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100% Speculation - Had McCain Won in 2008

If McCain had won in 2008

  • Everything would be remarkably better

    Votes: 1 5.3%

  • We'd be ten times worse off

    Votes: 2 10.5%

  • We'd be involved in more wars, but economy would be much better

    Votes: 2 10.5%

  • DODT would still be in effect

    Votes: 8 42.1%

  • Dem would win 2012 election with little challenge

    Votes: 9 47.4%

  • other - please explain

    Votes: 8 42.1%
  • Total voters
    19
Dragonfly

Dragonfly

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If John McCain had won in 2008 where would America be today?

unemployment
stock market
economy
housing
health care
education
political divisiveness
military engagement in Middle East
 
Dragonfly said:
If John McCain had won in 2008 where would America be today?

unemployment
stock market
economy
housing
health care
education
political divisiveness
military engagement in Middle East
Click to expand...


  • Unemployment: I'd like to think that McCain would have held a big business summit at the White House and asked "the experts" what the government could do to stimulate the economy.
  • Stock Market: I don't see it making much difference.
  • Economy: See Unemployment.
  • Housing: I'd like to think that McCain's administration would have done more for the homeowner. Obama's done nothing effective.
  • Healthcare: We wouldn't have the ACA. (I would regret that.)
  • Education: No idea.
  • Political Divisiveness: Since we wouldn't have the ACA, I think we'd have had less divisiveness. Republicans in the House and Senate got rightfully pissed with the administration's "down your throats" style.
  • Military Engagement in the Middle East: I think we'd be out of Iraq. I think the Administration would have taken a hard look at the Rules of Engagement in Afghanistan and, possibly, many civilian and military casualties would have been avoided. Oh. And OBL would still be dead.
 
Dragonfly said:
If John McCain had won in 2008 where would America be today?

unemployment
stock market
economy
housing
health care
education
political divisiveness
military engagement in Middle East
Click to expand...
In nearly the same place we are now. We'd probably even have a similar version of healthcare reform, to be honest.
 
**** would still be the same.
 
Dragonfly said:
If John McCain had won in 2008 where would America be today?

unemployment
stock market
economy
housing
Click to expand...

All of those would be remarkably similar.


health care
Click to expand...

I would not be surprised if a major health care plan would have been passed, but it would have been probably quite different. Too many variables to say for sure what it would have looked like or if it would be better or not, or even for sure it would have happened.

education
political divisiveness
military engagement in Middle East
Click to expand...

All pretty similar.
 
I believe things would be better partisan wise considerably. I dont believe the teaparty would have been as successful nor would there be as much stonewalling. I do not believe there would be any health care at all. The economy would be the same as well as unemployment...if there was an improvement it wouldnt be because of what McCain did it would be that the rich corporatists were cooperating more and not holding back to destroy obama..
 
unemployment
stock market
economy
Click to expand...

This might surprise some people, but I think these things would all be slightly better if McCain had won. Not because McCain's policy would have differed substantially from Obama's (I think they'd have been very similar), but because congressional Republicans would have been more cooperative on economic stimulus and less willing to do things to intentionally harm the economy.

housing
Click to expand...

No real difference.

health care
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Substantially worse. I never got the impression that McCain cared that much about health care...certainly not enough to push through any kind of major reform.

education
Click to expand...

No real change.

political divisiveness
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Probably better off. If only because so much of the hatred for Obama has very ugly racist connotations.

military engagement in Middle East
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Worse off. We'd probably still be in Iraq in some capacity, and we probably would have gotten more militarily involved in the Arab Spring than we did.
 
Kandahar said:
This might surprise some people, but I think these things would all be slightly better if McCain had won. Not because McCain's policy would have differed substantially from Obama's (I think they'd have been very similar), but because congressional Republicans would have been more cooperative on economic stimulus and less willing to do things to intentionally harm the economy.



No real difference.



Substantially worse. I never got the impression that McCain cared that much about health care...certainly not enough to push through any kind of major reform.



No real change.



Probably better off. If only because so much of the hatred for Obama has very ugly racist connotations.



Worse off. We'd probably still be in Iraq in some capacity, and we probably would have gotten more militarily involved in the Arab Spring than we did.
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So you're thinking that Obama would have been much more successful had the republicans done what was right for the country instead of simply roadblocking everything because Obama is a democrat?
 
Dragonfly said:
So you're thinking that Obama would have been much more successful had the republicans done what was right for the country instead of simply roadblocking everything because Obama is a democrat?
Click to expand...

Yeah. If McCain had been elected and pushed for economic stimulus like any other president would, it would be a lot more difficult for congressional Republicans to rant against evil Kenyan socialist tyranny and to vote en masse against stimulus. And from a sheer political perspective, it would be their asses on the line for ensuring an economic recovery. IMO the incentives would be more aligned for congressional cooperation even though the actual policy would be more or less the same.
 
we'd still have a significant presence in Iraq, and our involvement in Afghanistan would be larger and without an end in sight.

wall street would still be doing fine with a lousy economy for everyone else. i don't think that there would be a large difference in the unemployment rate.

the 2010 elections would have been different. there was no "republican revolution" without Clinton, and there wouldn't have been one without Obama.

there would be grassroots anger at McCain from the right as there was under Bush, but we wouldn't be seeing large tea party protests. we would, however, be seeing large anti-war protests. additionally, the occupy movement would probably be larger and more organized with McCain to use as an Emmanuel Goldstein to rally against.

in the 2012 election, McCain would have a tougher road due to overwhelming Republican fatigue. it would be possible to paint the economic malaise as purely the result of Bush / supply side economics, and to differentiate that from the Clinton years.
 
Kandahar said:
Yeah. If McCain had been elected and pushed for economic stimulus like any other president would, it would be a lot more difficult for congressional Republicans to rant against evil Kenyan socialist tyranny and to vote en masse against stimulus. And from a sheer political perspective, it would be their asses on the line for ensuring an economic recovery. IMO the incentives would be more aligned for congressional cooperation even though the actual policy would be more or less the same.
Click to expand...

So any "failure" under Obama isn't really Obama's fault, but really the fault of the hyper-partisan republicans who'd rather see the country suffer than vote for anything practical or beneficial because it would reflect better on the democratic president?
 
-Unemployment would be a little better, maybe around 7%
-Less progress on getting out of Iraq and Afghanistan
-More directly involved in the Arab Spring. Egg on his face when they later thumb their noses at us and elect the Muslim Brotherhood
-Less divisiveness as I attribute almost all of it today to the behavior and instigation of the conservative pundits, which in the case of McCain would not have defined as an enomy of America and treated as such.
 
Helix said:
we'd still have a significant presence in Iraq, and our involvement in Afghanistan would be larger and without an end in sight.

wall street would still be doing fine with a lousy economy for everyone else. i don't think that there would be a large difference in the unemployment rate.

the 2010 elections would have been different. there was no "republican revolution" without Clinton, and there wouldn't have been one without Obama.

there would be grassroots anger at McCain from the right as there was under Bush, but we wouldn't be seeing large tea party protests. we would, however, be seeing large anti-war protests. additionally, the occupy movement would probably be larger and more organized with McCain to use as an Emmanuel Goldstein to rally against.

in the 2012 election, McCain would have a tougher road due to overwhelming Republican fatigue. it would be possible to paint the economic malaise as purely the result of Bush / supply side economics, and to differentiate that from the Clinton years.
Click to expand...

Quoted for truth...
 
Dragonfly said:
So any "failure" under Obama isn't really Obama's fault,
Click to expand...

Depends what failure we're talking about.

but really the fault of the hyper-partisan republicans who'd rather see the country suffer than vote for anything practical or beneficial because it would reflect better on the democratic president?
Click to expand...

The Republicans certainly opposed policies that they knew perfectly well to be practical and beneficial. And we know this because they themselves were proposing very similar things just a few years ago.
 
Dragonfly said:
If John McCain had won in 2008 where would America be today?

unemployment
stock market
economy
housing
health care
education
political divisiveness
military engagement in Middle East
Click to expand...

Most things would be about the same, with the notable exception of ObamaCare.

Unemployment might be slightly better, but not enough to really remark upon it. The stock market took a huge hit at the end of the Bush era, and has rebounded fairly well. Pretty much everything else except for Obama care would be about the same.
 
Dragonfly said:
So any "failure" under Obama isn't really Obama's fault, but really the fault of the hyper-partisan republicans who'd rather see the country suffer than vote for anything practical or beneficial because it would reflect better on the democratic president?
Click to expand...

You are aware that Obama doesn't really create any legislation. That is the purpose of the "Legislative" branch of government and not the "Executive" branch of government. So yes, to answer your question, it is the fault of the hyper-partisan republicans who refuse to move on any real legislature that would benefit either jobs, or conditions in the housing market.
 
Dragonfly said:
If John McCain had won in 2008 where would America be today?

unemployment
stock market
economy
housing
health care
education
political divisiveness
military engagement in Middle East
Click to expand...

The economy would be barely better, but still atrocious. McCain would have put in place many of the same economic policies as Obama, but on a slightly smaller scale. Democrats would be blaming "trickle-down". :roll:

Political divisiveness would be lessened because no one would like McCain. 2012 would be a Democrat Stomp as conservatives stayed home and liberals came out in droves while independents went Democrat.

We would, however, have been smart enough to bomb the Syrian government, rather than the Libyan one.
 
The last three options.

Other: The economy would be exactly the same. We'd still be in slow recovery. Presidents have little to do with the ebbs and flows of business cycles.
 
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