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Is he lying?

Your instinct ... is Zimmerman lying about what took place?

  • Total voters
    57
Caine said:
That is not Zimmerman's statement though...


And while the girlfriend claims, how does she know what Martin is doing at every moment unless he was saying. "I am now taking a step towards the rear of this house." "I am now doing this" etc.

EARwitnesses, especially on a phone no less, can't testify to MOVEMENTS. They can testify to SOUNDS. This is why her statement doesn't sit well with me.....

She claims to know that Trayvon Martin was pushed due to the sound of his phone/headset falling. She has absolutely no REAL clue the CAUSE of the phone/headset falling.

Its also why I don't trust the media, they just report it that Trayvon got pushed, without taking into account you can't tell that via a telephone.


As I have stated in another thread..... I can be on the phone with my brother and know he was at the house doing something, and as we are talking about this or that, the next thing I know he is picking his wife up from work. No clue he left the house, because you can't hear where people are.
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The fact that Martin's body was found behind the house, and the witnesses saw him on top of Zimmerman beating him behind the house pretty much confirms that he walked behind the house IMO.
 
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Muhammed said:
The fact that Martin's body was found behind the house, and the witnesses saw him on top of Zimmerman beating him behind the house pretty much confirms that he walked behind the house IMO.
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Yes. However, do we know that Martin was behind that particular row of townhouses? These are rows of townhouses with a sidewalk between them.

It still doesn't prove Zimmerman's statement that he was walking back to his vehicle false.

It also doesn't prove that Martin was found by Zimmerman at that location. Martin could have slipped through the area and to the next street or around a corner of a row of townhouses and then came up after Zimmerman, consistent with his statement.
 
Caine said:
Then you wouldn't be considered as "fearing for your life" either.
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Yes, It wasn't until I was 19 that I had someone pull a gun on me. It was after I chased him down.
The police got there in time. It was good that SYGL wasn't there. He ended up in jail for about a year.
 
Josie said:
:2brickwal

:inandout:
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Well said. lol.

It seems every time I turn on the news, something new surfaces to muddy the case for this armchair juror.
 
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lunchbox said:
Well said. lol.
It seems every time I turn on the news, something new surfaces to muddy the case for this armchair juror.
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Karl said:
More (that I haven't seen posted):
On Zimmerman's injuries, there is a police surveillance video @ ABC News of him being processed at the police station. At that point, there is no bleeding or blood evident. It would appear that any EMS treatment at the scene cleared all that up.
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It looks like Karl & Lunchbox are correct when it comes to the details. I just viewed an (the) ABC News video showing the injuries to Zimmerman's head. (I was told that he had the back of his head slammed against a concrete curbing several times.) Also I had accepted that the police released Zimmerman at the seen and had based that action on the SYGL. Now it appears that it was the states lawyers that made that decision after Zimmerman was brought in cuffed.
However, my issue is what the SYGL as written does, and in opinion most of what I've posted stands.
 
repeter said:
As to what actually happened, I think we should leave that to the polygraph machines and experts.
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There is a reason polygraph tests are not admissible in a court of law. It is because they based on junk science.
 
So far according to this non-scientific poll of some DP members, it shows:

55% think he is lying or is probably lying.
28% have no clue about if he is or isn’t yet.
And 15% think he is telling the truth.

Interesting
 
Porchev said:
So far according to this non-scientific poll of some DP members, it shows:

55% think he is lying or is probably lying.
28% have no clue about if he is or isn’t yet.
And 15% think he is telling the truth.

Interesting
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Most of your 55% is based on the emotional appeal from the Media.

Its hard to accuse someone of lying with all the physical and testimonial evidence given to us thus far supports him.
 
Caine said:
Most of your 55% is based on the emotional appeal from the Media.

Its hard to accuse someone of lying with all the physical and testimonial evidence given to us thus far supports him.
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yeah --- sure --- whatever ..... none of the "Martin doomed himself" crowd is motivated by their own preconceived biases are they?
 
Porchev said:
So far according to this non-scientific poll of some DP members, it shows:

55% think he is lying or is probably lying.
28% have no clue about if he is or isn’t yet.
And 15% think he is telling the truth.

Interesting
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But of no legal value.
What should be interesting is the statements from those at the scene (witnesses,police). We do not trust Zimmerman, I do not trust southern police, but these men will have to make court appearances and "tell the truth, ect."...The way things were in the previous century, we would never know anything and Zimmerman would walk.
Today ?
We need good non-biased investigative reporters, are there any ???
He may still pull this off, thanks to the NRA and the conservatives.
 
Caine said:
Most of your 55% is based on the emotional appeal from the Media.

Its hard to accuse someone of lying with all the physical and testimonial evidence given to us thus far supports him.
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Strange, all of what I've seen and read does NOT support this...
But, we do need an investigative reporter to find the truth...I trust not FOX, not MSNBC, not southern police...no-one ...
But Mr Martin is dead.
Why?
 
Caine said:
Most of your 55% is based on the emotional appeal from the Media.

Its hard to accuse someone of lying with all the physical and testimonial evidence given to us thus far supports him.
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It supports Zimmerman only if you ignore a lot of things.
 
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earthworm said:
But of no legal value.
What should be interesting is the statements from those at the scene (witnesses,police). We do not trust Zimmerman, I do not trust southern police, but these men will have to make court appearances and "tell the truth, ect."...The way things were in the previous century, we would never know anything and Zimmerman would walk.
Today ?
We need good non-biased investigative reporters, are there any ???
He may still pull this off, thanks to the NRA and the conservatives.
Click to expand...

I am originally from California, but I have lived in Georgia for several years and to paint all southern police as untrustworthy seems a little silly. The south is a great place and people that think otherwise are wrongly pre-judging a great and diverse part of the country.
 
Caine said:
That is not Zimmerman's statement though...


And while the girlfriend claims, how does she know what Martin is doing at every moment unless he was saying. "I am now taking a step towards the rear of this house." "I am now doing this" etc.

EARwitnesses, especially on a phone no less, can't testify to MOVEMENTS. They can testify to SOUNDS. This is why her statement doesn't sit well with me.....

She claims to know that Trayvon Martin was pushed due to the sound of his phone/headset falling. She has absolutely no REAL clue the CAUSE of the phone/headset falling.

Its also why I don't trust the media, they just report it that Trayvon got pushed, without taking into account you can't tell that via a telephone.


As I have stated in another thread..... I can be on the phone with my brother and know he was at the house doing something, and as we are talking about this or that, the next thing I know he is picking his wife up from work. No clue he left the house, because you can't hear where people are.
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Biased!
You assume that Zimmerman is telling the truth and that the girlfriend is lying.
Also it is simply not true that one cannot locate a cell phone user via the cell phone conversation , this takes smarts to do, of course, and at times is not reliable.
This case should go to a grand jury.
But I do agree that the media, both right and left wing, cannot be trusted.
Have I ever mentioned a need for reform in this area ?
 
Porchev said:
I am originally from California, but I have lived in Georgia for several years and to paint all southern police as untrustworthy seems a little silly. The south is a great place and people that think otherwise are wrongly pre-judging a great and diverse part of the country.
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I said that I do not trust southern police, I said nothing about the people!...Plus, I have followed this one man killing another story....far too many things to be suspicious of. It was not that long ago when a white could kill a black and it would be a "so-what"...People simply do not change that quickly...north or south...
Ever hear of : "one rotten apple ?"
Its "silly" for one not to know that this one rotten apple can do...Ask the Islamics....
 
haymarket said:
yeah --- sure --- whatever ..... none of the "Martin doomed himself" crowd is motivated by their own preconceived biases are they?
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Nope. As I have stated.... Zimmerman takes back his statement as a lie...... Forensics determines that Martin was actually 12 feet away when the shot occurred.....stuff like that would change my mind for sure.

Im going with the evidence.... not my "heart feelings".

I don't allow dead kids to weight on my heart so much that the person responsible for killing them must be guilty at all cost. I continue to use reason and logic.
 
earthworm said:
I said that I do not trust southern police, I said nothing about the people!...Plus, I have followed this one man killing another story....far too many things to be suspicious of. It was not that long ago when a white could kill a black and it would be a "so-what"...People simply do not change that quickly...north or south...
Ever hear of : "one rotten apple ?"
Its "silly" for one not to know that this one rotten apple can do...Ask the Islamics....
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So, you refuse to judge this situation based upon its own merits, but because back in the day some white dude (Zimmerman is hispanic) killed a black dude and nobody cared?

This is why Zimmerman is ****ed. If he gets a bunch of jurors that think so ignorantly such as this... he is screwed.
 
earthworm said:
Biased!
You assume that Zimmerman is telling the truth and that the girlfriend is lying.
Also it is simply not true that one cannot locate a cell phone user via the cell phone conversation , this takes smarts to do, of course, and at times is not reliable.
This case should go to a grand jury.
But I do agree that the media, both right and left wing, cannot be trusted.
Have I ever mentioned a need for reform in this area ?
Click to expand...

No.

I assume that Zimmerman is telling the truth, and that the girlfriend cannot possible SEE what is going on over the phone. She cannot possible know where Trayvon and George were in relation to the neighborhood. She cannot possible know who pushed who from a SOUND (or if someone even pushed another person instead of the possibility that the headset fell off while Trayvon punched Zimmerman).


So its not bias to recognize that someone on the phone can't tell where the other person is in relation to the neighborhood's design. Its just impossible.
 
Dezaad said:
Sadly, I now have started to firm up my belief that Zimmerman has been lying:

Trayvon Martin George Zimmerman 911 call analysis: Two forensic experts say it's not George Zimmerman crying out for help - Orlando Sentinel

Zimmerman has been saying he was the one calling for help. Expert analysis of the audio indicates that it was not Zimmerman. If this holds up, Zimmerman is a liar.
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Who requested the analysis?

I have hard time believing an "expert" if the "news" organization was the ones who requested it. I mean... just look at all the advertising that guy's firm got in that story......
 
I don't think any objective or intelligent person would make up their mind one way or the other at this point. There is a lot of evidence to consider and perhaps more than we are even aware of at the moment.
 
CriticalThought said:
I don't think any objective or intelligent person would make up their mind one way or the other at this point. There is a lot of evidence to consider and perhaps more than we are even aware of at the moment.
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True. However, I think any objective or intelligent person could conclude that Zimmerman's actions, based upon the 911 recording alone, indicate that he shares at least some responsibility for the death of Martin -- regardless of whether or not the SYG law lets him walk free (as it has so far).

Indeed, the investigating officer at Sanford PD thinks the same (according to mainstream news reports).
 
Caine said:
Nope. As I have stated.... Zimmerman takes back his statement as a lie...... Forensics determines that Martin was actually 12 feet away when the shot occurred.....stuff like that would change my mind for sure.

Im going with the evidence.... not my "heart feelings".

I don't allow dead kids to weight on my heart so much that the person responsible for killing them must be guilty at all cost. I continue to use reason and logic.
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Good for you on that. Sadly, that seems to be not shared by other fervent Z supporters here and elsewhere.
 
haymarket said:
Good for you on that. Sadly, that seems to be not shared by other fervent Z supporters here and elsewhere.
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Interesting you should say that, Haymarket.

I see those "fervent Z supporters" trying to make sure an innocent man doesn't get railroaded. There is no evidence, so far, that proves Zimmerman's accounting of events is a lie. None. It is the "other side of the argument folks" who are conjecturing and opining and playing scientific expert and making stuff UP about Zimmerman.

I've never seen anything like it. This is how people get lynched.
 
MaggieD said:
Interesting you should say that, Haymarket.

I see those "fervent Z supporters" trying to make sure an innocent man doesn't get railroaded. There is no evidence, so far, that proves Zimmerman's accounting of events is a lie. None. It is the "other side of the argument folks" who are conjecturing and opining and playing scientific expert and making stuff UP about Zimmerman.

I've never seen anything like it. This is how people get lynched.
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We know that Zimmerman took the life of an unarmed minor after he was advised by a professional not to approach him. While that in no way changes the legal assumption of innocence - it does warrant a thorough and complete investigation to determine if Z is telling the truth.
 
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