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Obama Tax supporters=what is more important to you

Obama Tax Supporters=What is more Important to You

  • Saving the tax cuts for yourself (and the rich)

    Votes: 1 9.1%
  • Sticking it to the rich with a tax hike for everyone

    Votes: 10 90.9%

  • Total voters
    11
That's fine, but very few people's opinions are going to be swayed about tax policy based on what Obama or congressional Democrats said or did a couple years ago.

that is correct - this merely negates the attempted "perception" victory by demonstrating that Democrats are not acting in what they perceive to be the nations' best interests, but rather in what they perceive to be their political best interests.

The fact remains that Republicans are on the losing end of a very powerful soundbite. Most people simply think that the wealthy should pay more in taxes, and therefore "the Republicans are holding your tax rates hostage" is more effective than the analogous counterattack. The GOP will almost certainly come out looking worse than the Democrats from any end-of-year scuffle over tax rates...and if Obama is reelected they will lose the substantive battle too, since the Democrats don't have to do anything in order for the tax cuts for the rich to expire.

I think you are overestimating the salience of this. People care alot more about growth than tax rates, which is why they trust Romney more on economic issues.
 
large businesses are not those who create the majority of new jobs - that distinction belongs to small businesses, which are typically owned by individuals who file their business under individual tax returns.

But the same thing applies to small businesses. The credit crunch of 2008-2010 was a temporary phenomenon resulting from the financial crisis. Lack of consumer demand is a far bigger drag on hiring than a lack of money.

And the stimulus was sold as a way to create jobs, and it will thus be measured by it's success at meeting predictions regarding employment. It was not sold as a wealth-redistribution scheme, and is not going to be judged a success or failure on the extent to which it did so.

Agreed. And providing consumers with more cash will stimulate consumer demand, which in turn will remove the greatest roadblock to more hiring.
 
Neither. Income taxes should be raised five points across the board. Inheritance and estate taxes should be abolished and them oney taxed as income according to the normal schedules. The same with capital gains tax.

Now Turtle - before you give us standard Turtle Talking points 5, 6 and 7, - how do you intend to solve the federal deficit WITHOUT a significant tax icnrease?

Or is it your intention to bend our children and grand children over the table to pay for what we refuse to be adult enough to pay for?

You keep coming out AGAINST tax increases across the board but you never ever ever say how you plan on erasing the deficit and debt with an actual practical and pragmatic plan.

Actually, I think raising everyone's taxes 5% is an excellent idea.

My problem with any increase, however, is that we have absolutely no reason to believe the extra revenue will reduce the deficit. Absolutely none.
 
I figured the Obama tax fans would not be able to provide an answer

what means more to you

keeping your tax cuts if it means I keep mine

or sticking it to us "evil rich" but having to suffer a tax hike yourself

what is more important

hikes for everyone

current tax rates for everyone?

I provided an answer, its just one that those of the far right don't like. There is no need to choose all or nothing. The working class have been shown there is no longer a reason to continue to allow the tax cuts for the wealthy. The plan is to extend the tax cuts for the middle class and eliminate the tax cuts for the wealthy as that is the best way to stimulate the economy.
 
Actually, I think raising everyone's taxes 5% is an excellent idea.

My problem with any increase, however, is that we have absolutely no reason to believe the extra revenue will reduce the deficit. Absolutely none.


why do you believe in giving a wasteful bloated government more money when you already admit it would do nothing to reduce the deficit

why cannot people DEMAND that there be SIGNIFICANT cuts before anyone pays another extra dime to this hog of a government?
 
Actually, I think raising everyone's taxes 5% is an excellent idea.

My problem with any increase, however, is that we have absolutely no reason to believe the extra revenue will reduce the deficit. Absolutely none.

It is why you cut costs too. People need to realize to really get a handle on this debt, taxes need to go up and spending needs to go down. Doing one or the other will not do it.
 
I provided an answer, its just one that those of the far right don't like. There is no need to choose all or nothing. The working class have been shown there is no longer a reason to continue to allow the tax cuts for the wealthy. The plan is to extend the tax cuts for the middle class and eliminate the tax cuts for the wealthy as that is the best way to stimulate the economy.

You are afraid to say what means more to you?

keeping YOUR tax cut or sticking it to the rich

its a hypothetical

and why does it stimulate the economy to allow someone making 199K a year in Arkansas but not to allow someone making 275 K a year In NYC

in economic reality land-the amount of discretionary income might be much larger with the former

your boy's artificial and idiotic line that starts at 200K is just plain stupid
 
It is why you cut costs too. People need to realize to really get a handle on this debt, taxes need to go up and spending needs to go down. Doing one or the other will not do it.

I think anyone who remembers what happened with the promised Dem spending cuts under Reagan and GHWB will not trust the government until the massive cuts come FIRST
 
I think anyone who remembers what happened with the promised Dem spending cuts under Reagan and GHWB will not trust the government until the massive cuts come FIRST

There should be no reason to trust that the opposite will happen either. The both have to happen at the same time.
 
We won't be creating any new jobs if we don't get the tax cuts we want.
 
We won't be creating any new jobs if we don't get the tax cuts we want.

Good, then the economy and nation will suffer. Good to know that if you don't get what you want then you will cry like a little girl.
 
There should be no reason to trust that the opposite will happen either. The both have to happen at the same time.

why should we give a wasteful government any more money until it drastically cuts the waste

we all know that people who use government spending to buy votes need those tax hikes to justify continuity of that spending

spending cuts of a significant amount would be the death knell of the political careers of those whose main argument for holding office is giving the money of some to their constituents in terms of government spending
 
You are afraid to say what means more to you?

keeping YOUR tax cut or sticking it to the rich

its a hypothetical

and why does it stimulate the economy to allow someone making 199K a year in Arkansas but not to allow someone making 275 K a year In NYC

in economic reality land-the amount of discretionary income might be much larger with the former

your boy's artificial and idiotic line that starts at 200K is just plain stupid


No speaka the English or something? All the Democrats need to do is let the all of the tax cuts expire, and then just renew the middle class tax cuts and dare the GOP to vote against them. Middle class tax cuts stimulate the economy by creating consumer demand for production, the Bush tax cuts for the wealthy have demonstrated no benefit to the economy or the working class so there is no reason for people to continue to allow them.
 
Good, then the economy and nation will suffer. Good to know that if you don't get what you want then you will cry like a little girl.

I find that idiotic. Tax hikes are far more likely to hurt this economy than creating some certainty with making the current tax rates permanent or switching to a congress-castrating tax plan such as a NST or "Fair Tax"
 
why should we give a wasteful government any more money until it drastically cuts the waste

we all know that people who use government spending to buy votes need those tax hikes to justify continuity of that spending

spending cuts of a significant amount would be the death knell of the political careers of those whose main argument for holding office is giving the money of some to their constituents in terms of government spending

Hence why I said they need to happen at the same time.
 
No speaka the English or something? All the Democrats need to do is let the all of the tax cuts expire, and then just renew the middle class tax cuts and dare the GOP to vote against them. Middle class tax cuts stimulate the economy by creating consumer demand for production, the Bush tax cuts for the wealthy have demonstrated no benefit to the economy or the working class so there is no reason for people to continue to allow them.


Uh the bill that is going to be presented to whomever is president is a permanent tax rate that we have now

I am sorry that you cannot read something everyone else was able to
 
I find that idiotic. Tax hikes are far more likely to hurt this economy than creating some certainty with making the current tax rates permanent or switching to a congress-castrating tax plan such as a NST or "Fair Tax"

Really you don't find anything childish in saying that if we don't get what we want, then we won't do anything? That is exactly what he is saying.
 
Hence why I said they need to happen at the same time.

how can there be proof of the cuts if that happens. we need to see that they actually take place first

I don't trust the government to merely promise that
 
Really you don't find anything childish in saying that if we don't get what we want, then we won't do anything? That is exactly what he is saying.

what is really childish is saying those who pay 40% of the income tax and all the death/estate tax don't pay their fair share

nothing in the tax debate is more dishonest than that
 
We won't be creating any new jobs if we don't get the tax cuts we want.

Where are the new jobs from the last decade of tax cuts for the rich????? You can't have production without demand, and you can't have demand when most of the wealth is concentrated in just a few at the top.
 
how can there be proof of the cuts if that happens. we need to see that they actually take place first

I don't trust the government to merely promise that

I don't trust that once spending cuts happen that the taxes side will then occur. To make sure both sides keep their part of the bargain it should happen at the same time.
 
Uh the bill that is going to be presented to whomever is president is a permanent tax rate that we have now

I am sorry that you cannot read something everyone else was able to

The tax rate is whatever the voters decide it will be. As I said, since the tax cuts for the wealthy did not create jobs as advertized, there is no reason for the voters to continue to allow tax cuts for the wealthy.
 
I don't trust that once spending cuts happen that the taxes side will then occur. To make sure both sides keep their part of the bargain it should happen at the same time.

When was the last true spending cut? ever? not a slowdown of growth but a real cut (outside of defense)
 
The tax rate is whatever the voters decide it will be. As I said, since the tax cuts for the wealthy did not create jobs as advertized, there is no reason for the voters to continue to allow tax cuts for the wealthy.

I love your appeal to mediocrity
 
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