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Obama Tax supporters=what is more important to you

Obama Tax Supporters=What is more Important to You

  • Saving the tax cuts for yourself (and the rich)

    Votes: 1 9.1%

  • Sticking it to the rich with a tax hike for everyone

    Votes: 10 90.9%
  • Total voters
    11
TurtleDude

TurtleDude

warrior of the wetlands
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1) Keeping the Bush/Obama tax rates for the "middle class"


2) sticking it to the rich with a tax hike
 
TurtleDude said:
Saving the tax cuts for yourself (and the rich)
Sticking it to the rich with a tax hike for everyone
Click to expand...

Why would saving tax cuts for the middle class necessitate saving them for the rich as well? The Democrats hold all the cards here. If push comes to shove, they can do absolutely nothing and all the tax cuts will expire. Then they can introduce a tax cut for the middle-class...and what Republican would dare oppose it?
 
We should let the Bush tax-cuts expire and then permanenty reduce the tax-rate for the middle-class.

Plus we should add tax-credits for businesses who hire new people.....or re-hire layed off folks.

and other tax-incentives & loans to get the economy going, paid for with the revenue from the rich's old tax-rate.
 
johnny_rebson said:
If you want the wealthy to continue creating jobs, the Bush tax cuts for the wealthy need to be renewed.
Click to expand...

Um...if the wealthy are creating all these jobs, where are they?
 
TurtleDude said:
1) Keeping the Bush/Obama tax rates for the "middle class"


2) sticking it to the rich with a tax hike
Click to expand...

Neither. Income taxes should be raised five points across the board. Inheritance and estate taxes should be abolished and them oney taxed as income according to the normal schedules. The same with capital gains tax.

Now Turtle - before you give us standard Turtle Talking points 5, 6 and 7, - how do you intend to solve the federal deficit WITHOUT a significant tax icnrease?

Or is it your intention to bend our children and grand children over the table to pay for what we refuse to be adult enough to pay for?

You keep coming out AGAINST tax increases across the board but you never ever ever say how you plan on erasing the deficit and debt with an actual practical and pragmatic plan.
 
Kandahar said:
Why would saving tax cuts for the middle class necessitate saving them for the rich as well? The Democrats hold all the cards here. If push comes to shove, they can do absolutely nothing and all the tax cuts will expire. Then they can introduce a tax cut for the middle-class...and what Republican would dare oppose it?
Click to expand...

Answer: every last one of the ideological driven SOB's. Every last one of them.
 
Kandahar said:
Why would saving tax cuts for the middle class necessitate saving them for the rich as well? The Democrats hold all the cards here. If push comes to shove, they can do absolutely nothing and all the tax cuts will expire. Then they can introduce a tax cut for the middle-class...and what Republican would dare oppose it?
Click to expand...

you are assuming the dems will hold both houses. I don't think the dems will get congress or hold the senate. so the GOP will give Obama an all or nothing bill if he were able to win.

right now I give the GOP 80% of holding the house, 65% of getting the senate and 50-50 on the WH
 
TurtleDude said:
you are assuming the dems will hold both houses. I don't think the dems will get congress or hold the senate.
Click to expand...

I am assuming no such thing. The tax cuts expire on December 31, 2012. The new Congress does not take office until January.

so the GOP will give Obama an all or nothing bill if he were able to win.
Click to expand...

Then he can veto it, and tell them to take out the tax cuts for the rich and send it back to him. What's so difficult about that?
 
Kandahar said:
I am assuming no such thing. The tax cuts expire on December 31, 2012. The new Congress does not take office until January.



Then he can veto it, and tell them to take out the tax cuts for the rich and send it back to him. What's so difficult about that?
Click to expand...

well if the GOP is in control the bill sent to whomever is president is making the current tax cuts permanent.

a stick it to the rich bill won't be sent to the President
 
Kandahar said:
I am assuming no such thing. The tax cuts expire on December 31, 2012. The new Congress does not take office until January.



Then he can veto it, and tell them to take out the tax cuts for the rich and send it back to him. What's so difficult about that?
Click to expand...

The GOP will say all or nothing and Obama will to be on record vetoing a bill he signed into law a couple years ago

that will really help that turd's standing
 
TurtleDude said:
The GOP will say all or nothing and Obama will to be on record vetoing a bill he signed into law a couple years ago
Click to expand...

And as a matter of politics, the Democrats have the upper hand too. "The Republicans are holding your tax cuts hostage to tax cuts for the rich" is a much better soundbite than "The Democrats are holding your tax cuts hostage because they won't agree to not raise taxes on the rich."
 
Last edited:
tecoyah said:
Um...if the wealthy are creating all these jobs, where are they?
Click to expand...

Anybody else find it hilarious that democrats will lean on the "there are no jobs" defense in order to justify hiking taxes on the more productive....

but as soon as you claim that the Stimulus has been a failure and that the Obama administration has been a massive wet blanket on job creation, they loudly insist that in fact there has been turn-around and jobs a-plenty?
 
TurtleDude said:
well if the GOP is in control the bill sent to whomever is president is making the current tax cuts permanent.

a stick it to the rich bill won't be sent to the President
Click to expand...

They don't have to send a stick-it-to-the-rich bill to the president. They can just do nothing and the tax rates will automatically go up, "sticking it to the rich." They can just vote to make the tax cuts for everyone else permanent.
 
Kandahar said:
And as a matter of politics, the Democrats have the upper hand too. "The Republicans are holding your tax cuts hostage for tax cuts on the rich" is a much better soundbite than "The Democrats are holding your tax cuts hostage because they won't agree to not raise taxes on the rich."
Click to expand...

I think I would just play the bit about Obama saying that in a recession, you don't want to raise taxes on anyone on loop. Then I would remind everyone that Democrats voted in 2010 when they held massive majorities to extend all the Bush tax cuts. Then I would ask if this means that Democrats now think that we are in good economic times, to where we can take a hit and sustain losing more jobs?
 
cpwill said:
Anybody else find it hilarious that democrats will lean on the "there are no jobs" defense in order to justify hiking taxes on the more productive....

but as soon as you claim that the Stimulus has been a failure and that the Obama administration has been a massive wet blanket on job creation, they loudly insist that in fact there has been turn-around and jobs a-plenty?
Click to expand...

Economic stimulus is successful to the extent that it puts more money in the pockets of consumers (i.e. the poor and middle-class). Many large businesses are sitting on top of mountains of cash that they aren't spending, because there isn't enough consumer demand to justify it. Although our economy has many problems, a lack of cash for businesses seeking to expand is not one of them.
 
TurtleDude said:
1) Keeping the Bush/Obama tax rates for the "middle class"


2) sticking it to the rich with a tax hike
Click to expand...

Neither. We need to cut spending and raise taxes. Bottom line. I pay taxes, and I'm willing to pay more.
 
Boo Radley said:
Neither. We need to cut spending and raise taxes. Bottom line. I pay taxes, and I'm willing to pay more.
Click to expand...

I am not until the government proves that it can really make cuts-

I am not until the middle class pays the same share of the income tax as their share of the income
 
Kandahar said:
Economic stimulus is successful to the extent that it puts more money in the pockets of consumers (i.e. the poor and middle-class). Many large businesses are sitting on top of mountains of cash that they aren't spending, because there isn't enough consumer demand to justify it. Although our economy has many problems, a lack of cash for businesses seeking to expand is not one of them.
Click to expand...

large businesses are not those who create the majority of new jobs - that distinction belongs to small businesses, which are typically owned by individuals who file their business under individual tax returns.

And the stimulus was sold as a way to create jobs, and it will thus be measured by it's success at meeting predictions regarding employment. It was not sold as a wealth-redistribution scheme, and is not going to be judged a success or failure on the extent to which it did so.
 
cpwill said:
large businesses are not those who create the majority of new jobs - that distinction belongs to small businesses, which are typically owned by individuals who file their business under individual tax returns....
Click to expand...

and what is stopping them from incorporating?

I have friends who are incorporated.
 
Other, eliminate the tax cuts for the wealthy and extend the tax cuts for the middle class as that will have the most positive effect on the economy.
 
cpwill said:
I think I would just play the bit about Obama saying that in a recession, you don't want to raise taxes on anyone on loop. Then I would remind everyone that Democrats voted in 2010 when they held massive majorities to extend all the Bush tax cuts. Then I would ask if this means that Democrats now think that we are in good economic times, to where we can take a hit and sustain losing more jobs?
Click to expand...

That's fine, but very few people's opinions are going to be swayed about tax policy based on what Obama or congressional Democrats said or did a couple years ago. The fact remains that Republicans are on the losing end of a very powerful soundbite. Most people simply think that the wealthy should pay more in taxes, and therefore "the Republicans are holding your tax rates hostage" is more effective than the analogous counterattack. The GOP will almost certainly come out looking worse than the Democrats from any end-of-year scuffle over tax rates...and if Obama is reelected they will lose the substantive battle too, since the Democrats don't have to do anything in order for the tax cuts for the rich to expire.
 
Catawba said:
Other, eliminate the tax cuts for the wealthy and extend the tax cuts for the middle class as that will have the most positive effect on the economy.
Click to expand...

I figured the Obama tax fans would not be able to provide an answer

what means more to you

keeping your tax cuts if it means I keep mine

or sticking it to us "evil rich" but having to suffer a tax hike yourself

what is more important

hikes for everyone

current tax rates for everyone?
 
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