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Texas secession?

Texas secession?

  • Anytime they want

    Votes: 47 54.7%

  • Bad times only

    Votes: 1 1.2%

  • No way

    Votes: 35 40.7%

  • I don't know

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Other

    Votes: 3 3.5%
  • Total voters
    86
earthworm said:
Is this the future of our "great nation" , secession ?
IMO, if it is, then so be it.....
Will we revert to be like the European nations of the middle ages ?
More than history should be taught in our schools.
Man should be taught how to get along with his fellow man.
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Which would you consider a more harmonious relationship, two independent sovereign states that are friends and allies? Or a conquering state and a subjugated state?
 
99percenter said:
No. Secession is explicitly forbidden by the constitution. We had this discussion a long time again and it's a settled issue. Secession is illegal.
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no, secession is not expressly forbidden by the Constitution... in fact, SCOTUS has ruled the a successful secession is possible through revolution or consent of the States.
(Texas V white)
 
haymarket said:
And what about benefits that are due American citizens like Social Security and Medicare?

What about US government property within Texas?
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assuming a successful secession, such things could be negotiated through treaty proceedings.... the options are only limited to what the negotiators are willing to negotiate.
 
I don't think we have to worry about this very much. Only a few far right wing nuts talk about succession. The vast, vast, vast, vast, vast vast, vast vast vast, majority of Texas would think its stupid.

Leaders of succession would have to worry about being shot more than anyone else. Lotta guns down here in Tx. LOL!
 
Isnt this akin to saying "short people should have the right to be tall"? There is no way this happens. A far more likely scenario would be California splitting up and becoming two states than any singe state attempting secession.

However for the sake of argument...(no...they wouldnt ever be allowed to secede) a better solution to your scenario would be for the fed to announce an era of responsible government, pay down the debt, massively reduce states federal tax burden, and return social services and spending to the states. Just like Texas wont ever secede, that will never happen either. So...unfortunately, until it all goes sour, Texas will have to suffer the fools just like all the rest of us.
 
Centinel said:
In any event, it simply seems wrong for 49 states to deny a 50th its independence. If the people of Texas cannot leave the compact into which they voluntarily acceded, then that would mean that Texas is not a political state at all, but merely a conquered territory of the other 49 states.
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Texas is a state, not a nation. By the laws of the Constitution, the state is under the federal government in terms of level of authority. Texas agreed to return to the union after their treasonous joining of the Confederacy.

If anything, Texas (and all the states of the southern Confederacy) should be on the record as being treasonous.

Furthermore, if the dollar crashed, are you saying it would behoove Texas to leave the union and the dollar and start their own currency? How would that help?
 
Cyrillic said:
So if you enter US you cannot go on your own. Why does US then support Kosovo?
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Because we are a hypocritical nation. The US likes to see other countries or states secede from a larger empire. But they will never allow their own states to secede from them. The only answer is 'hypocrit'.

Quantrill
 
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Centinel said:
In any event, it simply seems wrong for 49 states to deny a 50th its independence. If the people of Texas cannot leave the compact into which they voluntarily acceded, then that would mean that Texas is not a political state at all, but merely a conquered territory of the other 49 states.
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Texas and the other states of the Confederacy are part of the US due to being conquered. Its a Union by bayonet.

Quantrill
 
Centinel said:
It is telling that it is simply assumed that any movement toward self-rule will immediately met by invasion and conquest. It sort of dispels any fantasies that self-rule is a meaningful value in the minds of the American people. What we all seem to accept is "other-rule", which asserts, for instance, that the people of 49 states have some sort of divine right to rule over the 50th state. For the life of me, I just can't figure out why or how they believe this.
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It was never settled by a question of 'right' or 'legal'. It was settled by war. Might made the right. And were a state to try it again, the same thing would occur. Your free. Just don't try to leave.

Quantrill
 
Quantrill said:
It was never settled by a question of 'right' or 'legal'. It was settled by war. Might made the right. And were a state to try it again, the same thing would occur. Your free. Just don't try to leave.
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How would the union survive if every state was free to come and go when it benefits them?
 
RadicalModerate said:
How would the union survive if every state was free to come and go when it benefits them?
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A Union of 50 wouldn't. 'Union' is not synonomonous with 'paradise'.

Quantrill
 
Canell said:
Howdy,

Let's assume times get tough, the US dollar crashes or something of that magnitude. Would you mind Texas secession if they choose to?

:peace
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I tend to support the right of secession. The US has supported breakaway Russian republics and other secession efforts in other countries... so.... :shrug:

Now legally, I don't know. Certainly if 2/3rds of the States decided to end the union that would be legal, as that's how the Constitution was ratified in the first place.

Texas has a better legal position on this than most states, because it joined the country originally as an independent nation, the Lone Star Republic.

But, I really doubt this is going to happen anyway, barring some really drastic events.
 
RadicalModerate said:
Cause that's the point I was trying to make, that the current union is absolutely perfect, why would anyone want to leave?

Sheeesh. :roll:
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Its not a question of why should anyone want to leave. Its a question of can they leave. Telling me I can't leave because its good for me, doesn't sound good to me.

Quantrill
 
Goshin said:
I tend to support the right of secession. The US has supported breakaway Russian republics and other secession efforts in other countries... so.... :shrug:

Now legally, I don't know. Certainly if 2/3rds of the States decided to end the union that would be legal, as that's how the Constitution was ratified in the first place.

Texas has a better legal position on this than most states, because it joined the country originally as an independent nation, the Lone Star Republic.

But, I really doubt this is going to happen anyway, barring some really drastic events.
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Secession was not settled based on legal. It was settled by war. If it occurred again, you would see it settled by war. The US is not going to let anyone leave.

Quantrill
 
Cyrillic said:
So if you enter US you cannot go on your own. Why does US then support Kosovo?
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When the government in Washington commences with violently oppressing that nation of people that represent a minority in the US, but a majority in Texas, we'll talk.
 
rocket88 said:
When the government in Washington commences with violently oppressing that nation of people that represent a minority in the US, but a majority in Texas, we'll talk.
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one might consider naked force being utilized to keep a people within a certain jurisdiction to be oppression.
..which is the exact thing the union did pertaining to the civil war.
 
rocket88 said:
When the government in Washington commences with violently oppressing that nation of people that represent a minority in the US, but a majority in Texas, we'll talk.
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Look back at the War between the States.

Quantrill
 
Quantrill said:
Secession was not settled based on legal. It was settled by war. If it occurred again, you would see it settled by war. The US is not going to let anyone leave.

Quantrill
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war does have a habit of solving problems... nothing is more effective at deciding issues than naked force.
might not be right, might not be moral, might not be legal... but it's effective as hell.
 
Centinel said:
I see the federal government as a voluntary compact among a group of sovereign states. If any state wishes to leave, they can. The people of the other 49 states are not the owners of Texas.
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Germany is techincally a "Federation of States" many of which were independent up until the Prussians forced a unification. We should allow them to split up into a whole bunch of warring factions? Cause that sounds like a great recipe for peace to have a major nation plum in the middle of Europe.

Fine, secede. We'll be sending in troops to occupy Federal property, and the Interstate Highways we built. We'll also be confiscating your currency, as it's United States currency. Enjoy converting everybody's life savings into pesos.
 
Thrilla said:
war does have a habit of solving problems... nothing is more effective at deciding issues than naked force.
might not be right, might not be moral, might not be legal... but it's effective as hell.
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Oh yes. It's very effective.

Quantrill
 
Canell said:
Howdy,

Let's assume times get tough, the US dollar crashes or something of that magnitude. Would you mind Texas secession if they choose to?

:peace
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Lololol.. read the economic history of the last time Texas secceeded.....
 
Texas aint goin nowhere...slim pickens will have none of that :)
 
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