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Is it Patriotic to have money in offshore accounts?

Is it patriotic to have money if offshore accounts?

  • Yes it is perfectly fine.

    Votes: 15 57.7%

  • No it is wrong, and unpatriotic.

    Votes: 11 42.3%
  • Total voters
    26
Zyphlin said:
-edited since I've more closely read Graham's comments and realized that the OP was putting words in his mouth implying Graham suggested it was "patriotic" for Romney to do it-
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I didn't put words in anyone's mouth. I was simply asking the question that I wanted answered. And just for the record, I voted "Yes it is perfectly fine"
 
PeteEU said:
More right wing horse****. The Greek people work harder and longer than Americans. They pay relatively low taxes and their "entitlements" are rather poor compared to many other countries. Their problem is lack of tax collection and corruption. Using the tired and debunked "high tax, big entitlement state" crap is just that... crap and does not reflect reality.
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Greece also provides an object lesson to those who believe that budget deficits are the result of low taxes. Greek taxes run as high as 40 percent on incomes above €70,000 per year. There is also a 19 percent value-added tax (VAT) on all goods and services sold in the country. Corporate tax rates, as is the case with most countries, are lower than those in the United States, but still high at 24 percent. Capital gains are taxed at rates ranging from 5 percent to 20 percent or included in corporate income. Dividends are taxed at 10 percent and are subject to corporate taxes. By far the largest tax, however, is the payroll tax. Employers must contribute 28 percent of wages to the government's social-insurance schemes, and workers contribute another 16 percent directly, making the total payroll-tax burden 44 percent of wages. Overall, the Greek government takes in more than 38 percent of GDP in taxes.
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Hellenic Handbasket | Michael D. Tanner | Cato Institute: Commentary
 
Bigfoot 88 said:
Well, you are overlooking a couple of things.

1-Offshore accounts can be used to invest in the U.S.

2-Smart investors will invest in offshore anyways, because it is in their interest. If the government doesn't get its act together, it is the government's fault for driving our capital and not the investor.

As for the "common good", the government is sending it to hell and has been for decades.
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Sounds like lots of selfserving justification simply to look out for yourself while giving the Italian salute to your fellow Americans.

And that is what disturbs so many Americans about Mittens.

You probably cannot change that mentality in a wannabe robber baron. But for my President - no thank you.
 
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haymarket said:
Sounds like lots of selfserving justification simply to look out for yourself while giving the Italian salute to your fellow Americans.

And that is what disturbs so many Americans about Mittens.
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People, especially selfish people like you, don't deserve anything they don't earn.
 
Bigfoot 88 said:
People, especially selfish people like you, don't deserve anything they don't earn.
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Why do you stoop to a personal attack about something you are clearly ignorant about?

Everything I have is because I have earned it.
 
haymarket said:
Why do you stoop to a personal attack about something you are clearly ignorant about?

Everything I have is because I have earned it.
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Yet you deserve Mitt Romney's offshore account funds. No, you don't. I don't either.
 
Bigfoot 88 said:
Yet you deserve Mitt Romney's offshore account funds. No, you don't. I don't either.
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I do not want nor deserve Mitt Romneys off shore accounts. I have no idea where you get such beliefs from. Do you?
 
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PeteEU said:
More right wing horse****. The Greek people work harder and longer than Americans. They pay relatively low taxes and their "entitlements" are rather poor compared to many other countries. Their problem is lack of tax collection and corruption. Using the tired and debunked "high tax, big entitlement state" crap is just that... crap and does not reflect reality.
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Maybe longer, but certainly not harder. The ones who work long hours in Greece are self employed. They are pretty much sitting in the store waiting for customers.

Lets rather look at dependent employment, the ones who are employed by an employer. Because sitting at a store waiting for customers is not much work. And multiply that number with work participation. When we do that, Greece is far from being at the top. If we include breaks, and unproductive work. I am sure Greece ends up close to the bottom.

Greeks are lazy, and yes they are way too dependent on the government. The government spends 50% of GDP which is at Scandinavian/french levels. A lot of welfare in Greece is middle class welfare, who they want someone else to provide.

WorkHours-1.png
 
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haymarket said:
You are confusing legality for an individual with what is good for America and its people.
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So should "real" americans only buy american cars? Is it unpatriotic to shop at Wal-Mart as a large % of their merchandise comes from china? In fact is it bordering on treason to use any american cash outside of the good ol USA?
I think you will find that if all americans stopped doing these things America will be doing worrse not be doing worse not better.
 
If "atypical" mean neither typical nor not typical...

...and "apolitical" means essentially not taking sides, and/or not being politically-minded, in political matters...

...then maybe we should coin a new word for this question... apatriotic
 
I think some of you are missing the point. The point isn't that he should not be allowed to have offshore accounts, but rather that he is doing this to avoid paying taxes on money that he made by the grace of working and profiting from the US system. He made his money here, he should pay taxes on that money. Most of if not all of his money is already being taxed at a lower rate than what you and I pay in taxes, yet he wants to offshore it so he pays NO taxes? Seems a little wrong to me, and for someone aspiring to hold the highest position in office it seems a little unpatriotic.

Just my two cents.
 
Camlon said:
Maybe longer, but certainly not harder. The ones who work long hours in Greece are self employed. They are pretty much sitting in the store waiting for customers.

Lets rather look at dependent employment, the ones who are employed by an employer. Because sitting at a store waiting for customers is not much work. And multiply that number with work participation. When we do that, Greece is far from being at the top. If we include breaks, and unproductive work. I am sure Greece ends up close to the bottom.

Greeks are lazy, and yes they are way too dependent on the government. The government spends 50% of GDP which is at Scandinavian/french levels. A lot of welfare in Greece is middle class welfare, who they want someone else to provide.

WorkHours-1.png
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I'd like for you to post the sourcs for your table and for the assertion that Greece spoent 50% of GDP. And spends it on what?
 
megaprogman said:
Off shore accounts and patriotism have nothing to do with each other.
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Patriotism, devotion to one's country and it's leaders. And Romney's is one of the leaders demonstrating the the correct way to behave.
 
How about offshore businesses? Many large corperations do things like selling their rights to their logos to another company. The other company is only madeup of the leaders of the corperation plus one foriegn empolyee. The company is essentially based in a PO box. The logo owner company is a foriegn company based often in the Cribian Islands. Rent for the logo is in the millions per year. Who would do this? The people that privide jobs for Americans, they are real patriots.
 
OhIsee.Then said:
How about offshore businesses? Many large corperations do things like selling their rights to their logos to another company. The other company is only madeup of the leaders of the corperation plus one foriegn empolyee. The company is essentially based in a PO box. The logo owner company is a foriegn company based often in the Cribian Islands. Rent for the logo is in the millions per year. Who would do this? The people that privide jobs for Americans, they are real patriots.
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Big difference between selling something to foreign companies and stashing money in foreign banks to avoid US taxes.
 
Daktoria said:
Fiddy, c'mon. Use some reading comprehension, will you?

It's like saying there are kids in gym class who screw up in playing baseball because they're forced to play baseball without being taught the rules. He doesn't want kids to be forced to play baseball anymore without being taught.

That's why he says, "Pick a rate and make people pay it." If everyone knows the rules of the game, then nobody can cheat.

Seems patriotic enough. It's easy to be a fan of a game when you understand how it's played. Senator Graham is basically hinting at a flat tax or fair tax.
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Are we in disagreement somehow, because I don't sense it, except I would remove patriotism from the discussion entirely.
 
OnWisconsin said:
I didn't put words in anyone's mouth. I was simply asking the question that I wanted answered. And just for the record, I voted "Yes it is perfectly fine"
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Oh, stop. You know what you did.
 
jet57 said:
I'd like for you to post the sourcs for your table and for the assertion that Greece spoent 50% of GDP. And spends it on what?
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Sure:

Work Hours
Go to OECD stats, check Labour and Average hours actually worked, and check dependent employment.

Employment Rate:
List of countries by employment rate - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Government expenditure by function
Go to OECD stats check Annual National Accounts, and General Government expenditure by function

Government spending as a percentage of GDP
Go to OECD stats, check National Accounts at a Glance, General Government.

But I have feeling that you are going to check none of the sources, and are not really interested. Am I right?
 
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You should have had a neutral choice. It's neither patriotic nor unpatriotic. Someone might have an offshore account for a crooked reason or a legitimate one. I used to have a Swiss bank account. I was living in Switzerland and needed it.
 
OnWisconsin said:
I think some of you are missing the point. The point isn't that he should not be allowed to have offshore accounts, but rather that he is doing this to avoid paying taxes on money that he made by the grace of working and profiting from the US system. He made his money here, he should pay taxes on that money. Most of if not all of his money is already being taxed at a lower rate than what you and I pay in taxes, yet he wants to offshore it so he pays NO taxes? Seems a little wrong to me, and for someone aspiring to hold the highest position in office it seems a little unpatriotic.

Just my two cents.
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It might be wrong from a liberal or progressive standpoint, but he doesn't share the same view of taxes as you do, so relative to his own perspective, his actions wouldn't be unpatriotic. If he does have offshore accounts because of the lower taxes, it's likely that he wants the United States to have similarly lower taxes and will attempt to make that happen while in office. It's similar to a situation where the school superintendent of a horrible public school system sends his kids to private schools while he tries to improve the current system. It's not that he's disloyal to his school system, but that he doesn't believe that the school system, which he is trying to improve, is at the standard it needs to be.
 
ThePlayDrive said:
It might be wrong from a liberal or progressive standpoint, but he doesn't share the same view of taxes as you do, so relative to his own perspective, his actions wouldn't be unpatriotic. If he does have offshore accounts because of the lower taxes, it's likely that he wants the United States to have similarly lower taxes and will attempt to make that happen while in office. It's similar to a situation where the school superintendent of a horrible public school system sends his kids to private schools while he tries to improve the current system. It's not that he's disloyal to his school system, but that he doesn't believe that the school system, which he is trying to improve, is at the standard it needs to be.
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Wow, what an equate. And the superintendent has found a way to have a dollar for dollar deduction in his taxes for his expense of sending his kids to a private school. Oh, and he is on the private schools board too. I could go on, but ...
 
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OnWisconsin said:
Big difference between selling something to foreign companies and stashing money in foreign banks to avoid US taxes.
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I don't understand your response to my post. Please consider that what is sold is the rights to an established logo. It's sold to foreign corporation that is wholly owned by the leadership of the US corporation plus one person to essentially maintain its PO Box. Your OK with that legal scam?
 
Luna Tick said:
You should have had a neutral choice. It's neither patriotic nor unpatriotic. Someone might have an offshore account for a crooked reason or a legitimate one. I used to have a Swiss bank account. I was living in Switzerland and needed it.
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:( so sad that you hate America enough not to bend economic reality to something more politically correct.
 
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