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Most anti-libertarian Presidents

Most anti-libertarian President?

  • Abraham Lincoln

    Votes: 10 25.6%
  • Woodrow Wilson

    Votes: 4 10.3%
  • Franklin Roosevelt

    Votes: 14 35.9%
  • Theodore Roosevelt

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Lyndon Johnson

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • George W. Bush

    Votes: 3 7.7%
  • Richard Nixon

    Votes: 2 5.1%
  • Herbert Hoover

    Votes: 1 2.6%
  • Barack Obama

    Votes: 2 5.1%
  • Other

    Votes: 3 7.7%

  • Total voters
    39

Bigfoot 88

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This is a poll on the President whose time in office was the most opposite to libertarian ideas and principles.

EDIT: Anybody can vote, not just libertarians. If you are not sure what exactly constitutes libertarian, check out this site: http://www.libertarianism.org/
 
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Perhaps they first have to define which type of libertarian they want as the model?
 
Thomas Jefferson. Libertarians want to form a Hamiltonian elite of self-indulgent, upper-class, paper-empowered greedhead parasites.
 
I proudly cast the opening ballot. Unsing the right libertarians here as the guiding rubric - FDR should take this in a romp. The right wing libertarian crowd has made it a cause celebre to say bad things about FDR at every opportunity. Even when the opportunity is not there, they will create one as evidenced by polls such as this one.

So yup -its my favorite prez Franklin Delano Roosevelt tht stands as the opposite for (at least) right wing libertarianism.
 
Thomas Jefferson. Libertarians want to form a Hamiltonian elite of self-indulgent, upper-class, paper-empowered greedhead parasites.

As opposed to what? You? Who apparently want nothing more than to spout off hyperbole and nonsense?
 
I proudly cast the opening ballot. Unsing the right libertarians here as the guiding rubric - FDR should take this in a romp. The right wing libertarian crowd has made it a cause celebre to say bad things about FDR at every opportunity. Even when the opportunity is not there, they will create one as evidenced by polls such as this one.

So yup -its my favorite prez Franklin Delano Roosevelt tht stands as the opposite for (at least) right wing libertarianism.
I didn't create the poll specifically to bash FDR, but he is in my top 3, behind Wilson(whom I voted for), and Lincoln.
 
FDR and Lincoln have to be the 2 biggest "anti-libertarian" Presidents. I can't think of 2 other Presidents that have strengthened government as much.

2 of the most popular presidents in history as well
 
How can Lincoln be anti-Libertarian? The man single handedly ended slavery as an institution in the US. Not sure how you can argue somebody is anti-Libertarian when they removed the very antithesis to Libertarianism from the US landscape.
 
Thomas Jefferson. Libertarians want to form a Hamiltonian elite of self-indulgent, upper-class, paper-empowered greedhead parasites.



What a load of crap, given the current president has shut down my city for a political fund raiser at sex and the city chick's penthouse Apt, I'd say your cackling about "elites" is a bit misplaced.
 
How can Lincoln be anti-Libertarian? The man single handedly ended slavery as an institution in the US. Not sure how you can argue somebody is anti-Libertarian when they removed the very antithesis to Libertarianism from the US landscape.
suspended habeas corpus

and some would say forcing the south to stay in a voluntary union was the ultimate in anti libertarian attitudes
 
How can Lincoln be anti-Libertarian? The man single handedly ended slavery as an institution in the US. Not sure how you can argue somebody is anti-Libertarian when they removed the very antithesis to Libertarianism from the US landscape.

For one, because removing slavery was only an unintended consequence of his actions. Libertarians would have been abolitionists but they would have also been pro-secession, ala Lysander Spooner. Lincoln grew government enormously, fought a war against secession, and instituted "greenbacks", a fiat currency that caused mass inflation. There are also a great deal of civil liberties violations many would be shocked to learn.

 
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Lincoln grew government enormously, fought a war against secession, and instituted "greenbacks", a fiat currency that caused mass inflation. There are also a great deal of civil liberties violations many would be shocked to learn.

Also, little known fact. Lincoln was also a vampire hunter.

 
George Washington, John Adams, Abraham Lincoln, Theodore and Franklin Roosevelt, etc. etc.
 
How can Lincoln be anti-Libertarian? The man single handedly ended slavery as an institution in the US. Not sure how you can argue somebody is anti-Libertarian when they removed the very antithesis to Libertarianism from the US landscape.

his motivation was not to end slavery, it was to prevent secession. he was clear on that. Killing people to prevent them from self rule is as anti-libertarian as it gets.
 
I don't hear Washington and Adams that often.

Look closely at their clamp downs on civil liberties and uprisings and overall government vision.
 
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Look closely at their clamp downs on civil liberties and uprisings.
True. Off the top of my head, the Whiskey Rebellion and the original Alien and Seditions Acts comes to mind.
 
True. Off the top of my head, the Whiskey Rebellion and the original Alien and Seditions Acts comes to mind.

Then look at their orientation of government's role in ruling over the population. Much of libertarianism is a great deal more friendly toward the anti-Federalists than the Federalists.
 
At the top.

Then it appears that I crashed this party early. To answer the question, it's pretty tough.

Lincoln was obviously against the States right to secession, even if the people of the separatist states felt they were being harmed by the federal union. However, he did extend The Peoples rights to "negroes". I don't think he's all that bad, because the CSA did a lot to force his hand.

Wilson was against individual rights, via his support for Jim Crow laws, and opposition to womens suffrage. On top of that, he pretty much forced us into the global arena by supporting the First World War. An act that has lead to very anti-Libertarian treaties that we are Constitutionally bound to uphold. He's on the really bad list for Libertarian principals, and I don't believe he has many redeeming qualities as a president, or even a person to be frank.

FDR is a fun one, since he was all about big, BIGGER, and BIGGEST government. Huge bureaucrat, and the New Deal was a government spending spree, but he did pull us out of the depression, and he instituted the Indian New Deal, which was a pretty nice move towards human rights, so I can't hate the guy. He had his heart in the right place, and that was with the People. I have to give him credit for that.

I can't say anything bad about TR as a person, nor would I simply because I think he was one of the most bad ass presidents we've ever had, but his policies were not Libertarian in the least. One thing he was for, though: Women's suffrage, a Peoples right. I don't consider him to be bad at all, since his policies weren't really anti-libertarian. He just wasn't Libertarian.

LBJ wasn't too bad, either. He instituted the voters rights act, which prohibited voter discrimination, his civil rights act outlawed segregation, he vehemently went after the KKK and forced them to cut the ****, like murdering blacks, interracial couples, and civil rights activists. I can see a split on that from a Libertarian point of view, but as I see it, he was enforcing the Peoples rights to be free from tyranny imposed upon them in the south. Only big "anti-libertarian" thing I'm aware of is his Medicaid program, and the Gun Control Act of 1968.

I'm not going to address W Bush or Obama, because they're too obvious. Neither has a Libertarian bone in their body, and I don't consider either of them to be the worst.

Nixon, ole tricky Dick, another one of the bad ones. Although "New Federalism" was a good idea, it never happened. He initiated the war on drugs, he also inflicted wage and price controls, inflation still happened, which resulted in all kinds of problems. He was also a bureaucrat who enforced regulatory policies. The only thing he did right, from a Libertarian stand, was endorse the Equal Rights Amendment, and integrate blacks into schools, though, both were not without controversy, concerning his "methods". He basically half-assed it to try and salvage his approval rating.

Herbert Hoover cannot be mentioned separate of the Revenue Act of 1932. On top of that, he used military forces led by Douglass MacArthur to stamp out a protest. That protest was comprised of WWI vets demanding that they be given what was promised to them by the government. So he's at the top of the list in my book.

I also have to mention, and I'm actually surprised that you left him out, is Ronald Reagan. This guy was pretty bad, gun control, Iran-Contra affair, turning the Russo-Afghan war into yet another American proxy, war on drugs, he violated every Libertarian principal in the book, and that's why I vote other.
 
How can Lincoln be anti-Libertarian? The man single handedly ended slavery as an institution in the US. Not sure how you can argue somebody is anti-Libertarian when they removed the very antithesis to Libertarianism from the US landscape.

Because of the states rights issue. I believe, however, that he fully redeemed himself by issuing Emancipation, and ending slavery.
 
FDR is a fun one, since he was all about big, BIGGER, and BIGGEST government. Huge bureaucrat, and the New Deal was a government spending spree, but he did pull us out of the depression, and he instituted the Indian New Deal, which was a pretty nice move towards human rights, so I can't hate the guy. He had his heart in the right place, and that was with the People. I have to give him credit for that.

I don't believe he ended the Depressiom, rather he extended it. Also, he interned 40,000 Japanese Americans.

I also have to mention, and I'm actually surprised that you left him out, is Ronald Reagan. This guy was pretty bad, gun control, Iran-Contra affair, turning the Russo-Afghan war into yet another American proxy, war on drugs, he violated every Libertarian principal in the book, and that's why I vote other.

He has some problems to be sure, but his foreign policy was barely interventionist in comparison with most in the century, and he did cut taxes among other things. I don't think he qualifies among the worst, unless your main thing is drugs.
 
Then it appears that I crashed this party early. To answer the question, it's pretty tough.
I wanted to do a read through before voting because many of the choices have their abuses and it was a tough call.

Lincoln was obviously against the States right to secession, even if the people of the separatist states felt they were being harmed by the federal union. However, he did extend The Peoples rights to "negroes". I don't think he's all that bad, because the CSA did a lot to force his hand.
Lincoln was my choice. Suspension of habeas corpus was a huge overreach of his powers, but this was the last of a large string of abuses, I don't think the north's hand was "forced" any more than the south's was. Slavery was a horrid institution that needed to be ended, that said as was pointed out it was a consequence of Lincoln's war against secession, not slavery. The south had a severe contention prior to the slavery issue due to unfair tariffs of southern goods, a legitimate commerce clause gripe and especially heated due to european interests getting favorable trade rates. Lincoln's worst abuse though was making secession without violence impossible, this would set the table for the federal government to eventually centralize to it's current point, for that reason alone he is the father of government overreach.

Wilson was against individual rights, via his support for Jim Crow laws, and opposition to womens suffrage. On top of that, he pretty much forced us into the global arena by supporting the First World War. An act that has lead to very anti-Libertarian treaties that we are Constitutionally bound to uphold. He's on the really bad list for Libertarian principals, and I don't believe he has many redeeming qualities as a president, or even a person to be frank.
All that, and the institution of the permanent income tax. Nothing more anti-liberty than taking your money simply for earning it.

FDR is a fun one, since he was all about big, BIGGER, and BIGGEST government. Huge bureaucrat, and the New Deal was a government spending spree, but he did pull us out of the depression, and he instituted the Indian New Deal, which was a pretty nice move towards human rights, so I can't hate the guy. He had his heart in the right place, and that was with the People. I have to give him credit for that.
Massive anti-libertarian, largest government expansion in U.S. history up to that time, set the table for the current expansionist era.

I can't say anything bad about TR as a person, nor would I simply because I think he was one of the most bad ass presidents we've ever had, but his policies were not Libertarian in the least. One thing he was for, though: Women's suffrage, a Peoples right. I don't consider him to be bad at all, since his policies weren't really anti-libertarian. He just wasn't Libertarian.
In restrospect, a few of his stances were troubling but was an overall good president. National parks were ill advised but not that big of a deal, huge conservationist, anti-trust legislation is a 50/50.

LBJ wasn't too bad, either. He instituted the voters rights act, which prohibited voter discrimination, his civil rights act outlawed segregation, he vehemently went after the KKK and forced them to cut the ****, like murdering blacks, interracial couples, and civil rights activists. I can see a split on that from a Libertarian point of view, but as I see it, he was enforcing the Peoples rights to be free from tyranny imposed upon them in the south. Only big "anti-libertarian" thing I'm aware of is his Medicaid program, and the Gun Control Act of 1968.
Lied us into Vietnam, civil rights legislation was not done for noble purposes though the outcome was a good one, some social policies weight against all citizens for some, typical panderer. No huge losses of liberty but some programs have become rotten from within and are now huge monetary consumers, his tenure didn't do too much against liberty but the seeds are blossoming into rotten fruit.

I'm not going to address W Bush or Obama, because they're too obvious. Neither has a Libertarian bone in their body, and I don't consider either of them to be the worst.
Agreed.

Nixon, ole tricky Dick, another one of the bad ones. Although "New Federalism" was a good idea, it never happened. He initiated the war on drugs, he also inflicted wage and price controls, inflation still happened, which resulted in all kinds of problems. He was also a bureaucrat who enforced regulatory policies. The only thing he did right, from a Libertarian stand, was endorse the Equal Rights Amendment, and integrate blacks into schools, though, both were not without controversy, concerning his "methods". He basically half-assed it to try and salvage his approval rating.
Created the EPA under his tenure, unforgiveable.

Herbert Hoover cannot be mentioned separate of the Revenue Act of 1932. On top of that, he used military forces led by Douglass MacArthur to stamp out a protest. That protest was comprised of WWI vets demanding that they be given what was promised to them by the government. So he's at the top of the list in my book.
That is new to me, never heard it but troubling if true.

I also have to mention, and I'm actually surprised that you left him out, is Ronald Reagan. This guy was pretty bad, gun control, Iran-Contra affair, turning the Russo-Afghan war into yet another American proxy, war on drugs, he violated every Libertarian principal in the book, and that's why I vote other.
To be fair to Mr. Reagan's legacy, most of the gun control legislation was hidden in important bills by congress. Afghanistan was due to the cold war, I don't blame anyone for trying to embarass an enemy but it did come back to bite us in the ass later. Iran/Contra I give a break for due to the nature of the program, we were trying to safely negotiate a hostage release without violence, probably should have done things differently.
 
To be fair to Mr. Reagan's legacy, most of the gun control legislation was hidden in important bills by congress. Afghanistan was due to the cold war, I don't blame anyone for trying to embarass an enemy but it did come back to bite us in the ass later. Iran/Contra I give a break for due to the nature of the program, we were trying to safely negotiate a hostage release without violence, probably should have done things differently.

Just to make the point, in Iran/Contra, it was the Contra aspect that was the problem, not the Iran part so much. Negotiating with Iran was perfectly legal as best I understand. Giving money to terrorists in Central America after congress said no, not so legal.
 
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