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Women voting, bad idea?

Women voting, bad idea?

  • women voting is a terrible idea

    Votes: 13 14.3%

  • women voting is fine with me

    Votes: 78 85.7%
  • Total voters
    91
ab9924 said:
Even if he gets paid rediculously little?
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I already went over this. I don't really care what he makes. Now, if there are practical limitations to how much weight I can pull financially, then I care. But assuming that it doesn't cause us financial difficulty for him to make less -- even much less -- then no, I don't care.

One of my former boyfriends was a performance artist. Trust me when I tell you he made beans. But he was great, and he loved it, and he contributed in his own way.
 
ab9924 said:
Even if he gets paid rediculously little?
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Pay is subjective.

How much is a lot - how much is a little? When I met my husband I was earning 8/hr and he was earning 13/hr - and he considered my pay to be dirt-ass low but it was the most I had ever been paid - and I was management.

Now? I'd probably be able to earn 9 or 10 if I'm lucky when getting back into the workforce - just because he managed to bring in a much larger sum because of promotions, etc - over the years doesn't mean I'm worthless when it comes to that.
 
NitroHangover said:
I heard a statistic on the radio a month or two ago (no, not conservative talk radio, btw, in case anyone was wondering) saying that simultaneously, while job markets for men are shrinking, and job markets for women are opening up wider and becoming more and more monopolized by women, while women are making more money and men are making less, that at the same time the percentage of women who say that it is very important to them that their potential husband make more money than they do is also skyrocketing. It's unbelievable. I swear, in so many ways, women as a group have become like a real world, human manifestation of the phrase "have their cake and eat it too".

Sure, I have no doubt that in polls and stuff, women say they are perfectly comfortable with men being "househusbands" and bringing in no money as a contribution. I don't think they're lying, either. I think they are perfectly comfortable with it on a philosophical and ideological level... for other, hypothetical couples. Just not in their life. Not for a man they marry. Maybe we are heading that way and a couple generations from now we'll get there, but right now I just don't see it, in the real world. I have never in my life seen a well-off, professional woman marrying a man who makes ten bucks an hour, or doesn't work at all. On the other hand, I have certainly seen plenty of the reverse and no one questions it at all.

Before anyone jumps on me btw, I am aware that I'm speaking in broad generalizations. I'm sure many people know a couple or two who embody the reverse of what was once the norm. But sometimes in discussions like these, generalities are what counts, because by and large that's what is happening.
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In the case of my friend who chose to stay home, he and his wife had serious trust issues to conquer. She feared that in the event of a divorce, he'd have custody of the kid and she'd be facing child support and alimony obligations. He feared that, after a few years, he'd be unemployable and in the event of a divorce, condemned to a life of poverty.

In a relationship, money issues are never just about the money, Nitro.
 
Surtr said:
The only people who should be barred from voting are those who don't pay taxes.
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Why not? And who does not pay any tax at all? I would think everybody pays tax to some degree. A lot of goods have sales tax on them, products that have come from other countries have customs duties paid on them which is another form of tax, anyone who drives a car pays fuel tax, etc. etc. etc.

Everyone over the age of 18 should be allowed to vote, men and women, old and young, rich and poor, smart and not so smart. They all have the right to vote. One can argue about whether inmates of a prison should be allowed to vote but apart from that everyone should be allowed to vote.
 
Surtr said:
Because if you aren't contributing to society, you don't get a voice.
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I am sorry, but who are you to decide if someone contributes to society? That kind of arrogance IMHO is disgusting.
 
Surtr said:
Yeah, well, this isn't the Netherlands.
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And? Again, who are you to decide who contributes to society? Or what contributing to society means? If you post such insensitive :bs it logical that you get comments about it. No matter from which country they come.
 
Dragonfly said:
The only way you contribute to society is by paying taxes?
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Taxes pay for representation, roads, education, medical care, legal assistance, emergency services, and every other facet of life everybody takes for granted. It's all paid for by our representatives using our collective tax money. If a person isn't putting in their part like every other person in this country does, they can eat a dick. They haven't earned the right to have a voice.
 
Peter King said:
And? Again, who are you to decide who contributes to society? Or what contributing to society means? If you post such insensitive :bs it logical that you get comments about it. No matter from which country they come.
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I'm a tax paying citizen. I give my time, and my money to my community just like everybody else in this country. Why should a freeloading ****bag get the same voice as those who actually finance this nation?
 
A stay-at-home mother raising her kids and making no "income" is a freeloading phuckbag?

Nice.
 
Dragonfly said:
A stay-at-home mother raising her kids and making no "income" is a freeloading phuckbag?

Nice.
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You make the mistake of thinking petty guilt trips work on me. Voting is the selection of this nation's leadership and laws. Making it a right where any idiot that just so happens to be the right age can vote for whoever they think is the swellest guy was the biggest mistake of this nation's history.
 
Surtr said:
I'm a tax paying citizen. I give my time, and my money to my community just like everybody else in this country. Why should a freeloading ****bag get the same voice as those who actually finance this nation?
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So you are an anti-democratic person who feels just because he pays taxes (which most everyone in the US actually pays in some way or another) has the audacity to value contributing to a community as those who pay money to the community.

And that person that at the moment now has the bad luck not to be able to pay income taxes has every right to vote as you have. He may or might have contributed way more than you have to society or he maybe in the future he will do. And even if he doesn't, in a democracy everyone has the right to vote, even people with elitist arrogant opinions.

Also, as I said before, most people in the US pay taxes if not all people in the US. There are payroll taxes, capital gains taxes, state taxes, fuel taxes, sales taxes, etc. etc. etc. and most pay 1 or more of these taxes. Personally I think virtually everyone pays 1 or more of these taxes.
 
Surtr said:
You make the mistake of thinking petty guilt trips work on me. Voting is the selection of this nation's leadership and laws. Making it a right where any idiot that just so happens to be the right age can vote for whoever they think is the swellest guy was the biggest mistake of this nation's history.
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My daughter is 20 years old, and a junior in college working towards med school.

She's got no right to vote this coming election?
 
Surtr said:
Because if you aren't contributing to society, you don't get a voice.
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How's about we bar from voting any adult who pays less than an effective 25% of his income in tax? That'd take out every wealthy adult in America.

That strike you as fair, Surtr?
 
Surtr said:
I'm a tax paying citizen. I give my time, and my money to my community just like everybody else in this country. Why should a freeloading ****bag get the same voice as those who actually finance this nation?
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Because even the wealthy have the right to participate in our democracy. No one should have to "buy" their right to vote by paying "enough" taxes.
 
Peter King said:
So you are an anti-democratic person
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We're a democratic republic, as it should be. Democracy on its own is a self-defeating concept that inhibits the very progressions it attempts to make. The right to vote should be reserved for taxpayers with a college education and proof of financial stability. I'd go so far as to impose a competency test, where people must demonstrate that they actually understand what and who it is they're voting for.

who feels just because he pays taxes (which most everyone in the US actually pays in some way or another) has the audacity to value contributing to a community as those who pay money to the community.
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I've done a lot more than that, but yes. If a person isn't paying taxes, they're freeloaders. Taking without giving, proving they aren't worthy of the duty of suffrage.

And that person that at the moment now has the bad luck not to be able to pay income taxes has every right to vote as you have. He may or might have contributed way more than you have to society or he maybe in the future he will do. And even if he doesn't, in a democracy everyone has the right to vote, even people with elitist arrogant opinions.
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I'm playing the world's smallest violin for all the sorry bleeding hearts with a sad story to tell. We aren't a democracy, and we never were.

Also, as I said before, most people in the US pay taxes if not all people in the US. There are payroll taxes, capital gains taxes, state taxes, fuel taxes, sales taxes, etc. etc. etc. and most pay 1 or more of these taxes. Personally I think virtually everyone pays 1 or more of these taxes.
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Yes, and the homeless, and the welfare queens, and the freeloaders, and the takers, they pay what? Sales tax? What do they pay it with, because they have no jobs. Their only income is from sugar daddies, charity, and our tax dollars. Sorry, but I couldn't care less.
 
Pinkie said:
How's about we bar from voting any adult who pays less than an effective 25% of his income in tax? That'd take out every wealthy adult in America.

That strike you as fair, Surtr?
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A set percentage? No, it wouldn't be fair to anyone, but tax evaders should definitely lose all suffrage rights, and then some.
 
Surtr said:
A set percentage? No, it wouldn't be fair to anyone, but tax evaders should definitely lose all suffrage rights, and then some.
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I've gone through this debate (with myself) previously (insert foreveralone.jpg here) and came to the conclusion that this can't be done. The idea sounds attractive initially though, I admit!

The problems are: 1) it necessitates that we pay taxes. I hope that someday, Federal Income taxes will no longer exist. 2) The primary functions of the government, to uphold our natural-born rights, do not even have to deal with money. Pushing this agenda is supporting that the government's primary role is collecting and redistributing taxes.
 
fredmertzz said:
I've gone through this debate (with myself) previously (insert foreveralone.jpg here) and came to the conclusion that this can't be done. The idea sounds attractive initially though, I admit!

The problems are: 1) it necessitates that we pay taxes. I hope that someday, Federal Income taxes will no longer exist. 2) The government's actual duties do not deal with doling out money that it gathered from the citizens that appointed it. The primary functions of the government, to uphold our natural-born rights, do not even have to deal with money. Pushing this agenda is supporting that the government's primary role is collecting and redistributing taxes.
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It's easily achieved, you send their asses to prison for tax evasion. Taxes have always been necessary for the survival of the Union, it's the sole reason why we have a Constitution, and not the Articles of Confederation. Roads have to be built and maintained, hospitals and medical care have to be instituted, police and soldiers have to be properly equipped, trained, and paid, and so on. Society cannot function without taxes, and when people don't pay taxes, they're stealing from society. They're taking everything we built as a nation, and putting a big ole mushroom stamp on it.
 
Surtr said:
We're a democratic republic, as it should be. Democracy on its own is a self-defeating concept that inhibits the very progressions it attempts to make. The right to vote should be reserved for taxpayers with a college education and proof of financial stability. I'd go so far as to impose a competency test, where people must demonstrate that they actually understand what and who it is they're voting for.
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in a democracy all people should be allowed to vote in which only the voting age is the deciding factor that decides who should be allowed to vote and IMHO that is how it should be. Why not else would the people who not pay federal income tax decide that people with attitudes towards the rest of society like yours be banned from voting for anti-democratic values? It must never go back to the times in which minorities had to prove that they could read before being allowed to vote. Your attitude towards democracy is wrong and not how democracies should work.

Surtr said:
I've done a lot more than that, but yes. If a person isn't paying taxes, they're freeloaders. Taking without giving, proving they aren't worthy of the duty of suffrage.
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Thank goodness people like you do not get to decide insulting and denigrating rules as to which kind of people should be allowed to vote. A lot of people now no longer pay taxes after paying tax their whole life and they have every right to vote. Paying taxes should never be the deciding factor in whether people should have the right to vote, it is a given right to all adults in the US and that is how democracies work.

Surtr said:
I'm playing the world's smallest violin for all the sorry bleeding hearts with a sad story to tell. We aren't a democracy, and we never were.
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Thank goodness all those bleeding hearts will make sure your kind of democracy will never come to pass. The US is a democracy and for decades you have been.

Surtr said:
Yes, and the homeless, and the welfare queens, and the freeloaders, and the takers, they pay what? Sales tax? What do they pay it with, because they have no jobs. Their only income is from sugar daddies, charity, and our tax dollars. Sorry, but I couldn't care less.
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And I could care less that you feel that way, your views like yours on society are arrogant towards those who do not have much money, that makes a person an arrogant elitist who are totally out of touch with reality.
 
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