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Are we better off than the prehistoric man?

ab9924 said:
This may be a no-brainer, but really. We work more hours than the prehistoric man hunted. We work in artificial environments that stretches our social/family ties, the prehistoric man did all his activities with the involvement of his social/family environment. The prehistoric man was "separated" from the animal kingdom by inventing that the weakest member of his horde was worth enough to support, we eagerly write off everybody who is not competitive enough.

And what do we gain for these sacrifices? We can drive more expensive cars to take an even remoter job. We can buy more expensive houses that we hardly have any time to spend in. We can get hefty investment account balances that evaporate in one swoop at any stock market/credit dip/crash or at any structural unemployment experience. What is the difference between slavery and controlling the prices of all trades by cornering the markets? They teach in school that slavery was the step-ahead that advanced civilization out of the prehistoric age. But was it really a progression or a regression? Is our world today a progression?
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You mean bag when the average life span was less than age 25 and an infected tooth was a death sentence?
 
ab9924 said:
This may be a no-brainer, but really. We work more hours than the prehistoric man hunted. We work in artificial environments that stretches our social/family ties, the prehistoric man did all his activities with the involvement of his social/family environment. The prehistoric man was "separated" from the animal kingdom by inventing that the weakest member of his horde was worth enough to support, we eagerly write off everybody who is not competitive enough.

And what do we gain for these sacrifices? We can drive more expensive cars to take an even remoter job. We can buy more expensive houses that we hardly have any time to spend in. We can get hefty investment account balances that evaporate in one swoop at any stock market/credit dip/crash or at any structural unemployment experience. What is the difference between slavery and controlling the prices of all trades by cornering the markets? They teach in school that slavery was the step-ahead that advanced civilization out of the prehistoric age. But was it really a progression or a regression? Is our world today a progression?
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We are a whole lot better off.People live long and live better. If you could take a cave man and have him live as a modern person for a week he would never want to go back to being a caveman.
 
Dittohead not! said:
It occurs to me that, if we were to live out of doors in tents and cook over fires made by wood we've gathered, we could get by on earnings from working 20 hours a week, too.

and we wouldn't have to try to kill large animals with hand thrown spears, either.
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:lamo :lamo :lamo



Good point.
 
Around 10,000 years ago, a new human species started to evolve and is still evolving within our species, which is misnamed homo sapiens after only a few of its members. But the obsolescent and unfit homo erectus still dominates, even though the whole species would be doomed if not saved by the new species, whom they are ungrateful and insulting to. This retrogrades' leader intimidates the smart ones or gets them to serve him through an intelligence-hating worship of Nature and the glorification of its primitive nightmarish chaos. These meek geek traitors to the new human species give away credit for our advancement out of the jungle to imaginary gods and their appointed substitute, the King Ape himself. This dumb hulk leads by grunting, howling at the moon, pounding his chest, and hitting the terrified and ignorant over the head with his club.
 
lizzie said:
Imo, we aren't better off as a general rule. Technology is nice, but our problem-solving skills are probably suffering collectively, and our minds and bodies are idle too much of the time.
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Indeed, it seems that whatever gains we may achieve, we also undo them all the time. I thought that our minds are now less idle than in the prehistoric days, because now we have to compete against the whole world individually, unlike the prehistoric man who had to compete against the neighboring tribes only. But technology makes our bodies more idle, to the point of sickness.
 
Wiseone said:
If you want the virtues of a rougher life, of which there are many, along with the deeply integrated family and social structure but don't want to live in a cave nor skin an animal to use his fur as underwear, than join the Amish community where you can have a decent mix of the goold ol' work ethic without having to worry about a broken arm or leg being a death sentance because you can no longer hunt.
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Don't the Amish have to work on some land too, in addition to hunting and gathering?
 
Helix said:
prehistoric man could expect a lifespan of around 40 with high infant mortality. medical advances included trepanning in order to let out the demons. starvation was a significant risk, and when another tribe came over the hill without warning, they were probably coming to kill you or worse. popular forms of death included freezing, being killed in battle, or being eaten by large predators. to top off the fun, breeding age for women was mid teens, so that's when you could expect to be taken by your future husband. also, you probably don't get a great degree of choice in the matter.

so, in my professional opinion, you all can have that ****. i prefer to hang out here, have a car, and eat clif bars and diet coke. sure, it sometimes sucks having to work 40 hour weeks because somebody decided that was "full time," but it doesn't suck that much.
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Not living all that infinitely long life as we all do today, would definitely beat the nursing home, I bet. The average real working week is actually 60+ hours, only 40 of that is accounted for in the books, in the life of the general public.
 
tessaesque said:
And "prehistoric" man lived to be about 25.
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A little short, but think about this, how absolutely horrible it must be to live twice that age as we do today, what can you do at 50? No sports, no women/men, no sex, no job market, no money, no life, but you still can't die. An absolute sentence in hell on earth. I can't even imagine 40, but 50 must absolutely suck. What can one do with his life without anything?
 
What if...? said:
Actually, iirc, it was parasites and infections that were responsible for ahort primitive lifespans.

But they did apparently "work" about twenty hours a week to provide for their needs. More in harsh environments, less in hospitable ones.

NONE spent 25% of their total effort on housing ALONE.

I prefer modern comforts, but the "nasty, brutish and short" meme isn't accurate.
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What kind of infections would have the power to kill a whole man at age 25 for example? (Really curious.)
 
ab9924 said:
A little short, but think about this, how absolutely horrible it must be to live twice that age as we do today, what can you do at 50? No sports, no women/men, no sex, no job market, no money, no life, but you still can't die. An absolute sentence in hell on earth. I can't even imagine 40, but 50 must absolutely suck. What can one do with his life without anything?
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How old are you? I don't know many 50 year olds without pre-existing conditions that aren't able to participate in sports, enjoy the opposite sex and sexual relations with them, find employment, pay their bills, or enjoy life.
 
iguanaman said:
In my book a "better" life equates with a longer life. Cavemen rarely lived out of their 30's. Who cares how great it was?
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But aren't you afraid of nursing homes? There was one on TV here lately when they were sued for beating up the oldies inside. But even without the beating, doesn't it suck to be old?
 
Kandahar said:
We also have more opportunities for leisure and more comfortable lifestyles.
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Doesn't all of our time go lost at work/commute instead of any leisure?

Kandahar said:
Not for very long. It's hard to maintain social/family ties when everyone you know dies by age 25.
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Kandahar said:
We give the weak in our society far more support than prehistoric people ever did.
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Interesting. Can you give an example?
 
ab9924 said:
But aren't you afraid of nursing homes? There was one on TV here lately when they were sued for beating up the oldies inside. But even without the beating, doesn't it suck to be old?
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Personally I am a huge fan of being alive, and am quite fine with eventually growing old in order to continue this condition as long as I can. and you know what.. even though your nursing home thing is a tad silly on the surface for a reason for not wanting to grow old I would even trade off an occasional beating for a few more years of existence if that was somehow put to me as an either/or option.
 
Aunt Spiker said:
Well - you can life 'prehistoric' (your interpretation of it) for a while and compare . . . which do you prefer?
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I have found this high altitude survivalist training organization in Vaduz. I think I may join them for a few weeks later this year, if I get allowed. I like about them that they are one of those few ones that also cut down on all equipment.
 
MadLib said:
I'd assume we are, because we live four times longer. True, we have stress, but it is about small things. 21st century man worries about a promotion. 210th century BCE man worried about being eaten by a lion. We have better medical care, safe food, safe water, war is less barbaric.

I love it when people who live hundreds of thousands of years post hoc glorify a time when they wouldn't survive a week.
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I thought modern man worries about structural unemployment, because there is no environmental support for their birth, only market finances. The prehistoric man didn't even get born without environmental support. Building thorn fences and spearing against lions, like the Massai do, must be easier than guessing when you will get layed off and forclosed or electricity cut off. How do people worry about their promotions? I don't plan to be a working person, but they are the majority of the population, and all I see about them is their absolute fear of their future. Doesn't it look like a lion?
 
ab9924 said:
Doesn't all of our time go lost at work/commute instead of any leisure?
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No. Most of us work 40ish hours per week and have the rest of our time to do whatever we want. And honestly, many of us could get by working even less than that if we wanted to. It may be more total hours of work per week than prehistoric man had to do, but we have much better leisure options available. I don't know what "leisure" for prehistoric people was like (probably varied from one part of the world to another), but presumably they didn't have many options available. We have far more choices for how to spend our leisure time.

Interesting. Can you give an example?
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The weak in prehistoric societies would not have had Medicaid and handicapped-accessible facilities, for example.
 
ab9924 said:
What kind of infections would have the power to kill a whole man at age 25 for example? (Really curious.)
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I had an emergency appendectomy at that age.

What are the odds of surviving a burst appendix without the intervention of modern medicine?
 
ab9924 said:
A little short, but think about this, how absolutely horrible it must be to live twice that age as we do today, what can you do at 50? No sports, no women/men, no sex, no job market, no money, no life, but you still can't die. An absolute sentence in hell on earth. I can't even imagine 40, but 50 must absolutely suck. What can one do with his life without anything?
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You must be very young.

Life begins at 40. I'm about to turn 30, after having started life then. I can still do anything I could have done at the beginning of life.
 
tessaesque said:
How old are you? I don't know many 50 year olds without pre-existing conditions that aren't able to participate in sports, enjoy the opposite sex and sexual relations with them, find employment, pay their bills, or enjoy life.
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Okay, so how about those 50 year olds that are all over the news and can't market their out-of-date skill-set to feed/house/socialize themselves. Aren't they the majority?
 
marduc said:
Personally I am a huge fan of being alive, and am quite fine with eventually growing old in order to continue this condition as long as I can. and you know what.. even though your nursing home thing is a tad silly on the surface for a reason for not wanting to grow old I would even trade off an occasional beating for a few more years of existence if that was somehow put to me as an either/or option.
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That is so interesting ... I would blow my head off in that situation and self-destruct, I think.
 
Kandahar said:
No. Most of us work 40ish hours per week and have the rest of our time to do whatever we want. And honestly, many of us could get by working even less than that if we wanted to. It may be more total hours of work per week than prehistoric man had to do, but we have much better leisure options available. I don't know what "leisure" for prehistoric people was like (probably varied from one part of the world to another), but presumably they didn't have many options available. We have far more choices for how to spend our leisure time.



The weak in prehistoric societies would not have had Medicaid and handicapped-accessible facilities, for example.
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Interesting.

And isn't medicaid and all forms of state health insurances currently being slowly phased out?
 
Dittohead not! said:
I had an emergency appendectomy at that age.

What are the odds of surviving a burst appendix without the intervention of modern medicine?
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I see. This also seems to point to an uncompromising attachment to one's own life. This seems more general today than in prehistoric times. Is that natural?
 
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