, AR
Authority to temporarily hire non-dual status technicians to fill vacancies created by the mobilization of a dual status technicians
Authority for the VA to provide mental health care for veterans and their families — post deployment
Extended TRICARE coverage for “Gray Area” retirees
Doubled from 90 to 180 days the time a Reserve Component member is covered under TRICARE Prime prior to mobilization
Increased full-time support personnel for the Army National Guard including the largest increase for Active, Guard and Reserves (AGR) in 22 years
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Will do.
OscarB63 said:
the guard association sends reps to DC to lobby congress for pay raises and bennies. that's one of the things they always used to tell us to encourage membership: "if it wasn't for the guard association we would never get pay raises" etc.

check out the link


Home | National Guard Association of the United States


there is a link at the site to 'legislation' that the guard association allegedly got pushed through to benefit its members
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Interesting. I guess you could call it a union.
 
OscarB63 said:
the issue is that for many public sector unions, there is no choice about being in the union. either you join the union or you don't get hired. when i was teaching public school i was forced to join not one but 3 unions and pay 3 separate and outrageous dues if i wanted to keep my job.

the local teacher's union for the system where i taught
the alabama education association
the national education association

there was no "opting out" of being in the union unless you wanted to opt out of teaching in the public school system.

before I transferred from the national guard into the army reserves, I was basically forced to join the guard's Officer Association (read union). membership was not mandatory but any officer failing to "voluntarily" join and pay his/her dues received a "needs improvement" rating under "decision making' and "judgement" on their next officer eval.
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Did you look at my link on the previous page? It says that as of June 2012 ruling by the SCOTUS, that public sector unions CANNOT force membership or dues. So your story might have been true when you were a teacher some years ago, but as of now that is no longer the case.
 
ChrisL said:
Did you look at my link on the previous page? It says that as of June 2012 ruling by the SCOTUS, that public sector unions CANNOT force membership or dues. So your story might have been true when you were a teacher some years ago, but as of now that is no longer the case.
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and as we all know...there are ways of "encouraging" membership without making it mandatory.
 
OscarB63 said:
and as we all know...there are ways of "encouraging" membership without making it mandatory.
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Okay, now I'll take YOUR side's argument and say, then just find another job. :lol:

Besides, this isn't the 1950s or 1960s anymore. The unions cannot get away with some of the things they used to do.
 
ChrisL said:
I guess you must have skimmed over this part.
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Nope. I put it in context. Justice Samuel Alito was talking about non-union workers having the same right to choose and express thier views on political and social issues without government interference. He was not saying that employees could work at the same job as union workers without joining a union if they want to.
 
Kal'Stang said:
History is not the end all be all of what can happen now or what can happen in the future.
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You have some more libertarian fairy tales to share with us?
 
Kal'Stang said:
Nope. I put it in context. Justice Samuel Alito was talking about non-union workers having the same right to choose and express thier views on political and social issues without government interference. He was not saying that employees could work at the same job as union workers without joining a union if they want to.
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That is true. They pay for dues for services that benefit them, such as raises and things. If the non-member employee is benefiting, then I don't see why they would object to paying for that portion of dues. If you don't want to pay union dues, don't work for a unionized company. :shrug:

Since union membership is pretty low as of recent, I have a difficult time believing that people can't find employment at a business in ANY state that isn't unionized if they so wish.

I really don't agree with that though. People should be able to opt out of the union if they want to, but they should NOT receive any of the benefits that the unionized employees receive. They should have to negotiate for themselves if that's how they feel.
 
ChrisL said:
That is true. They pay for dues for services that benefit them, such as raises and things. If the non-member employee is benefiting, then I don't see why they would object to paying for that portion of dues. If you don't want to pay union dues, don't work for a unionized company. :shrug:

Since union membership is pretty low as of recent, I have a difficult time believing that people can't find employment at a business in ANY state that isn't unionized if they so wish
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.

I really don't agree with that though. People should be able to opt out of the union if they want to, but they should NOT receive any of the benefits that the unionized employees receive. They should have to negotiate for themselves if that's how they feel.
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It would be interesting. Unfortunately companies would not hire employees that they could not manipulate. Company management needs to learn how to motivate not intimidate people, how to negotiate contracts, how to remain competitive in the new market place and most importantly to take responsibility for their decision making process. Laying the economic slide we are in on the backs of the unions is a management cop out.
 
TheGirlNextDoor said:
Your poll is lacking a tad. I've never been a unionized worker, but I wouldn't be totally opposed to joining one IF certain criteria was met.

My father was a member of Teamsters for 35+ years and while there were times they'd piss him off by their actions, there were other times he was glad he was a member.
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My father was a member of one as well. Being in that atmosphere growing up is one reason why I would not belong to one now.
 
Rocketman said:
My father was a member of one as well. Being in that atmosphere growing up is one reason why I would not belong to one now.
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my uncle spent nearly 40 years working as a "union buster" for a major chemical manufacturer. he was constantly getting death threats, having his home/car vandalized, etc.
 
OscarB63 said:
my uncle spent nearly 40 years working as a "union buster" for a major chemical manufacturer. he was constantly getting death threats, having his home/car vandalized, etc.
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Really, According to Christ here on this forum, unions are non violent.
 
ChrisL said:
And according to you all unions practice violence.
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Well. Does smashing private property and seizing other employees and holding them hostage count?
 
I did belong to one but got promoted out of it.

cpwill said:
Well. Does smashing private property and seizing other employees and holding them hostage count?
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By that rule of thumb you're probably less violent if you belong to a union. I'm willing to wager the dirt poor and lower middle class commit more violent crimes than union members. And it's a good bet rich people do, too - they just do it by proxy.
 
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