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Are Teachers Overpaid and Underworked?

Are teachers overpaid and underworked?

  • Yes, they are overpaid and underworked

    Votes: 10 15.2%

  • No, they are not overpaid and underworked

    Votes: 56 84.8%
  • Total voters
    66
Luna Tick said:
And somehow that's a good thing? At the turn of the 20th Century what the market would bear for factory workers was 15 cents an hour 16 hours a day with no time and a half for overtime, no workman's comp, no healthcare benefits, and no vacation, and no collective bargaining representation. But "what the market will bear" will somehow save us all.
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And you should be able to force those things on the employer because...
 
the makeout hobo said:
The issue is that some people would see a marked decrease in their education, and its those people that I worry about.
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Perhaps they would get less, but than am I to believe they are owed an education? If you believe they are owed a better education why wouldn't you pay for what you believe in? Why do you need me to back you up?
 
Henrin said:
And you should be able to force those things on the employer because...
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Basic human morality. Really the employer should already be doing it or be unable to sleep at night due to a guilty conscience.
 
zstep18 said:
In your opinon, do you believe teachers as a whole are overpaid and underworked? If so, why do you believe that? And where would you rate the teaching profession in terms of it being a respectful and appreciated profession?
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Teachers are generally underpaid and (depending on state and locality) can still be overcompensated, a self-destructive model that does not always attract the high-performers that we want in such a critical profession. Teachers being under or overworked is more due to individual circumstances, to include motivation.
 
megaprogman said:
Basic human morality. Really the employer should already be doing it or be unable to sleep at night due to a guilty conscience.
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??????

That doesn't even make sense.
 
the makeout hobo said:
The issue with a fully private education system is that you will get the education you can afford. If you're very wealthy, your children will get a top-notch education that will enable him or her to be successful in life. If you're very poor, your children will get a substandard education that will hinder them from rising to their full potential. That is the very definition of an uneven playing field. While our current system is not perfect, it is more equal than a purely private system would be.
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I agree, but I would also be concerned about the kids with parents who don't properly value their education. The family's income limits the selection, but it's safe to say that not every parent will put their child in the top school they can afford, some even choosing the cheapest out of selfishness.
 
megaprogman said:
Basic human morality. Really the employer should already be doing it or be unable to sleep at night due to a guilty conscience.
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It is basic human morality to pay significantly more for labor than it is worth, thereby forcing the price of your goods higher and dooming your business to death and your workers to unemployment?

Huh. I must have missed that class.
 
haymarket said:
Only to those without the requisite conscience.
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I can't figure out how forcing people to give you want you want is moral. Can you help me there?
 
Henrin said:
I can't figure out how forcing people to give you want you want is moral. Can you help me there?
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Honestly? Really truly honestly? The better question would be can anyone help an intentionally closed mind understand that?

The answer is clearly that such a task is beyond the abilities of even the greatest of any teacher. When a persons mind was made up a very long time ago and is closed to anything but their own self imposed ideology, such a task is impossible and is silly to undertake. Some persons believe what they want to believe because they believe it and nothing anybody says or tells them is going to make any difference or help them understand anything that them do not want to understand.

It is like trying to plant orchid seeds on the hard concrete airport tarmac in Dubai in summertime.
 
Mathematician said:
I agree, but I would also be concerned about the kids with parents who don't properly value their education. The family's income limits the selection, but it's safe to say that not every parent will put their child in the top school they can afford, some even choosing the cheapest out of selfishness.
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Why is none of you people helping to bring free educational services to the online world? Why is none of you people helping there?
 
haymarket said:
Honestly? Really truly honestly? The better question would be can anyone help an intentionally closed mind understand that?

The answer is clearly that such a task is beyond the abilities of even the greatest of any teacher. When a persons mind was made up a very long time ago and is closed to anything but their own self imposed ideology, such a task is impossible and is silly to undertake. Some persons believe what they want to believe because they believe it and nothing anybody says or tells them is going to make any difference or help them understand anything that them do not want to understand.

It is like trying to plant orchid seeds on the hard concrete airport tarmac in Dubai in summertime.
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Yes, but how is it moral to force actions on others for your own personal benefit? Keep in mind mega brought this up so I'm just here trying to figure out how it makes sense.
 
Henrin said:
Yes, but how is it moral to force actions on others for your own personal benefit? Keep in mind mega brought this up so I'm just here trying to figure out how it makes sense.
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Where did I bring this up?

And you are not just here to "figure out how it makes sense". Not by a long shot.

In order to do that one must first approach with an open mind.
 
haymarket said:
Honestly? Really truly honestly? The better question would be can anyone help an intentionally closed mind understand that?

The answer is clearly that such a task is beyond the abilities of even the greatest of any teacher. When a persons mind was made up a very long time ago and is closed to anything but their own self imposed ideology, such a task is impossible and is silly to undertake. Some persons believe what they want to believe because they believe it and nothing anybody says or tells them is going to make any difference or help them understand anything that them do not want to understand.

It is like trying to plant orchid seeds on the hard concrete airport tarmac in Dubai in summertime.
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Is that a long way of saying that you lack the ability to explain it in a way that does not sound coercive or otherwise inimical to actual morality?
 
Henrin said:
Why is none of you people helping to bring free educational services to the online world? Why is none of you people helping there?
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What do you mean "you people"?
 
Not only are teachers over paid and under worked they are in a union that guarantees them employment no matter how bad they are at their job. A teacher can't be fired unless they are caught having sex with a student and their union is probably working on that as we speak.
 
sawyerloggingon said:
Not only are teachers over paid and under worked they are in a union that guarantees them employment no matter how bad they are at their job. A teacher can't be fired unless they are caught having sex with a student and their union is probably working on that as we speak.
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Do you personally know any teachers?
 
zstep18 said:
Do you personally know any teachers?
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Funny you should ask, yes I know several. Every one of them went into teaching in their 30s after they failed at everything else they tried. They are all liberals and all pretty much worthless bums. When all else fails, teach.
 
sawyerloggingon said:
Funny you should ask, yes I know several. Every one of them went into teaching in their 30s after they failed at everything else they tried. They are all liberals and all pretty much worthless bums. When all else fails, teach.
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Apparently, you aren't very close with them.....since they're liberals and "worthless bums" and all.
 
The overworked thing ... it depends. Some years I'm constantly talking on the phone to parents, writing notes, brainstorming ways to make things better and doing piles of paperwork. Other years I have a smaller class with less behavior and academic issues. Likewise, some days are a breeze and some are from Hell. I rarely feel overworked and if I am, it's because I'm neurotic and and want everything to be just right.

I believe my job is important since I'm teaching the country's 6 year olds to read and write, but I also don't feel that every teacher should be put on a pedestal to be ooohed and awwwed at. I've seen my fair share of really crappy teachers. They don't deserve a pedestal, let alone a paycheck.

Therefore, I hate questions like this because it's assuming that all teachers equally work hard and are very good at their job. That's just not the case.
 
Over $700 billion are spent in defense around the world.
Less than $100 billion are spent in education.
Make your own conclusions
 
haymarket said:
Where did I bring this up?

And you are not just here to "figure out how it makes sense". Not by a long shot.

In order to do that one must first approach with an open mind.
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I will admit I'm not opened minded, and the chances I will accept what you say on the matter is close to none, but all the same I want to hear what you have to say.
 
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